PFF QB RANKINGS

[leoram]

What strikes me first about it is the bottom two quarterbacks: Luck and Manning. What I like about their matrix is that it is based on performance, not ability or reputation. But what I REALLY like it is the snapshot of how a quarterback's effectiveness is directly impacted by the team around him. If anyone thinks Manning and Luck have forgotten how to play the position, they don't belong in this discussion. This is precisely what bugged me about the journey of Kurt Warner. Here was a two time MVP who was jettisoned and considered washed up in NY and AZ UNTIL the Cards fixed their OLine and had Boldin and Fitz as weapons. Then Warner suddenly remembered how to play the game again?

According to this, Foles is middle of the pack. Considering that PFF rates the Ram OLine as a bottom feeder, I'd say he's doing better than our eyes tell us sometimes.

 

[RamzFanz]

What strikes me first about it is the bottom two quarterbacks: Luck and Manning. What I like about their matrix is that it is based on performance, not ability or reputation. But what I REALLY like it is the snapshot of how a quarterback's effectiveness is directly impacted by the team around him. If anyone thinks Manning and Luck have forgotten how to play the position, they don't belong in this discussion. This is precisely what bugged me about the journey of Kurt Warner. Here was a two time MVP who was jettisoned and considered washed up in NY and AZ UNTIL the Cards fixed their OLine and had Boldin and Fitz as weapons. Then Warner suddenly remembered how to play the game again?

According to this, Foles is middle of the pack. Considering that PFF rates the Ram OLine as a bottom feeder, I'd say he's doing better than our eyes tell us sometimes.

After decades of football, I am just now learning to throw stats in the trash can. It's ALL eyeball and who they are surrounded with.

Steve Young and Warner were horrible, until they had a TEAM. MANY QBs have the same history. Foles had a season with a TEAM where he was the best QB to ever play the game for TD/INT ratio. Not OK or good or great, the best ever to play the game. EVER. It was just 2 seasons ago. He may need a sweet spot, but we knew that going in.

Let me tell you, get rid of Cook, this is a TEAM that can score points. GET RID OF COOK, and this is an O who HAS to target better players. Cook is the weakness and failure of this O. I can't even count the must catch plays he's blown. I loved talking to the dude, he's a good person, he doesn't play football. He sucks ass. He chose the wrong sport. In this sport you HIT a MF in front of you. Like TA or SB. How does he not get that?

Will they be great without Cook? They will be better for damned sure!

 

[Faceplant]

After decades of football, I am just now learning to throw stats in the trash can. It's ALL eyeball and who they are surrounded with.

Steve Young and Warner were horrible, until they had a TEAM. MANY QBs have the same history. Foles had a season with a TEAM where he was the best QB to ever play the game for TD/INT ratio. Not OK or good or great, the best ever to play the game. EVER. It was just 2 seasons ago. He may need a sweet spot, but we knew that going in.

Let me tell you, get rid of Cook, this is a TEAM that can score points. GET RID OF COOK, and this is an O who HAS to target better players. Cook is the weakness and failure of this O. I can't even count the must catch plays he's blown. I loved talking to the dude, he's a good person, he doesn't play football. He sucks ass. He chose the wrong sport. In this sport you HIT a MF in front of you. Like TA or SB. How does he not get that?

Will they be great without Cook? They will be better for damned sure!

I have been defending Cook for a while now, but I am at my wits end with the guy. He is a mistake waiting to happen. It is not a goof here or there, it is consistent, drive killing mistakes. He makes too much money to be this unreliable and unmotivated (especially in the blocking game and on routes that aren't going his way. Shame too, the dude is a match up nightmare for opposing defenses.

 

[V3]

What strikes me first about it is the bottom two quarterbacks: Luck and Manning. What I like about their matrix is that it is based on performance, not ability or reputation. But what I REALLY like it is the snapshot of how a quarterback's effectiveness is directly impacted by the team around him. If anyone thinks Manning and Luck have forgotten how to play the position, they don't belong in this discussion. This is precisely what bugged me about the journey of Kurt Warner. Here was a two time MVP who was jettisoned and considered washed up in NY and AZ UNTIL the Cards fixed their OLine and had Boldin and Fitz as weapons. Then Warner suddenly remembered how to play the game again?

According to this, Foles is middle of the pack. Considering that PFF rates the Ram OLine as a bottom feeder, I'd say he's doing better than our eyes tell us sometimes.

That's pretty much how I feel about Foles. It's hard to really say much about his performance because the O-line is one of the worst in the NFL and our WRs aren't much better. They simply don't get open consistently to the point that Foles (or and QB for that matter) can find a rhythm or trust. If they do get open, either the O-line blows it, the receiver drops the ball, there was a penalty, etc. Don't get me wrong, Foles has had his issues. But there's still way too much crap going on with the rest of the offense, including the OC, that it's hard to get a true assessment of what Foles can do.

 

[fearsomefour]

Warner did a lot of covering for that Oline as well.
Until Palmer came in....the Cardinals improved the LT position with Palmer there....the guys who followed Warner played with basically the same line and basically stunk it up.
A vet QB who can get rid of the ball quickly and find the reads can cover a lot for a suspect line.

 

[Dxmissile]

That's pretty much how I feel about Foles. It's hard to really say much about his performance because the O-line is one of the worst in the NFL and our WRs aren't much better. They simply don't get open consistently to the point that Foles (or and QB for that matter) can find a rhythm or trust. If they do get open, either the O-line blows it, the receiver drops the ball, there was a penalty, etc. Don't get me wrong, Foles has had his issues. But there's still way too much crap going on with the rest of the offense, including the OC, that it's hard to get a true assessment of what Foles can do.

I disagree our receivers can get open and when they do either the ball is underthrown to were a touch down is now a 40 yard gain or he is simply over throwing the ball and throwing it in the stands on a corner route. I don't think the wr are the problem I think he just doesn't trust the oline to pass block and Vera use of that he manufactures a lot of pressure on his own

 

[V3]

I disagree our receivers can get open and when they do either the ball is underthrown to were a touch down is now a 40 yard gain or he is simply over throwing the ball and throwing it in the stands on a corner route. I don't think the wr are the problem I think he just doesn't trust the oline to pass block and Vera use of that he manufactures a lot of pressure on his own

The few chances I get from the TV angles to see them, it sure doesn't look like they're getting open on a consistent basis. Our WRs seem to get open about as much as you'd expect from a #3, maybe a #2 from our best WR. We NEED a true #1 WR on this offense along with an O-line that can pass block.

 

[Athos]

I disagree our receivers can get open and when they do either the ball is underthrown to were a touch down is now a 40 yard gain or he is simply over throwing the ball and throwing it in the stands on a corner route. I don't think the wr are the problem I think he just doesn't trust the oline to pass block and Vera use of that he manufactures a lot of pressure on his own

You're seeing that because of the amount of play fakes Foles has to run so these WRs can get even a half yard on a DB. WRs aren't good at separating. Foles isn't good on the rare occasion they do beat their guy.

 

[12intheBox]

I'd give up the 15th ranked QB for the 31st ranked one any day - and so would every GM in the league. I'd even throw in 2 first round picks just to get the deal done.

I'd also give up 15 for #28, 27, 22, 21, 20, 19, or 18 and lets be honest - so would all of you.

 

[DenverRam]

Foles had a great season when nobody had tape on him.... so.

 

[Merlin]

We know what Foles is: a strong leader in the huddle who has a tendency to play well enough when he needs to in order to win games. He isn't an elite QB unless everything is perfect around him. I'm ok with that. We can depend on him to manage the huddle, keep guys' heads up during adversity, and lead this team to wins.

IMO Foles isn't the problem. He's good enough to win games and get into the playoffs with. Rams just gotta settle this line down, demote Cook, and ensure they have the best targets on the field for him to read and throw to. Get Quick more involved. Foles will put that ball up and give him a chance to win, he's the type of QB a guy like Quick and even Bailey will really benefit from.

 

[Prime Time]

One school of thought believes that putting together a great O-line is paramount while having a great QB is secondary.

Others believe a great QB can make a mediocre O-line look better than it is.

Many consider the Cowboys O-line to be one of the best and that any QB can win with them blocking and any RB will do well. Maybe our buddy @Rynie can explain what happened there. My guess is that he will also throw the absence of Dez Bryant into the mix.

The point is that there are a combination of factors that have to be working in order for an NFL team to be effective. Put consistent pressure on any QB and he will have problems completing passes. If the WR's aren't getting open or the running game is ineffectual, or the wrong plays are being called, or the scheme isn't the right fit for the players, then nothing will work right. Nick Foles is only partly to blame for our weak offensive efforts so far.

 

[Rainram]

Foles sure does take a lot of heat around here lately.

I'm of the mindset that I am okay with what I've seen so far (**Given the totality of the circumstances). I would like to see improvement going forward, however. Substantial improvement. And I think we will. Gotta remember this is a team sport and I'm pretty sure our WR drops and shabby OLine play has really hampered the perception many have of him.

If I simplify it...
Seahawks - Great Game
Redskins - Bad Game
Steelers - Bad Game (the Kendricks drop would have made this a better outing!)
Cardinals - Stellar Game
Packers - Awful game (there's much to be said for just about the whole offense in this one)
Browns - Average game

2 great games, an average game and 3 bad games (which were largely affected by his not-so-supportive cast). Look at those defenses...there are a lot of Top 10 Defenses in there.

Again...New offense. New Oline that is young, inconsistent and has lost one starter. No Quick for most of the season so far. WRs/TEs dropping passes.

This is not to minimize the deficiencies we all see (myself included). Getting through progressions quicker is my biggest beef. Yeah...he's missed throws...care to show me a QB who hasn't?

Nobody expected Foles to be the second coming of Rodgers. Foles realistically is a Top 15 QB (probably in the 8-12 range). He's middle of the pack now and will only improve.

Lastly, add in the type of team/offense we have. Run-first, Great Defense. The game plan this last week was for him not to turn the ball over. I gave him an 'average' for the Cleveland game, but I think he was actually above average. He did not turn the ball over. He was 15/23 for 163. 65% completion rate. 7.1 average. A rating close to 80. I know I saw a pair of drops. Those only increase those numbers. In a game where he executed our plan...FEED GURLEY.

I'm on Foles side for now. Not saying he'll be great and carry this team. But I absolutely think we can win playoff games with him at the helm...given our overall identity.

 

[ohiorams]

these stats are still pointless gibberish. Luck missed 2 games so of course he wont rank high. He and Manning will be in the playoffs.

 

[Rynie]

Our o-line has definitely taken a step back, but has improved a lot lately. The pass protection is still good, but without any of our WR'S being a threat, teams are just stacking the box. We also lost Callahan. We zone - blocked under him, and now we seem to be man-blocking, which isn't doing as well. None of this matters; our season is over, and we'll be picking in the top ten.

 

[Merlin]

What I find funny is how much defending Bradford got due to changes in coordinators/system, quality of the players around him, and injury. Foles, meanwhile, gets a lot of heat in spite of the fact that he's gone to a new system with new players, some of whom have struggled to play well around him.

Foles is a QB who brings more than his QB rating suggests. Fact is the Rams are 3-3 with him at the helm in spite of a very tough schedule. That schedule looks pretty good ahead, too. So let's wait and see how this team grows around him, that young OL, and Gurley, and what the offense becomes. It is not unthinkable that Foles will play better on a more consistent basis this season and the offense as a whole matures together.

 

[SuperMan28]

I think Rams OL is a top feeder when Gurley plays.

Foles is middle of the pack by my personal opinion as well. I really didn't feel like he was seeing the field well the entire first half. Boy that bomb to Britt was PERFECT, though. The guy has the goods. I still think it's just a matter of time. People seem to forget the Rams offense is the most freshly assembled offense in the league, IMO. Only Robinson played a significant amount of time last year for the OL, of whom is currently starting. Foles and Gurley are new and so is our OC, a first time OC at that. But I'm liking what I'm seeing when the when everybody is in sync and on the same page (when Foles is seeing the field well.) I do believe we have a very real shot to do what SEA did two years ago. They had all the talent to start with but really got hot down the stretch. They carried that momentum all the way to their first Super Bowl. That is our ceiling as long as we stay healthy.

 

[LACHAMP46]

Thread title made me scared for Foles....Lets you know stats DON'T tell the whole story sometimes...A wise man once said, or maybe it was @Alan , whatever....you can cherry pick any stat you want and come out looking the way you want to argue your point.....that being said..

Steve Young and Warner were horrible

Naw....nope....both those guys always played well when healthy...Tampa was terrible, but Young was phenomenal...

Browns - Average game

First, whats the difference between awful or bad...2nd, that Cleveland game was average in your opinion?

He and Manning will be in the playoffs.

Yep....and will probably be dangerous....Especially Denver....

I'll read the PFF rankings...but it still doesn't account for late throws...and missed reads....Hell, that one play, when he was supposed to throw hot to Quick, but Quick wasn't looking...How is it that this super leader doesn't make sure the receiver understands, I'm coming to you especially if the defender plays off (which he was)....seems simple enough...but hey, I just watch the game....Seems like there was plenty of time..on most plays...Seems like Cook is always open...And dagnabit, he was catching yesterday....but of course, most only remember the fumble....

 

[RamzFanz]

Naw....nope....both those guys always played well when healthy...Tampa was terrible, but Young was phenomenal...

If you think 11 TDs to 21 INTs is phenomenal, than we have a QB better than Steve Young! :yess:

Oh, and in the USFL he had 16 TDs to 22 INTs.

 

[RamzFanz]

but of course, most only remember the fumble

Of course. He didn't protect the ball which has been his habit since forever. It's not a one off.

I wish he were good, he's just not, and 2 catches isn't going to change that.