Jonathan Cooper

[ZigZagRam]

Interesting take. I like to hear different opinions like this even if they don't line up with mine.

 

[RaminExile]

He just got really unlucky breaking his leg. How much experience has he got now? 3 games (pre-season?) or something like that. Not that surprising he might ride the pine given he's basically a rookie coming off a terrible injury.

 

[LACHAMP46]

Liked Cooper a lot....Like a bunch of O-Linemen outta last years draft...still time for this kid...I liked him a lot better than Warmack...I liked Wartford...he's at AZ too. I liked a couple guys from V-Tech, some tackle to guard converts....we just gotta take a bunch of linemen higher, depth will improve...

 

[TGZ]

I wanted Cooper. Also was a fan of Warford.

What really pains me is taking Tavon Austin over Keenan Allen. To this day, I don't see how so many people could think Austin > Allen. That one is going to hurt for awhile.

 

[TheDYVKX]

I wanted Cooper. Also was a fan of Warford.

What really pains me is taking Tavon Austin over Keenan Allen. To this day, I don't see how so many people could think Austin > Allen. That one is going to hurt for awhile.

Allen hasn't been any better than Tavon this season. Based off last season, yeah, but Allen was also forced the ball a lot at that time. Let's let it play out first, but it takes time for WRs to develop. I wouldn't be surprised if Tavon turns out to be better than Allen.

 

[Athos]

I wanted Cooper. Also was a fan of Warford.

What really pains me is taking Tavon Austin over Keenan Allen. To this day, I don't see how so many people could think Austin > Allen. That one is going to hurt for awhile.

To be fair, I had Allen and Hopkins as the best WRs in that draft. My issue with Allen was just that injury. Knee injuries to WRs always leave me leery of drafting them. I never questioned his ability though. He was the best route runner in that draft and made shitty QBs in college look great many times.

Allen hasn't been any better than Tavon this season. Based off last season, yeah, but Allen was also forced the ball a lot at that time.

He's also played the Cardinals and Hags the 1st two games and probably drawn Sherman and Peterson both games, which has helped the Antonio Gates explosion. Provided both stay healthy, Allen will be the more productive WR by virtue of him being able to play every snap on offense.

 

[TheDYVKX]

To be fair, I had Allen and Hopkins as the best WRs in that draft. My issue with Allen was just that injury. Knee injuries to WRs always leave me leery of drafting them. I never questioned his ability though. He was the best route runner in that draft and made crappy QBs in college look great many times.



He's also played the Cardinals and Hags the 1st two games and probably drawn Sherman and Peterson both games, which has helped the Antonio Gates explosion. Provided both stay healthy, Allen will be the more productive WR by virtue of him being able to play every snap on offense.

They had Allen on the other side of Sherman a good chunk of the game. He still couldn't get it done. And yeah, Peterson did follow him a lot from what I saw. But Keenan Allen looks bad this season. I'm not saying Allen isn't the better receiver. He very well could be right now, but it's not showing at the moment. Both his play and him not being targeted at all.

 

[LACHAMP46]

I wanted Cooper. Also was a fan of Warford.

What really pains me is taking Tavon Austin over Keenan Allen. To this day, I don't see how so many people could think Austin > Allen. That one is going to hurt for awhile.

Allen hasn't been any better than Tavon this season. Based off last season, yeah, but Allen was also forced the ball a lot at that time. Let's let it play out first, but it takes time for WRs to develop. I wouldn't be surprised if Tavon turns out to be better than Allen.

Me neither

To be fair, I had Allen and Hopkins as the best WRs in that draft. My issue with Allen was just that injury. Knee injuries to WRs always leave me leery of drafting them. I never questioned his ability though. He was the best route runner in that draft and made crappy QBs in college look great many times.

He's also played the Cardinals and Hags the 1st two games and probably drawn Sherman and Peterson both games, which has helped the Antonio Gates explosion. Provided both stay healthy, Allen will be the more productive WR by virtue of him being able to play every snap on offense.

OK, I wanted Patterson (nuke aint bad either, I like a bunch of Clemson & Tenn & Oregon St. & USC wrs)...yep a whole bunch....Not the slot guy, not the slow guy from Cal who's brother pumped his stats up. Same thing Rivers did last year. Now that he's on the radar, his athleticism will hold him back. He's ok crossing, but as far a play-making ability, I just don't see it. Tavon...I could go on and on...Like his game, doubt his size and his ability to STAY HEALTHY....This is a mans league...hard for a 5'8, 170 pound guy that works underneath to stay healthy...If we were gonna get lil wr's, I wish we'd have taken those dudes from Oregon St. Wheaton or Cooks...at least they can run all the routes. Big on Lee & Woods. Wouldn't have minded Hunter...or DaRick Rodgers....but that's me.

 

[ZigZagRam]

not the slow guy from Cal who's brother pumped his stats up.

I think it was the other way around Champ. Maynard was a terrible QB.

Not sure how you can fault a guy who put up good numbers with a terrible QB.

Not gettting into the whole Tavon discussion but if you think Austin is only a slot WR, you never watched a game of his in college.

 

[Athos]

I think it was the other way around Champ. Maynard was a terrible QB.

Not sure how you can fault a guy who put up good numbers with a terrible QB.

Not gettting into the whole Tavon discussion but if you think Austin is only a slot WR, you never watched a game of his in college.

Yea. I don't know what games he was watching. Maynard was an absolutely horrid QB. Inaccurate as hell. Allen routinely had to made circus catches to haul it in.

Don't get the athletic claim either. Allen has great wiggle, is quick, has length, etc. And as far as I've aware this year, he's been suffering from a groin injury.

 

[ZigZagRam]

It's also comical to basically insult a guy that put up great numbers in college, and very good numbers in his rookie season.

You would think at some point, even the most stubborn person would have to admit that Keenan Allen is a pretty damn good receiver.

 

[LACHAMP46]

Not gettting into the whole Tavon discussion but if you think Austin is only a slot WR, you never watched a game of his in college.

I saw a couple college games....I also read 70% of his reception were within 5 yards ( or maybe 10) of the LOS. That's not a wr, that runs routes, IMO.

Yea. I don't know what games he was watching. Maynard was an absolutely horrid QB. Inaccurate as hell. Allen routinely had to made circus catches to haul it in.

Don't get the athletic claim either. Allen has great wiggle, is quick, has length, etc. And as far as I've aware this year, he's been suffering from a groin injury.

I'm a big PAC-12 guy. Seen a bunch of Cal games. He was another guy who caught a bunch of balls very close to the LOS. If you don't believe your half-brother would feed you the rock to pump your stats, I don't know what to say. He started at a major college, was he an elite QB, no. But terrible, hardly. I saw that same Cal team battle an SEC team on the road...Think it was LSU in 2012. And say what you will, we were looking for, supposedly, a number 1 wr....Not a possession guy, not a slot guy (if he's NOT a slot guy, why does he always play there?), but a #1 wr type (Dez, Julio, AJ) physical freak type, throw it up and get outta his way type. He seems to be ok, but so did that guy we had that went to Dallas, who is outta the league now...

It's also comical to basically insult a guy that put up great numbers in college, and very good numbers in his rookie season.
You would think at some point, even the most stubborn person would have to admit that Keenan Allen is a pretty damn good receiver.

I give credit were credit is due. If he does anything close to what he put up last year, I'll agree that Keenan is more than what I believe him to be, an avg. wr that can easily be taken outta the game in bump/press coverage.

 

[ZigZagRam]

I saw a couple college games....I also read 70% of his reception were within 5 yards ( or maybe 10) of the LOS. That's not a wr, that runs routes, IMO.

In his final year, Cordarelle Patterson caught 65% of his balls within 10 yards of the line of scrimmage. I suppose that makes him a "slot receiver" as well then by your definition.

Tavon also caught more balls for 20+ yards than Cordarelle Patterson. What are we supposed to take from that?

 

[ReddingRam]

I wanted Cooper. Also was a fan of Warford.

What really pains me is taking Tavon Austin over Keenan Allen. To this day, I don't see how so many people could think Austin > Allen. That one is going to hurt for awhile.

I agree and for two reasons that to me, both were tied together on Draft day. 1) his size. Wasn't as much about his height as much as it was his overall frame. I was afraid that he wouldn't hold up in the NFL doing the things he was most great at in college ... which leads to 2) .. he was and is still more of a "gimmick player" than he is a WR. In collge, most of his damage was done with end arounds, running out of the back field and WR screens. He was never a pure WR. And trading up like we did to take him kinda bothered me, because you don't draft a gimmick guy like that.

Now that said ... he is still young in his career but he better be able to 1) put on some more muscle mass and 2) become more involved in the passing game .. .other than smoke screens, tunnel screens, etc. otherwise, IMHO, we over drafted him.

 

[ReddingRam]

In his final year, Cordarelle Patterson caught 65% of his balls within 10 yards of the line of scrimmage. I suppose that makes him a "slot receiver" as well then by your definition.

Tavon also caught more balls for 20+ yards than Cordarelle Patterson. What are we supposed to take from that?

Tavon caught more balls and made people miss .... and had the YAC .. He ain't making them miss in the NFL.

 

[ZigZagRam]

Tavon caught more balls and made people miss .... and had the YAC .. He ain't making them miss in the NFL.

Welp, may as well close the book on him.

 

[LACHAMP46]

In his final year, Cordarelle Patterson caught 65% of his balls within 10 yards of the line of scrimmage. I suppose that makes him a "slot receiver" as well then by your definition.

Tavon also caught more balls for 20+ yards than Cordarelle Patterson. What are we supposed to take from that?

Yes, he is primarily a slot wr at this point also....But his measureables say he can develop into an outside the numbers receiver also...while Tavon measureables say he'll probably be better served in the slot. The point being, neither is a true #1 at the time they were drafted, but due to size-speed-weight & experience ( the least experienced player has more to learn but also more room to grow) Patterson probably will develop into a better overall offensive player. The 20+ yards catches? I'd guess, the Big-12 defenses had a hand in that.

 

[ReddingRam]

Welp, may as well close the book on him.

I'm just sayin ... the play we are seeing don't lie. Can't backup anything about what he is/might be in the NFL with what he did in college. Right now .. .he ia a gimmick player and occasional big play guy. I would love to say he is more .. .but until I actually see it from him on the field ... I go with my eyes. Is it him or coaching? None of us really know that answer for sure.

 

[TGZ]

I hate the "slow" argument. It was a terrible argument then and now. I'm so tired of seeing people fall in love with 40 times. (not that anyone here in particular is, just speaking in general)

You know who else is a "slow" WR? Anquan Boldin. Give me the route runner over the burner every single time.

 

[ShaneFalco]

It's also comical to basically insult a guy that put up great numbers in college, and very good numbers in his rookie season.

You would think at some point, even the most stubborn person would have to admit that Keenan Allen is a pretty damn good receiver.

yea he also has phillip rivers throwing him the ball. While Rams dont.

Tavon goes to any other team, he would be killing it right now.

I remember people saying Danario would never pan out. Looks like he panned out fine in SD.