Chiefs preached “Kill the head and the body will die,” too

[Stranger]

Posted by Michael David Smith on July 13, 2012, 3:15 PM EDT
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... /#comments

Among the many incendiary statements that former Saints defensive coordinator Gregg Williams used to fire up his players was, “Kill the head and the body will die.” There’s been a great deal of debate about what Williams meant when he talked about killing the head, but there’s no doubt about this: He wasn’t the only one in the NFL who used that phrase.

In fact, players walking into the Kansas City Chiefs’ defensive line room in 2008 were greeted with that slogan painted in huge letters: “KILL THE HEAD & THE BODY WILL DIE.”

The phrase was shown on the 2008 NFL Films production Hey Rookie, Welcome to the NFL, which aired on NFL Network today. (The image here is a picture I took of my TV.) Herm Edwards was the Chiefs’ head coach at the time, Gunther Cunningham was the defensive coordinator and Tim Krumrie was the defensive line coach. It’s not clear who painted the slogan or which members of the coaching staff endorsed it, but it is clear that the phrase was something the Chiefs wanted all of their defensive linemen to see.

After audio emerged of Williams saying before the playoff game against the 49ers that he wanted his players to “Make sure we kill Frank Gore’s head,” many people were shocked at what they heard, while some former players said it was par for the course in the NFL. In the Chiefs’ defensive line meeting room, “Kill the head & the body will die” was the first thing every player saw, every time he walked in.

 

[Stranger]

Re: Chiefs preached “Kill the head and the body will die,” t

Can't wait to find out where the Chiefs fall in this AEI study, published by the LA Times

The Saints ain't sinners
http://www.aei.org/article/economics/th ... t-sinners/

 

[-X-]

Re: Chiefs preached “Kill the head and the body will die,” t

I think this is all getting distorted now and it shouldn't be. It's a very simple case that's being turned into something else entirely. The bounty environment the Saints' players and hierarchy are accused of cultivating is MAINLY attributed to non-contract rewards. That's the portion of the CBA they violated once, were told to stop violating, and continued to violate with no apparent fear of reprisal.

The injuries aspect of this case is just an ancillary distraction, IMO. This all started with that audio taken in the Saints locker room, and before that, there was little mention of trying to hurt other players. The entire investigation was focused on their willful disregard of the league's warning to stop paying out non-contract bonuses. Be them for "cart-offs" or pinning a team inside their own 20, PAYING money to players in addition to what they already make via contract is a violation of the CBA. It's just that since that audio, the focus has shifted to making "paying for injuries" the primary offense. And it's not.

 

[bluecoconuts]

Re: Chiefs preached “Kill the head and the body will die,” t

I think this is all getting distorted now and it shouldn't be. It's a very simple case that's being turned into something else entirely. The bounty environment the Saints' players and hierarchy are accused of cultivating is MAINLY attributed to non-contract rewards. That's the portion of the CBA they violated once, were told to stop violating, and continued to violate with no apparent fear of reprisal.

The injuries aspect of this case is just an ancillary distraction, IMO. This all started with that audio taken in the Saints locker room, and before that, there was little mention of trying to hurt other players. The entire investigation was focused on their willful disregard of the league's warning to stop paying out non-contract bonuses. Be them for "cart-offs" or pinning a team inside their own 20, PAYING money to players in addition to what they already make via contract is a violation of the CBA. It's just that since that audio, the focus has shifted to making "paying for injuries" the primary offense. And it's not.

lus1:

 

[Ram Quixote]

Re: Chiefs preached “Kill the head and the body will die,” t

I think this is all getting distorted now and it shouldn't be. It's a very simple case that's being turned into something else entirely. The bounty environment the Saints' players and hierarchy are accused of cultivating is MAINLY attributed to non-contract rewards. That's the portion of the CBA they violated once, were told to stop violating, and continued to violate with no apparent fear of reprisal.

The injuries aspect of this case is just an ancillary distraction, IMO. This all started with that audio taken in the Saints locker room, and before that, there was little mention of trying to hurt other players. The entire investigation was focused on their willful disregard of the league's warning to stop paying out non-contract bonuses. Be them for "cart-offs" or pinning a team inside their own 20, PAYING money to players in addition to what they already make via contract is a violation of the CBA. It's just that since that audio, the focus has shifted to making "paying for injuries" the primary offense. And it's not.

I agree mostly with what you're saying here (there was quite a bit of talk about bounties on QBs Warner and Favre when Bountygate first broke. The locker room audio popped up a month or 2 later), but there's also the public perception of the Saints, fostered by the NFL's investigation, targeting opposing players for injury. I find it difficult to accept Vilma's 1-year suspension if all it's about is pay for play.

Williams and Payton certainly deserve their suspensions as key figures in the creation and continuance of the bounty program. But a player? For a whole year? Goodell appears to be using the cart-off stuff as justification.

 

[-X-]

Re: Chiefs preached “Kill the head and the body will die,” t

I think this is all getting distorted now and it shouldn't be. It's a very simple case that's being turned into something else entirely. The bounty environment the Saints' players and hierarchy are accused of cultivating is MAINLY attributed to non-contract rewards. That's the portion of the CBA they violated once, were told to stop violating, and continued to violate with no apparent fear of reprisal.

The injuries aspect of this case is just an ancillary distraction, IMO. This all started with that audio taken in the Saints locker room, and before that, there was little mention of trying to hurt other players. The entire investigation was focused on their willful disregard of the league's warning to stop paying out non-contract bonuses. Be them for "cart-offs" or pinning a team inside their own 20, PAYING money to players in addition to what they already make via contract is a violation of the CBA. It's just that since that audio, the focus has shifted to making "paying for injuries" the primary offense. And it's not.

I agree mostly with what you're saying here (there was quite a bit of talk about bounties on QBs Warner and Favre when Bountygate first broke. The locker room audio popped up a month or 2 later), but there's also the public perception of the Saints, fostered by the NFL's investigation, targeting opposing players for injury. I find it difficult to accept Vilma's 1-year suspension if all it's about is pay for play.

Williams and Payton certainly deserve their suspensions as key figures in the creation and continuance of the bounty program. But a player? For a whole year? Goodell appears to be using the cart-off stuff as justification.

Yeah, I think the player safety aspect of this thing is where Goodell has free rein. He already killed the head (Williams) on this whole 'targeting players' scandal, and now the body is dying (that kind of culture). Vilma and others who were a part of that have to (HAVE TO) pay the price as a warning to others who have been, are, or might consider, doing the same thing in the future.

Too much power? Perhaps. Is he using it responsibly though? In my opinion ... yes.

 

[Stranger]

Re: Chiefs preached “Kill the head and the body will die,” t

I think this is all getting distorted now and it shouldn't be. It's a very simple case that's being turned into something else entirely. The bounty environment the Saints' players and hierarchy are accused of cultivating is MAINLY attributed to non-contract rewards. That's the portion of the CBA they violated once, were told to stop violating, and continued to violate with no apparent fear of reprisal.

The injuries aspect of this case is just an ancillary distraction, IMO. This all started with that audio taken in the Saints locker room, and before that, there was little mention of trying to hurt other players. The entire investigation was focused on their willful disregard of the league's warning to stop paying out non-contract bonuses. Be them for "cart-offs" or pinning a team inside their own 20, PAYING money to players in addition to what they already make via contract is a violation of the CBA. It's just that since that audio, the focus has shifted to making "paying for injuries" the primary offense. And it's not.

I agree mostly with what you're saying here (there was quite a bit of talk about bounties on QBs Warner and Favre when Bountygate first broke. The locker room audio popped up a month or 2 later), but there's also the public perception of the Saints, fostered by the NFL's investigation, targeting opposing players for injury. I find it difficult to accept Vilma's 1-year suspension if all it's about is pay for play.

Williams and Payton certainly deserve their suspensions as key figures in the creation and continuance of the bounty program. But a player? For a whole year? Goodell appears to be using the cart-off stuff as justification.

Yes ... Yes... Yes.... and that's ONLY if Vilma et al players are actually guilty of Pay for Play. I know many have made up their mind on this, but I still want to see the investigations & court room drama play out before I make up my mind on that part of the story.