Can Shelley Smith in 2013 be our 2012 Robert Turner?

[BonifayRam]

About this time last yr a new OL'er arrived at a cost of $700,000 for 1 yr service with Shotty ...Robert Turner and proved to be a very good 7th OL'er back up (interior) on the Rams 53 player roster. The 28 yr old Turner was known for short plug in OL play @ center OLG & playing ORT on special teams. Turner had never came close to winning a starting position anywhere on the OL. He started all 16 Ram games. Turner is no longer here.

Shelley Smith is a Ram signed & under contract for $525,000 for a few seasons is known to us now after his pick up a few weeks after the 2012 season started. Smith was a well known OLG in college and was drafted & selected by the Texans in 2010. He had a long term ankle injury that immediately slowed his career. Smith had 31 starts @ LEFT OG in college. Smith as in fact was among the quickest (5.03-second 40, 1.74 10-yard split) and strongest (26 reps) guards at the combine in 2010. In 2012 Shelley played in 11 games. Shelley Smith proved to be able to swing & start @ both sides of the OL & play well & start in 6 games.

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/historical/557128" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/play ... cal/557128</a>

Of the current Rams OL'ers on our roster excluding Dahl, Saffold & Wells :
Brandon Washington 6-3 320/24-1
Rok Watkins 6-3 330/23-2
Joe Barksdale 6-4 320/25-3
Ty Nsekhe 6-8 325/27-2
Shelley Smith 6-3 297/25-3

It appears that only Shelley Smith could fill the role that Turner filled in 2012. I heard early last yr that Smith was also getting some reps @ center before he became a starter & before the signing of center Tim Barnes who is a ERFA. After 3 (2010-2011-2012)Texan Training Camps & Pre-Seasons, Smith will get his first camp with Paul Boudreau.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this matter?

 

[DR RAM]

I don't think our offensive line is as bad as people think in terms of depth. I think Rok will probably start this year if he had a good off season. I wouldn't mind a future starter, or more depth at OT, but I think Barksdale may have a future at one of the spots.

 

[fearsomefour]

Smith had some good hype around him when he came out, as did Barksdale. Barksdale was drafted in the 3rd round and was considered a good value there....I dont know where Smith was drafted. The NFL is full of talented guys that get slowed by injury or bad coaching, numbers games or all three.

Could Smith develop into a good versatile depth guy like Turner? Sure, dont see why not. I think Barksdale showed enough in his limited time last year to come back. Even Wayne Hunter wasnt terrible for stretches, although his salary makes him tough to keep. Im not sold on Rok at all....didnt see much and what we did see he didnt look good. I understand its a big step up from college, but, if you not even motivated enough to show up to came in decent shape, really makes me question the guys motivation and character. But, maybe the injury is a blessing in that it allowed him to adjust (mentally) to the pro game.

If we can bring Turner back having Turner, Smith and Barksdale for Oline depth would be great.

 

[BonifayRam]

Its been purposed by posters that former Ram OL'er Robert Turner be purchased for 2013 & beyond. I would like to address this in full detail. I would like to present an argument against this specific matter. I suggest using the precious few available cap millions elsewhere & here is my argument.

Its my belief that the 29 yr old Robert Turner strongly desires a chance at a starting position in the NFL. He knows he is in his prime as an OL’er. He is coming off his first season where he was a starter. He proved to be a very healthy sturdy dependable interior OL’er for 16 games. No other Ram OL’er top that but now UFA OL’er Richardson who did that too. The rest of the starters missed mega games. IMO the position that Turner is best suited for to start is @ Center. His play there should get him a good raise in pay & a much longer contract than he got with the Rams. Do we need to pay for a starting center when we already paying heavy for one? Rams have other much less costly options for a back up center.

IMO Robert Turner’s play @ Left OG was unimpressive when compared with his performance @ OC. In fact When Turner returned back to OLG post he continued to make offensive line calls for Scott Wells as Wells tried to learn in practice the Ram system & as Wells struggled on a inflamed injured knee (Same knee that Wells had surgery on in the spring of 2012 and the same knee he had a second surgery on a month ago & is rehabbing presently). Well’ s missed all of TC & all but one pre-season game where he played just a little over one quarter. He then was injured in the first quarter of the first game and was out till late November. Back to Turner so Turner was inserted into the OLG starting post NOT because Shelley Smith was not effective or on par with Turner but it was Turner’s needed assistance to Wells that mandated his insertion as a starter. It could also be said too was the fact he was named starter @ the beginning of the season.

IMO the younger Shelley Smith was much better on the move in run blocking and a lot better in pass protection even less mistake prone, not bad for a player who had never been active for an NFL game! I also would like to add that Turner was paired with Saffold on the left side where Shelley Smith played with back ups Joe Barksdale & Wayne Hunter during his four starts @ OLG. That’s a fact yet to be discussed here. Having a healthy Rodger Saffold fired up a few feet from your left is a serious upgrade of help! Would you agree on that.

So IMO Shelley Smith had a a good successful 2012 season even WITHOUT the instruction & direction of a training camp or pre-season with Paul Boudreau. So I hope I have painted a good picture of what I saw ongoing in that Ram OL in 2012 with Robert Turner.

I posted a question earlier this week on both Turner & Smith. What options do I suggest ? Rams have two current OL’ers presently we can look at. I mentioned above the Snead & Fisher catch of Shelley Smith. Smith proved to be able to play well at starting at both OG positions. I also brought this up that Fisher & Boudreau had gave reps to Smith @ center in practice when Wells came up broken & before they got around to bringing up Center Tim Barnes from two Ram seasons on the practice squad. Smith comes into this season with more starts under his belt than Turner had when he arrived to be the 7th OL’er on the Rams roster in 2012. Smith is four yrs younger than Turner. Do you believe that Shelley should improve with his first full TC & PS with Boudreau?

The other option is Tim Barnes who was active on the Ram roster for 15 Ram games. Rams own this ERFA center. I see no reason why Barnes can not fill the same role this season as in 2012 can be had for $325,000 about a 1/3 of a mil cost on top of the cap.

If I was going to offer any former or soon to be former Ram OL'er several million to sign it would be last yrs 6th OL'er Swing OT Wayne Hunter! Seems to me having Dahl, Watkins, Washington & Smith already here as interior OL'ers why burn cap millions on Turner? Can any Rams ON DEMAND'er justify the cap hit cost of resigning Robert Turner when the Rams have these two above 7th (Smith OG ) & 8th (Barnes OC OL'ers already on the roster?

 

[fearsomefour]

The best justification would be as a backup C. They are not easy to come by and Barnes has not played at all or proven anything. I agree about Turner not being fantastic at G and him being more effective at C. He has proven his value as a depth swing guy. Washington, Rok, Barnes havent even logged meaningful quarters. Its the same reason I dont have much faith in Pead at this point, worse than not being a benefit he had a major negative impact when he was on the field last year. Would I pay Turner a lot? No. I suspect he will get a nice raise to start at C somewhere. The best case to me would be keeping Turner as that swing guy and having Smith compete for a starting LG spot last year. But, it is going to be tough to have a guy who started 16 games come back knowing he is viewed as a backup.

 

[CGI_Ram]

Smith had some good hype around him when he came out, as did Barksdale. Barksdale was drafted in the 3rd round and was considered a good value there....I dont know where Smith was drafted. The NFL is full of talented guys that get slowed by injury or bad coaching, numbers games or all three.

Could Smith develop into a good versatile depth guy like Turner? Sure, dont see why not. I think Barksdale showed enough in his limited time last year to come back. Even Wayne Hunter wasnt terrible for stretches, although his salary makes him tough to keep. Im not sold on Rok at all....didnt see much and what we did see he didnt look good. I understand its a big step up from college, but, if you not even motivated enough to show up to came in decent shape, really makes me question the guys motivation and character. But, maybe the injury is a blessing in that it allowed him to adjust (mentally) to the pro game.

If we can bring Turner back having Turner, Smith and Barksdale for Oline depth would be great.

I like Barksdale and Smith too, based on what we saw. Rok looked over-matched... but he was a rookie and we didn't get much of a look.

I also agree with Bonifay; I'm not sure I'd break the bank on Turner. Nice swingman, but the oline was a lot better when he moved out of center - which is where he is supposed to bring value.

So without Turner, we need someone to backup Wells.

 

[den-the-coach]

IMO I was more impressed with Smith at LG than at RG and in fact felt Chris Williams played better than Smith. Smith needs to get stronger because he's a tad light for one on one blocking, howevere, when moving that is a strength I also felt he could improve in pass blocking.

Overall I like guards bigger I guess I'm still getting over the Jacob Bell era. Turner was an asset because he knew the system and when he and Wells played they both made line calls. I like Smith for depth, but I'm hoping Rokevious Watkins & Brandon Washington make an impression...Size does matter.

 

[BonifayRam]

IMO I was more impressed with Smith at LG than at RG and in fact felt Chris Williams played better than Smith. Smith needs to get stronger because he's a tad light for one on one blocking, howevere, when moving that is a strength I also felt he could improve in pass blocking.

Overall I like guards bigger I guess I'm still getting over the Jacob Bell era. Turner was an asset because he knew the system and when he and Wells played they both made line calls. I like Smith for depth, but I'm hoping Rokevious Watkins & Brandon Washington make an impression...Size does matter.

Yes den so was I Shelley just looks the part of a left side OG to me too. Its not that he did real bad other than a few 5 yrders pents but Chris Williams being over 320 pounds really turned it on he was acting out a bit was doing a Cortland Finnegan intimation on those DL'ers. Chris Williams also showed off some second teir speed that we had not seen @ ORG in a long long time (Sorry Harvey). den do you notice that Shelley Smith had put on some amounts of pounds since we saw him @ OLG? I thought that since Turner sent Shelley to the bench when Wells returned that in that period of time Shelley got heavier and maybe slower too. Shelley looks to be primary a OLG secondary center & third ORG. I suggested that he could be the younger version of Robert Turner a better bargain price current Ram.

I would not be surprised if Chris Williams if unable to find any takers early in free agency for him to get a third try @ OT...not going to happen later if he came to the Rams as a bottom lower tier 5th yr vet priced ORG replacement for the sacrificed Harvey Dahl he could snag it ...if Snead & Fisher do not address the right side OL in the draft.

 

[den-the-coach]

I would not be surprised if Chris Williams if unable to find any takers early in free agency for him to get a third try @ OT...not going to happen later if he came to the Rams as a bottom lower tier 5th yr vet priced ORG replacement for the sacrificed Harvey Dahl he could snag it ...if Snead & Fisher do not address the right side OL in the draft.

I would be shocked if the Rams did not make two early draft choices for the OL, however, they need playmakers too so Fisher & Snead could go in several directions. Overally I think Smith is excellent depth and could become a starter with another year in the system, but IMO the back-up center could be had with a later pick unless the Rams really believe in Tim Barnes.

 

[-X-]

I would not be surprised if Chris Williams if unable to find any takers early in free agency for him to get a third try @ OT...not going to happen later if he came to the Rams as a bottom lower tier 5th yr vet priced ORG replacement for the sacrificed Harvey Dahl he could snag it ...if Snead & Fisher do not address the right side OL in the draft.

I would be shocked if the Rams did not make two early draft choices for the OL, however, they need playmakers too so Fisher & Snead could go in several directions. Overally I think Smith is excellent depth and could become a starter with another year in the system, but IMO the back-up center could be had with a later pick unless the Rams really believe in Tim Barnes.

I would be shocked too, given his draft history and his reliance upon Boudreau to field a competitive line with whomever he supplies him. But it's not unconventional in the sense that the 49ers did it and it worked out REALLY well for them.

Would it bother me? Absolutely not. As I mentioned in another thread, I wouldn't be upset by anything they chose to do with their first two picks. Mainly because they're in position to shore up needs no matter how they address it. Within reason, of course. I'd be a little annoyed if they went DT/DE with those picks, but it would also make sense.

Look at the scenarios.

1. Draft OT and OG: Line has instant cred and Bradford can now begin to do his thing. We also have depth.
2. Austin and Vaccarro. Boom. THREE positions filled with two picks (returner, wr, safety)
3. TE and any combination. Improved passing game, and fills a need elsewhere

There are a lot more combinations, but it's too early to type them all out. :lol: