Who's gonna fall, who does the media get wrong again?

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WestCoastRam

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Every year, there are a few guys that the media (ESPN, NFL) tout up to the draft and these guys just drop like a rock. Who do you think that will be this year?

Who were some guys you remember falling? Some seemed to be deals like Bridgewater... others like Burfict make sense when reviewed again... then there are guys like Lamaar Woodley who just weren't top 10 guys no matter how much ESPN and NFL Net promoted them.
 

Memento

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Aaron Rodgers. Bridgewater. Earl Thomas was another one. Dez Bryant. Justin Houston.

I'm picking Gregory to fall like a stone this year. He might not go second round with all of the stupid decisions he's making and his well-documented laziness on and off the field. Not nearly as talented as Houston was either. Personally, I wouldn't even pick him up as a UDFA.
 

WestCoastRam

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Wasn't there a Michigan or Michigan St. linebacker a couple years ago that was suggested to go late 1st or early 2nd and didn't even get drafted. Think he ended up undrafted with Arizona and washed out before the season started...
 

Athos

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Gregory falls like a rock imo. I don't think he's nearly has good as the talking heads make him out to be.

I think Gurley COULD drop out of the 1st, if only because of the knee. Although, who knows. Might be a less position needy team that can afford to bring him along slowly.

Mariota will drop.

Ray likely won't go 10 top then. And Waynes shouldn't be a top 10.
 

jjab360

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I might be off here, but I think Leonard Williams could fall to the 5-9 range. There just isn't much demand for 3/5 techs who aren't elite pass rushers.

Gregory is an obvious one, too.
 

Memento

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I might be off here, but I think Leonard Williams could fall to the 5-9 range. There just isn't much demand for 3/5 techs who aren't elite pass rushers.

Gregory is an obvious one, too.

If Williams falls past five, then I would fucking trade up for him in a nanosecond.

And why do you not consider Leonard Williams an elite pass-rusher? He's a better run-stopper for sure, but hey, he's just twenty years old and still developing an advanced arsenal. Let's make some comparisons:

J.J. Watt had 11.5 career sacks in two years as a defensive lineman; Williams had eight in his freshman year alone as a defensive tackle and picked up six and seven in his sophomore/junior years - all while giving top ranked tackles, guards, and centers absolute fits. Watt and Williams have the exact same amount of tackles for a loss. Williams had as many forced fumbles (three) in his junior year as Watt had in his career. He had more total tackles in his freshman season (sixty-four) than Watt had in any of his two seasons.

Comparing him to Gerald McCoy as well. McCoy's best year had 6.5 sacks as a sophomore. He has the same amount of forced fumbles in his career (two) as Williams did in his sophomore year. Williams had the same amount of total tackles in his freshman year (where he primarily played defensive tackle) as McCoy did in his sophomore and junior seasons combined.

Now comparing him to Ndamukong Suh, who himself was compared to Richard Seymour as a 3-4 end. Suh wins in the pass-rushing, no doubt. He's an overall better player. Williams still has just as many forced fumbles in his junior year than Suh had in his career. Suh wins in height and length. But Suh was awful until his junior year. Williams' freshman season had more sacks and more tackles for a loss than Suh did in his freshman and two sophomore seasons combined. Williams also had more solo tackles in his junior year than Suh had in his own.

Comparing to Kevin Williams now. Leonard has more sacks, total tackles, and tackles for a loss than Kevin had in his entire career. I'd show more, but there's not a lot out there on college stats for KW.

He's the best I've seen on film since Julius Peppers, and Peppers was twenty-two when he came out as a junior.

Is he going to absolutely light the world on fire? I don't know. But he has just as good of a shot as the guys I mentioned.

But no way he falls past three; the Jaguars would immediately scoop him up if he fell to them. Their defensive tackles aren't much to write home about, and they run a 4-3. Tennesee runs a 3-4; why wouldn't they pick a twenty-year-old who played better than Watt and McCoy did in college?
 

jjab360

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If Williams falls past five, then I would freaking trade up for him in a nanosecond.

And why do you not consider Leonard Williams an elite pass-rusher? He's a better run-stopper for sure, but hey, he's just twenty years old and still developing an advanced arsenal. Let's make some comparisons:

J.J. Watt had 11.5 career sacks in two years as a defensive lineman; Williams had eight in his freshman year alone as a defensive tackle and picked up six and seven in his sophomore/junior years - all while giving top ranked tackles, guards, and centers absolute fits. Watt and Williams have the exact same amount of tackles for a loss. Williams had as many forced fumbles (three) in his junior year as Watt had in his career. He had more total tackles in his freshman season (sixty-four) than Watt had in any of his two seasons.

Comparing him to Gerald McCoy as well. McCoy's best year had 6.5 sacks as a sophomore. He has the same amount of forced fumbles in his career (two) as Williams did in his sophomore year. Williams had the same amount of total tackles in his freshman year (where he primarily played defensive tackle) as McCoy did in his sophomore and junior seasons combined.

Now comparing him to Ndamukong Suh, who himself was compared to Richard Seymour as a 3-4 end. Suh wins in the pass-rushing, no doubt. He's an overall better player. Williams still has just as many forced fumbles in his junior year than Suh had in his career. Suh wins in height and length. But Suh was awful until his junior year. Williams' freshman season had more sacks and more tackles for a loss than Suh did in his freshman and two sophomore seasons combined. Williams also had more solo tackles in his junior year than Suh had in his own.

Comparing to Kevin Williams now. Leonard has more sacks, total tackles, and tackles for a loss than Kevin had in his entire career. I'd show more, but there's not a lot out there on college stats for KW.

He's the best I've seen on film since Julius Peppers, and Peppers was twenty-two when he came out as a junior.

Is he going to absolutely light the world on fire? I don't know. But he has just as good of a shot as the guys I mentioned.

But no way he falls past three; the Jaguars would immediately scoop him up if he fell to them. Their defensive tackles aren't much to write home about, and they run a 4-3. Tennesee runs a 3-4; why wouldn't they pick a twenty-year-old who played better than Watt and McCoy did in college?
Except I didn't say anything about statistics.. Williams just isn't an elite pass rusher, he's more of a read and react DT who gets a lot of clean up sacks because of his power and length. He doesn't create or penetrate on a regular basis like the guys you listed.
 

Memento

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Except I didn't say anything about statistics.. Williams just isn't an elite pass rusher, he's more of a read and react DT who gets a lot of clean up sacks because of his power and length. He doesn't create or penetrate on a regular basis like the guys you listed.

Except he's gotten sacks at every position on the defensive line, and he's shown the ability to penetrate. Not on a regular basis yet, but that's going to come.

And he's already a more elite run-stopper than everyone on that list except for J.J. Watt. And again, he's just twenty. Not even a grown adult yet. Imagine what Waufle could do with him.
 

jjab360

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Except he's gotten sacks at every position on the defensive line, and he's shown the ability to penetrate. Not on a regular basis yet, but that's going to come.

And he's already a more elite run-stopper than everyone on that list except for J.J. Watt. And again, he's just twenty. Not even a grown adult yet. Imagine what Waufle could do with him.
You keep repeating that but just because a player's young doesn't guarantee they're going to keep getting better. If that was the case, 19 year old Amobi Okoye should've been a superstar.
 

Mr. Walker

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For me its Scherff. I like Collins, Peat and Clemmings over him. But he still probably goes top 15, so not sure if you'd consider that a drop.
 

Memento

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You keep repeating that but just because a player's young doesn't guarantee they're going to keep getting better. If that was the case, 19 year old Amobi Okoye should've been a superstar.

Okoye wasn't anywhere close to Big Cat's level. Plus Okoye was completely unpolished when he came out; Williams already has polish to his game.