The rise of Shanny

[Flint]

After a so-so start in SF Shanahan has found himself on top of the league with an undefeated record in the first 8 games, but what I don’t get is how this has affected perception of McVay. I’ve heard several times that maybe Shanny is the real genius in the nfc west, which I found curious. Why does Shanny’s success diminish McVay ? Shanahan had injury issues his first couple years now it’s all coming together. McVay had unusual health now there are real injury problems.
Strength of schedule is an underrated part of playoff success, many times the teams that end up in the playoffs have had the easiest road to get there but I think there’s still some surprises left in this season before we crown them the best team in the nfc.

 

[MrRiceGuyRJ]

I haven't heard these kinds of reports, but I think it's that "potential" that people want.

This is pure speculation but...

There's those that prefer gradually getting better and the best is yet to come

Then there's the "we've seen the best they can offer" and gradually getting worse

I remember when Chip Kelly came to the NFL he took the league by storm. But after a period of time he was figured out and never recovered. I'm sure there's others, but that's one that popped in mind.

I wonder if people are starting to think McVays system is that. Once we got exposed last year by the Lions and Bears, team got the blueprint on how to beat the Rams and lost that "domination" we once had. I'm not sure if it's true, but it's an opinion I've read and wondered.

 

[den-the-coach]

Kyle Michael Shanahan is an elite play caller, there is little doubt about that and he might have an edge over McVay in that area because Shanahan focuses more on the run, whereas, McVay is more of the aerial assault.

Overall, I prefer the run, but I still have confidence McVay will continue to rise and the Offensive Line is key to the success. The 49er Defense has been more of the story than the 49er Offense and next year after Kyle Shanahan has to replace current defensive coordinator Robert Saleh once he's a Head Coach, we will see how the dust settles.

 

[Loyal]

"Crash and Burn" Shanahan is his alias...

 

[bluecoconuts]

People are trying to say that he was the reason that McVay was successful in Washington, and that it was his system that McVay adopted, etc. etc.

Really it's just because they want to make the 49ers a big story. The reality is that the NFL likely is very unhappy with this season.

Look at last year for comparison. There were a number of hot teams, exciting games. The Rams vs the Vikings was a fireworks show, the Rams vs the Chiefs was one of the best games in the history of the league, it was huge, so many big moments. The best TNF and MNF in league history is a big deal, and one the NFL wishes they could carry over into their 100th season. Mahomes lighting it up, the Saints tearing through teams in exciting fashion, the Rams rolling through with their exciting offense, Bears and their stifling defense, etc. Then year 100 it's all just a big wet fart. Mahomes injured, and wasn't lighting it up like before, Brees and a bunch of other QB's injured, etc.

This season has been shit, and I don't just say that because the Rams have been off. It just hasn't been as electrifying. The 49ers are a good solid defense, but not an exciting offense, a lot of people understand the weaknesses of the team and understand that they have benefited greatly from a rather easy schedule, same with the Patriots. When they went undefeated in 07 their offense was flying. Now? Piss easy schedule and a solid defense. That's not exciting. This season hasn't been exiting, it just hasn't been. Too much talk about the refs, too much bitching by people, after an unusual high in terms of excitement last season they have regressed more to the norm, or even below it really.

So what's the NFL to do? Try to make anything into a big story to drum up excitement.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

I haven't heard these kinds of reports, but I think it's that "potential" that people want.

This is pure speculation but...

There's those that prefer gradually getting better and the best is yet to come

Then there's the "we've seen the best they can offer" and gradually getting worse

I remember when Chip Kelly came to the NFL he took the league by storm. But after a period of time he was figured out and never recovered. I'm sure there's others, but that's one that popped in mind.

I wonder if people are starting to think McVays system is that. Once we got exposed last year by the Lions and Bears, team got the blueprint on how to beat the Rams and lost that "domination" we once had. I'm not sure if it's true, but it's an opinion I've read and wondered.

I’ve heard this comment about McVay also. Whoever it was said that the coaches that are set on a basic system are usually too stubborn to make changes, and then he said like Chip Kelly.

So McVay will need to make changes or at least be willing to make changes. All of last season he seemed like one of the stubborn, system coaches that continued to believe in his system no matter what.

So far this year he has been willing to make some changes, like using his TEs more and changing up the blocking scheme. I wonder if he would be switching things up if the line was playing better from the get go.

Either way McVay isn’t the offensive mind that Shanahan is. But as a head coach and a Leander I give him the edge. Maybe one day he will be open to giving an OC a chance to influence or even run the offense, if needed.

 

[Merlin]

I’ve heard several times that maybe Shanny is the real genius in the nfc west, which I found curious. Why does Shanny’s success diminish McVay ?

Because people are douchebags and like to label everything to align with their expectations. Not exempting myself from this either btw we all do it just some of us try to keep it somewhat under control.

I've always felt like Shanny is the most gifted play designer and caller, well not always but since that season he put together in Atlanta. Doesn't change that I believe in McVay though, who is in a top group with guys like Peterson and Shanny (I'd say there's about five or six who are top of the game). I think down the road Sean will be one of the best head coaches of his generation, from that perspective he just has all the right stuff so he's more than just an offensive mind.

Shanny's a prickly guy who I just don't think will sustain year to year. But we'll see. Either way the NFC West is the most loaded division in the league and it starts from the top. 4 excellent coaches with different strengths/weaknesses and it's gonna be fun to watch McVay duke it out with them.

 

[LARAMSinFeb.]

I’ve heard several times that maybe Shanny is the real genius in the nfc west,

Just a ridiculous narrative for bored football-lites. There are many years of data to go before history can evaluate such matters.

 

[LesBaker]

Play design means as much or more than playcalling, especially in the passing game, and Shanahan and McVay are both excellent.

What you are seeing from these two, and some others, stems from Mike Martz. His fingerprints are all over the modern day passing game. He changed the NFL's approach to the passing game. Not just from McVay and Shanahan but league wide. One could even argue that rule changes that benefit the passing game ended up being adopted because of how the passing attack evolved due to the influence of Mike Martz.

I remember doing some work many years ago on 3/4/5 wide sets. Warner in 3 seasons, in which he missed a handful of games, threw out of 4/5 wide sets more than many QB's threw out of in their entire careers. Those sets were always reserved for special situations like being down by a few scores and needing to pass. Martz would open the game with 3 straight sets like that. And he would RUN out of those sets before he lost his mind.

Warner would throw out of 5 wide sets more times in a couple of games than some QB's did in an entire season. Martz used motion and double motion almost all the time, more than anyone else by a mile at the time. And would use double motion and run off of it. He even did it in short yardage and goal line situations.

Martz will never be a favorite of mine, EVER, and his ego was a huge driver in the collapse of that era's Rams teams and I will probably never get over how badly he handled the situation. Even when he admitted it I only got a small sense of closure.

But it cannot be denied that his influence is as great as any offensive mind in the history of the NFL. As far as I am concerned he is up there with Coryell. Probably even above him.

Martz was the pivot point on play design in the leagues history. What we see today from the "best and brightest" is very smart coaches using his designs and philosophies as a base and working it around their personnel.

 

[jrry32]

People are trying to say that he was the reason that McVay was successful in Washington, and that it was his system that McVay adopted, etc. etc.

LOL. That doesn't even make sense. Kyle and his pops got fired. McVay took off in D.C. as the OC for Gruden. He turned Cousins' career around. Shanahan is a brilliant play-caller, but he's not the HC that McVay is.

And frankly, I'm not sold he's a better play-caller either. Despite all our issues this year, we're 8th and 9th in yards per drive and points per drive. San Francisco is 13th and 7th. It's not like Kyle's output in past years was comparable, so . . .

 

[LesBaker]

LOL. That doesn't even make sense. Kyle and his pops got fired. McVay took off in D.C. as the OC for Gruden. He turned Cousins' career around. Shanahan is a brilliant play-caller, but he's not the HC that McVay is.

And frankly, I'm not sold he's a better play-caller either. Despite all our issues this year, we're 8th and 9th in yards per drive and points per drive. San Francisco is 13th and 7th. It's not like Kyle's output in past years was comparable, so . . .

Fired by Snyder.

That's like the NFL's OPPOSITE of the Good Housekeeping Seal.

 

[SteveBrown]

Kyle Michael Shanahan is an elite play caller, there is little doubt about that and he might have an edge over McVay in that area because Shanahan focuses more on the run, whereas, McVay is more of the aerial assault.

I agree.....and McVay is a head coach, while Shanny may be a OC right now...if Shanny wins 1 playoff game, then I 'shift' the conversation on Shanny...Don't forget, the Sains wre 7-9 3 years in a row with an awesome offense...winning is not easy, even with a HOFer QB....Head coach is the reason; Has Shanny beaten a playoff team this year? (no---Rams aren't a playoff team). He stomped a good Carolina team, though with a mediocre QB.

 

[Steve808]

Shanny learned how to milk the clock. If he had known that a few years ago, the Falcons would have won a Super Bowl and the cheaters record would not look as good. That and the sea pigeons give the cheaters a free SB title.

 

[den-the-coach]

Has Shanny beaten a playoff team this year? (no---Rams aren't a playoff team). He stomped a good Carolina team, though with a mediocre QB.

They've beaten everyone on their schedule, that's all they can do. They are legit, let's just hope they choke in post season.

 

[tklongball]

After a so-so start in SF Shanahan has found himself on top of the league with an undefeated record in the first 8 games, but what I don’t get is how this has affected perception of McVay. I’ve heard several times that maybe Shanny is the real genius in the nfc west, which I found curious. Why does Shanny’s success diminish McVay ? Shanahan had injury issues his first couple years now it’s all coming together. McVay had unusual health now there are real injury problems.
Strength of schedule is an underrated part of playoff success, many times the teams that end up in the playoffs have had the easiest road to get there but I think there’s still some surprises left in this season before we crown them the best team in the nfc.

I think the real question is why you care what other people (Talking Heads) say. I mean, it's not like they jump the gun on EVERYTHING, right? They never anoint a Rookie QB as the next big thing after half a season, only to watch them fizzle out in year two. Or call guys busts in their first season. Honestly, I literally could not care less what those idiots say. I don't watch them, or listen to them, and if I do happen to by mistake, I ignore them, because they talk out of their ass all the time. The only thing these clowns care about is getting viewers, and I refuse to reward them for their stupidity.

Hell let them think Adam Gase is the best Head Coach in the NFL, if they want. It doesn't change what I think, or how much I will enjoy the games.

 

[tklongball]

Within the division, strength of schedule is basically 2 games (the x-placed team from the 2 same conference divisions you don't play that year), and how the teams on your schedule are laid out (Early in the season, late, home, away, etc.).

Now between divisions it can make a huge difference, if one division. For example, look at New England's Schedule this year. They play the AFC North (10-19), and the NFC east(11-20), and the rest of their division (6 Games) is (6-15). So the 14 games, that are predetermined are really favorable, even though they won their division last year.

 

[leoram]

Last year, when the Rams demolished the 9’ers, I reported repeatedly that Shanahan out-schemed McVay but the Rams just had much better players. Shanahan, over the last two years, has been forced to build depth and adjust his scheme around roster holes. This prepared him to have success against us when he lost both his starting tackles and still won the game.

Both are excellent play designers and game managers. But the Rams had two years of continuity disrupted this year whereas Shanny had to build from the bottom up.

The Rams are in the midst of a metamorphosis and change can be painful, but it’s inevitable. The three losses suffered can either make the team stronger or make them wilt. I believe the former.

There will be times every coordinator wins his chess match and times they will lose. The difference is that this is also a players game. The ability to adapt both players and scheme to defeat an opponent is the key to great coaching.

Both organizations are in great hands. Shanny deserves his respect and I acknowledged that even when his team was losing. So did Jay Gruden. With that said, I’d rather have McVay than any other coach in the NFL and that by a wide margin.