So much for balance, but a W is a W

[Blue and Gold]

PassingCP/ATYDSTDINT
T. Brady--33/50--367-3-1
J. Edelman--1/1--51---10
RushingATTYDSTDLG
B. Bolden---3-7--0-4
S. Vereen---1-6-0-6
L. Blount---3-1-0-2
T. Brady---6-0-1-4T

 

[MrMotes]

Balance is overrated. We won the SB throwing 45 times and running 13...

 

[Mojo Ram]

Balance can be overrated over the course of one or two 60 minute games but over the course of a full season it's not.

 

[jrry32]

You don't need balance when you have one of the best QBs in the game and the opposing defense has nothing in the secondary due to injuries which forces them to play soft zones.

Baltimore has one of the best run defenses and front 7s in football...but they also have nothing at CB due to injuries and no depth which made them afraid to run man to man or bump and run. You'd be a fool not to exploit that.

 

[jrry32]

Balance can be overrated over the course of one or two 60 minute games but over the course of a full season it's not.

Yes sir. If a team can't stop the pass, keep throwing. If they can't stop the run, keep running. But you're not going to play 16 games against only teams that can't stop the pass or only teams that can't stop the run. Best to have balance when you need it.

 

[Blue and Gold]

You don't need balance when you have one of the best QBs in the game and the opposing defense has nothing in the secondary due to injuries which forces them to play soft zones.

Baltimore has one of the best run defenses and front 7s in football...but they also have nothing at CB due to injuries and no depth which made them afraid to run man to man or bump and run. You'd be a fool not to exploit that.

I know, but when Martz was unbalanced it was often off with his head . . . games situations determine the balance. Now, of course Beleichick wants to run the ball, he always has, and sometimes is successful, which is why he brough Blount back and has had some season where they run the ball, but the key is, when your running game goes south, they can pass the ball expertly.

But, I would bet a lot that they didn't want to get behind and have to abandon the running game, but they had to do it.

 

[MrMotes]

Yes sir. If a team can't stop the pass, keep throwing. If they can't stop the run, keep running. But you're not going to play 16 games against only teams that can't stop the pass or only teams that can't stop the run. Best to have balance when you need it.

Sounds like a redefining of what balance means to me, which is why i say it's overrated, or at least somewhat obsolete...

 

[jrry32]

I know, but when Martz was unbalanced it was often off with his head . . . games situations determine the balance. Now, of course Beleichick wants to run the ball, he always has, and sometimes is successful, which is why he brough Blount back and has had some season where they run the ball, but the key is, when your running game goes south, they can pass the ball expertly.

But, I would bet a lot that they didn't want to get behind and have to abandon the running game, but they had to do it.

Agreed. Game situations do determine balance.

I don't know that Belichick and NE cared so much today about abandoning the run game because of the uneven distribution of talent on Baltimore's defense and the scheme they were using. Although, if they were running it a ton, it likely would have meant they had the lead...so I guess in that respect, yes, they would have liked to run it more.

Sounds like a redefining of what balance means to me, which is why i say it's overrated, or at least somewhat obsolete...

No, it isn't. Last I checked, you evaluate balance from a team perspective and from the perspective of an entire season.

Nobody thinks perfect balance is necessary. You gotta do what you do best. But it would be unintelligent over the course of an entire season not to remain somewhat balanced.

Even if you have a great QB, over the course of a season, you still have to run the ball to keep the defense honest.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

I thought maybe the Ravens hired Tim Walton as the DCoordinator. Their backfield was giving a 10 yard cushion on every play.

Even if your backfield is not great why just give the opponents first downs like that? The Ravens must have just wanted to slow them down and hope to score enough, which they almost did.

I kept hearing about the Ptriots D being the best they had in years. It didn't look that impressive against the Ravens.

 

[MrMotes]

NE threw the ball 59% of the time this year and there's really nothing unusual about it. Balance just ain't what it used to be...

 

[lockdnram21]

I thought maybe the Ravens hired Tim Walton as the DCoordinator. Their backfield was giving a 10 yard cushion on every play.

Even if your backfield is not great why just give the opponents first downs like that? The Ravens must have just wanted to slow them down and hope to score enough, which they almost did.

I kept hearing about the Ptriots D being the best they had in years. It didn't look that impressive against the Ravens.

G williams was giving 10 yard cushions so imo all the bashing of Walton is irrelevant

 

[jrry32]

NE threw the ball 59% of the time this year and there's really nothing unusual about it. Balance just ain't what it used to be...

59% of the time isn't a disproportionate amount for a team with lackluster HBs and one of the best QBs in the game. I don't think anyone defines "balanced" in the football world as 50/50 run to pass anymore. Just not how it works. Balance in today's NFL is probably around 59% pass to 41% run. The Rams were at 58.7% pass this year and 41.3% run. In fact, New England was actually 16th out of the 32 teams this year in passing percentage at 59.2%.

Nobody cares about perfect balance(50/50).

 

[jrry32]

I thought maybe the Ravens hired Tim Walton as the DCoordinator. Their backfield was giving a 10 yard cushion on every play.

Even if your backfield is not great why just give the opponents first downs like that? The Ravens must have just wanted to slow them down and hope to score enough, which they almost did.

I kept hearing about the Ptriots D being the best they had in years. It didn't look that impressive against the Ravens.

Like you said, slow them down and hope the offense could keep up. Those CBs weren't going to handle NE's WRs/TEs one on one.

 

[MrMotes]

59% of the time isn't a disproportionate amount for a team with lackluster HBs and one of the best QBs in the game. I don't think anyone defines "balanced" in the football world as 50/50 run to pass anymore. Just not how it works. Balance in today's NFL is probably around 59% pass to 41% run. The Rams were at 58.7% pass this year and 41.3% run. In fact, New England was actually 16th out of the 32 teams this year in passing percentage at 59.2%.

Nobody cares about perfect balance(50/50).

I agree, nothing wrong with 60/40 pass for the year but go back a few years and that would be considered radically out of balance. Which, again, is why i say balance is overrated, certainly it's subjective and changes over time.

It's meaningless. Like you said, you do what works. You don't adhere to some subjective formula called balance...

 

[jrry32]

I agree, nothing wrong with 60/40 pass for the year but go back a few years and that would be considered radically out of balance. Which, again, is why i say balance is overrated, certainly it's subjective and changes over time.

It's meaningless. Like you said, you do what works. You don't adhere to some subjective formula called balance...

You been talking to Old Larry? He probably forgot what decade it was.

Today's NFL is pass heavy. I think you remain balanced in that you still have to run the ball to keep the defense honest. But no, I don't think we need to stick to some arbitrary number like 50/50 or 54/46 or something like that. If we can throw it 60% of the time effectively, we should. If we can run it 60% of the time effectively, we should. That's exactly it...do what works.

 

[LesBaker]

I know, but when Martz was unbalanced it was often off with his head . . . games situations determine the balance. Now, of course Beleichick wants to run the ball, he always has, and sometimes is successful, which is why he brough Blount back and has had some season where they run the ball, but the key is, when your running game goes south, they can pass the ball expertly.

But, I would bet a lot that they didn't want to get behind and have to abandon the running game, but they had to do it.

The thing was Martz was tone deaf to situations and IMO lacked the mechanism to understand the moment he was in sometimes.

For instance the SB loss to the Patriots.

You've been around the game I suspect, and possibly played. Answer this honestly.......

If a defense is lining up 3 DL, 1 LB and 7 DB's do you try to pass the ball 10-15 yards up the field or do you hand it to the fantastic HOF RB lined up behind your all pro QB? Martz couldn't see the strategic benefit of change sometimes.

It wasn't just "unbalanced" that Martz got beaten up by fans and media, it was his rigidity and unwillingness to be flexible during games.

 

[Blue and Gold]

The thing was Martz was tone deaf to situations and IMO lacked the mechanism to understand the moment he was in sometimes.

For instance the SB loss to the Patriots.

You've been around the game I suspect, and possibly played. Answer this honestly.......

If a defense is lining up 3 DL, 1 LB and 7 DB's do you try to pass the ball 10-15 yards up the field or do you hand it to the fantastic HOF RB lined up behind your all pro QB? Martz couldn't see the strategic benefit of change sometimes.

It wasn't just "unbalanced" that Martz got beaten up by fans and media, it was his rigidity and unwillingness to be flexible during games.

In theory, of course you run to 6-man boxes. But, re-wtch SB 34 and see if you don't think the Rams ran in through the 3rd Q. They had to pass in the 4th and they finally tied it up. There is lots going on in that game that is hard to see. I was at that game and didn't really review it until later on video tape (remember those/). Anyway, the Pats ran some Bear fronts early in that game and they were doing everything they could to take Faulk out of the game, including holding him . . . and holding the reveivers as well . . they knew they'd get a few calls but the refs were not going to call all of them because it was such a big game, the Pats gambles that most of those holds would not be called.

Overall, in the Martz era, the Rams had a decent run-pass ratio and were effective running the ball, and had a line that zone blocked well and rans it a decent amount of time.

Now, a third issue is whether Martz was good at in-game adjustments when he was a HC. I think THAT is a fair criticism. There were times I think his game management was bad and in 2002 it cost us a few wins, but in 2000 and 2001 I think he was a good HC.

To me, I have always posted that I wish Vermeil had not quit and Martz would have had another year as just and OC, maybe two . . . but you know my feelings on what happened with Vermiel.

I just will never be on the extreme ends of the Martz debate. I think he was a vital, vital part of our Super Bowl win and will always be glad he was there. I also think it was time for him to go when he was fired. I am not a lover or hater of Martz.

I'd suggest you look at that Super Bowl again and see the fronts the Pats sued that were fairlt effective in taking limiting Faulk's usual effectiveness.

 

[jap]

I'd suggest you look at that Super Bowl again and see the fronts the Pats sued that were fairly effective in taking limiting Faulk's usual effectiveness.

Limiting Faulk's usual effectiveness? They held Marshall every time he went out for a pass, and those cheating officials only called it once! They went to take away as much of the most dynamic elements of the GSOT.

Ty Law broke two of Isaac's ribs with his first brutal tackle of Bruce. A game Isaac continued to play, but third year receiver Torry was being counted on to take over as the team's #1 wideout at that point by the Horns' coaching brass, and he wasn't ready to do it on such short notice. He elevated himself for the following 2002 season, however.

 

[Blue and Gold]

Limiting Faulk's usual effectiveness? They held Marshall every time he went out for a pass, and those cheating officials only called it once! They went to take away as much of the most dynamic elements of the GSOT.

Ty Law broke two of Isaac's ribs with his first brutal tackle of Bruce. A game Isaac continued to play, but third year receiver Torry was being counted on to take over as the team's #1 wideout at that point by the Horns' coaching brass, and he wasn't ready to do it on such short notice. He elevated himself for the following 2002 season, however.

I agree, I said they held Faulk and others. I was being wry when I said "limited his usual effectiveness" like when I said football "expert" Florio. But bad no calls or not, Faulk was limited in that game in running and passing . . .

 

[jap]

I agree, I said they held Faulk and others. I was being wry when I said "limited his usual effectiveness" like when I said football "expert" Florio. But bad no calls or not, Faulk was limited in that game in running and passing . . .

I see what you are saying, but I wouldn't call Faulk being 'limited' when the limiting was accomplished illegally. And when you have Pats' defensive players calling out plays that Martz only installed during the practice weeks leading up to the Super Bowl, I sorta want to lynch Goddall for destroying those damn tapes.