Program V Knee Jerk

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leoram

LA/St Louis/LA fan
Joined
May 25, 2013
Messages
1,297
This offseason more than most has polarized Ram fans against each other. LA v STL. Keep or dump Sam. Replace most of the OLine? Did we lose a battle for a top OC or did Fisher want to promote from within and only shopped as window dressing so it would appear he did his due diligence?

Having turned 50 this year and having suffered more awful years as a Ram fan than enjoyable ones, my perspective has changed because life happens. Aesop's fable about the Tortoise and the Hare comes to mind. Though we won no titles and losses to the Cowboys and Vikings ended our seasons, in retrospect, having the Fearsome Foresome and the league's best OLine made the early 70s a special time which made me a fan watching with my dear father. Losing to the Steelers in a Super Bowl is finally a fond memory (F'ing Lynn Swann and John Stallworth). Though we couldn't retain them, men like Dickerson and Bettis left me wishing I could go back to my days as a Pop Warner running back wishing I had run with more power. Giving up Kurt Warner was ludicrous. Letting Fletcher go was beyond stupid. Though Martz flamed out, were we better with Vitt, Haslett, Linehan, and Spags? Steven Jackson is my vote for most under appreciated Ram of all time. I've never lost 12 hands of blackjack in a row but Ram OLines have stayed mostly injured that many years in a row.

Which brings me finally to my point. Jeff Fisher and Les Snead, along with Stan Kroenke, have created a vision that eludes most fans. I posted here when Fisher was hired that the persona of Spag's 4 Pillars would become one of Nasty, Nasty, Nasty and began with the acquisition of Finnegan. Though Coutland's injuries rendered him ineffective, his personality (along with Coach Cecil) remains part and parcel of what this defense is becoming. Gregg Williams is the Man who purports: Beat the F out of them! Pressure! Win! Dominate! Be Responsible for your Assignment! Again, Best the F out of them!

The Offense is more difficult to define but the principles are in place for success. Offense is a thinking man's game in passing and a physical man's game when running. Since M Faulk no longer wears pads, the combination of Mason, Cunningham, Stacy, Austin, Watts, and Pead will have to suffice. S Bradford, IF healthy (big If If If) is the third best QB in Ram history (Warner and Van Brocklin are 1 and 2. Gabriel and Everett are 4 and 5 IMO). Quick, Britt, Bailey, Austin, and Cook are the third best receiving corps this team ever had (50's led by Hirsch and GSOT led by Bruce). This offseason is All About What We Do With The Offensive Line. Robinson and Saffold are the only financial and philosophical givens. Frankly, if it's me, I would put them at LT and RG and devote EVERY resource toward the other three positions and someone versatile (Barnes, Person, Jones) as insurance.

The one thing I wouldn't do is veer off course. Whether STL (my preference in Ash Grove, MO) or LA, whether Bradford or the best alternative who plays like him, or whether they build from FA or the draft this year, I'm glad Jeff hired In-house for continuity and pray he exhausts ALL remaining resources on the OLine. If that happens, even a healthy Joe Flacco, Trent Dilfer, Doug Williams, Shaun Hill, or Terry Bradshaw could win a SB with this team.
 

blue4

Hall of Fame
Joined
Jun 25, 2014
Messages
3,126
Name
blue4
This offseason more than most has polarized Ram fans against each other. LA v STL. Keep or dump Sam. Replace most of the OLine? Did we lose a battle for a top OC or did Fisher want to promote from within and only shopped as window dressing so it would appear he did his due diligence?

Having turned 50 this year and having suffered more awful years as a Ram fan than enjoyable ones, my perspective has changed because life happens. Aesop's fable about the Tortoise and the Hare comes to mind. Though we won no titles and losses to the Cowboys and Vikings ended our seasons, in retrospect, having the Fearsome Foresome and the league's best OLine made the early 70s a special time which made me a fan watching with my dear father. Losing to the Steelers in a Super Bowl is finally a fond memory (F'ing Lynn Swann and John Stallworth). Though we couldn't retain them, men like Dickerson and Bettis left me wishing I could go back to my days as a Pop Warner running back wishing I had run with more power. Giving up Kurt Warner was ludicrous. Letting Fletcher go was beyond stupid. Though Martz flamed out, were we better with Vitt, Haslett, Linehan, and Spags? Steven Jackson is my vote for most under appreciated Ram of all time. I've never lost 12 hands of blackjack in a row but Ram OLines have stayed mostly injured that many years in a row.

Which brings me finally to my point. Jeff Fisher and Les Snead, along with Stan Kroenke, have created a vision that eludes most fans. I posted here when Fisher was hired that the persona of Spag's 4 Pillars would become one of Nasty, Nasty, Nasty and began with the acquisition of Finnegan. Though Coutland's injuries rendered him ineffective, his personality (along with Coach Cecil) remains part and parcel of what this defense is becoming. Gregg Williams is the Man who purports: Beat the F out of them! Pressure! Win! Dominate! Be Responsible for your Assignment! Again, Best the F out of them!

The Offense is more difficult to define but the principles are in place for success. Offense is a thinking man's game in passing and a physical man's game when running. Since M Faulk no longer wears pads, the combination of Mason, Cunningham, Stacy, Austin, Watts, and Pead will have to suffice. S Bradford, IF healthy (big If If If) is the third best QB in Ram history (Warner and Van Brocklin are 1 and 2. Gabriel and Everett are 4 and 5 IMO). Quick, Britt, Bailey, Austin, and Cook are the third best receiving corps this team ever had (50's led by Hirsch and GSOT led by Bruce). This offseason is All About What We Do With The Offensive Line. Robinson and Saffold are the only financial and philosophical givens. Frankly, if it's me, I would put them at LT and RG and devote EVERY resource toward the other three positions and someone versatile (Barnes, Person, Jones) as insurance.

The one thing I wouldn't do is veer off course. Whether STL (my preference in Ash Grove, MO) or LA, whether Bradford or the best alternative who plays like him, or whether they build from FA or the draft this year, I'm glad Jeff hired In-house for continuity and pray he exhausts ALL remaining resources on the OLine. If that happens, even a healthy Joe Flacco, Trent Dilfer, Doug Williams, Shaun Hill, or Terry Bradshaw could win a SB with this team.

Marc Bulger gets my vote as under appreciated. Man took a pummeling behind some of the worst OL ever to play the game and people would call him a wimp because he didn't bounce back up every time like one of those weeble wobbles. He showed far more than Sam has, and I'm a big Bradford fan. But as Sam sits now I wouldn't be comfortable ranking him among the best in team history.

I absolutely agree with a few upgrades on the OL we don't need a superstar at QB with this team.
 

Blue and Gold

Pro Bowler
Joined
Jan 6, 2014
Messages
1,741
Name
B and G
Marc Bulger gets my vote as under appreciated. Man took a pummeling behind some of the worst OL ever to play the game and people would call him a wimp because he didn't bounce back up every time like one of those weeble wobbles. He showed far more than Sam has, and I'm a big Bradford fan. But as Sam sits now I wouldn't be comfortable ranking him among the best in team history.

Marc was a tale of two Bulgers. With Martz he averaged 23/35 65% 275 2 TDs 1 INT and a 90 rating and was 28-13 as starter.
He had Pace, Faulk, Ike, Torry, etc. He even had 8 rushing TDs

With other coaches he was 19/31 60% 210 yards 1 TD 1 INT and was 13-41 as a starter. (no rushing TDs) Had Ike and Torry some but no Faulk, no Martz offense.
 

iced

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2013
Messages
6,620
Marc was a tale of two Bulgers. With Martz he averaged 23/35 65% 275 2TDs 1 INT and a 90 rating and was 28-13 as starter.
He had Pace, Faulk, Ike, Torry, etc. He even had 8 rushing TDs

With other coaches he was 19/31 60% 210 yards 1 TD 1 INT and was 13-41 as a starter. (no rushing TDs) Had Ike and Torry some but no Faulk, no Martz offense.

thats because he had no one to block by then and the talent was gone.... particularly in '07... the lines back up's back ups were hurt - guys were signed monday to play sunday

plus bruce was let go over a million dollars, pace was on ir and at the end of his career, holt was injured and '07 was his last season...

he didn't just have martz - he had all those guys with 'em, and only had them for one season post martz...which was also ham stringed offensively by linehan as greg olson was a much, much better play caller then..and they also actually kept martz 's playbook in that season
 

CodeMonkey

Possibly the OH but cannot self-identify
Joined
Jun 20, 2014
Messages
3,449
Great post. Agree that this offseason priorty 1, 2 and 3 is the O-line. It doesn't matter who is under center if we cant give him a pocket.
 

blue4

Hall of Fame
Joined
Jun 25, 2014
Messages
3,126
Name
blue4
Marc was a tale of two Bulgers. With Martz he averaged 23/35 65% 275 2 TDs 1 INT and a 90 rating and was 28-13 as starter.
He had Pace, Faulk, Ike, Torry, etc. He even had 8 rushing TDs

With other coaches he was 19/31 60% 210 yards 1 TD 1 INT and was 13-41 as a starter. (no rushing TDs) Had Ike and Torry some but no Faulk, no Martz offense.

And John St Clair and the one WR who ate the hot dog at halftime and Travis Scott and so on and so forth. The other coaches were universally recognized as abysmal, that doesn't play a role in some reduced stats? Oh god don't forget Drew Bennett as a starter. Or the old version of Torry Holt and Bruce. That's almost as bad as the tendency some have to blame Bradford for the junk he had to work with. Put Marc Bulger on the 2014 Rams and we would have put the Cardinals to bed, battled Seattle for the division, and been very competitive in the playoffs. Of this I have absolutely no doubt.
 

leoram

LA/St Louis/LA fan
Joined
May 25, 2013
Messages
1,297
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #9
Ugh. A healthy Chris Miller, Jim Everett, or Steve Bartkowski were better than Bulger and Ferragamo, I don't blame Bulger for the team around him, nor do I elevate him for the team he inherited. I am only a fan so I am no expert. I am only stating what I believe I saw on Sunday afternoons. Bulger and Ferragamo were both system quarterbacks. I realize very few see Bradford as I do. I really don't care.all I want to see is him healthy with a good team around him. To me, that is where he will prove his place in Ram history. Fix the OLine and everyone from St. Louis to Los Angeles will have to smile together
 

blue4

Hall of Fame
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Messages
3,126
Name
blue4
Ugh. A healthy Chris Miller, Jim Everett, or Steve Bartkowski were better than Bulger and Ferragamo, I don't blame Bulger for the team around him, nor do I elevate him for the team he inherited. I am only a fan so I am no expert. I am only stating what I believe I saw on Sunday afternoons. Bulger and Ferragamo were both system quarterbacks. I realize very few see Bradford as I do. I really don't care.all I want to see is him healthy with a good team around him. To me, that is where he will prove his place in Ram history. Fix the OLine and everyone from St. Louis to Los Angeles will have to smile together

Someone named Steve Bartkowski is better than a guy who took the team to a SB and another who is all over the top ten in every passing category in team history? Well, can't say I agree but I'm no expert either. Fixing the OL is something everyone can agree on.
 

leoram

LA/St Louis/LA fan
Joined
May 25, 2013
Messages
1,297
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #12
Someone named Steve Bartkowski is better than a guy who took the team to a SB and another who is all over the top ten in every passing category in team history? Well, can't say I agree but I'm no expert either. Fixing the OL is something everyone can agree on.

Did you ever see Bartkowski play? IMO he never had a good team around him (like his contemporary Archie Manning) but he was a helluva quarterback. Understand please that I liked and respected Bulger. He too was dealt an uneven hand and made Pro Bowl status along the way. It's not a slam to put him 7 or 8 all time on a team as old as the Rams. Heck, I put him over Gabriel (a childhood hero), Van Brocklin, and Hayden. Bud, that's high praise.
 

DR RAM

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I think this is the most unified fandom on what the team needs to do, than any I can remember.

Nice post, by the way.