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Hall of Fame GMs on Winston vs. Mariota
The slog continues, endlessly. The NFL places the draft an arduously, ridiculously long 123 days after the regular season, and so we are left to be bored silly for 10 more days. I’m at the if-you-can’t-beat-’em, join-’em stage this week.
Before we learn the real story behind the Malcolm Butler interception, and why I think Big Ben is bound for the season-opener, and finally someone going on the record in San Francisco on L’Affair Harbaugh,two voices of sanity on the great quarterback debate of 2015.
In August, Ron Wolf and Bill Polian will become the first general managers since 1995 enshrined in the Pro Football Hall of Fame. Both are still active in the game. Wolf has been a consultant to several teams in recent years, most recently the Jets in a scouting and coach-and-GM-advisory capacity. Polian works for ESPN as an NFL analyst, and has been watching tape of college players preparing to work the draft.
Polian had to choose between Peyton Manning and Ryan Leaf in 1998 as general manager of the Colts, and between Kerry Collins and Steve McNair for the Panthers in 1995. Wolf, as Al Davis’ chief scout with the Raiders two generations ago, was a key man in the drafting of Ken Stabler. As Green Bay’s GM in 1992, Wolf traded with Atlanta for a third-string quarterback named Brett Favre.
I asked both Hall of Fame GMs over the weekend: If you had to choose between quarterbacks Jameis Winston and Marcus Mariota in this draft, who would you take?
In fairness, both answered with asterisks, which I’ll explain.
“I’d probably lean toward Mariota,” Polian said.
“If I had to pick, based strictly on what I know now, I’d pick Winston,” said Wolf.
The provisos: Polian said it’s unfair to make a definitive choice without knowing everything your organization would know about the mental makeup and off-the-field behavior of the players. Wolf said “it isn’t fair” for him to judge Mariota with finality because he’s done much more work on Winston, even seeing him on the field in warmups before the Florida State-Miami game last fall.
As draft day gets closer, expert opinions remain split on whether Marcus Mariota or Jameis Winston will be the better NFL QB. (Joe Robbins/Getty Images)
With those “yeah buts” out of the way, it was clear in talking to both men they have strong opinions on these players.
“I’ve seen Mariota on tape—I’d have to see a lot more of him—and I’ve seen Winston in-person and on tape,’’ said Wolf. “I’ve been exposed to Winston more. I watched Winston versus Miami before the game, down on the field, and then will his team back from a 16-point deficit. He’s an imposing guy. He has everything you’d want in a quarterback. I thought he was superb. What I know about Winston I like a lot. I’d take him in a heartbeat.”
Polian: “My answer has to be equivocal, because what I don’t have is the psychological reports on the players. Particularly on Winston, it’s beyond important. Combined with Winston’s 18 interceptions this year, I’d have to go Mariota.”
I asked: “If the psychological report on Winston was clean, would it still be Mariota?”
Polian: “Very, very close. But I’d probably lean toward Mariota, as I said. It’s closer than Manning-Leaf was. Way closer. More like Collins-McNair in ’95. With Mariota, I don’t think playing from the pocket will be an issue; he did a lot of that in the eight or nine games I saw. And he didn’t throw 18 interceptions either. On 14 of those 18 interceptions, Winston didn’t see linebackers underneath or he zeroed in on the receiver regardless of coverage.
“But look, both guys have a chance to be successful. They’re both gifted. Both have superior tools. The bottom line is, I know you’ve got to be totally dedicated to the job, to go through the learning curve and all the tough days you’re going to have early. Adversity will come. And I’ve got to go with the more sure thing in my mind—Mariota.”
Wolf sounded like he saw some Favre in Winston. In 1991, when Wolf worked the draft for the Jets as their personnel director, he had Favre the number one player on his personal draft list. The Jets, who didn’t have a first-round pick that year, were about to take Favre in the second when Atlanta swooped in to choose him. When Wolf got hired by Green Bay as GM late in 1991, Favre stayed on his mind, even though in Atlanta he had a crummy, party-filled rookie season.
“You have to have a conviction in that job, as general manager,” Wolf said. “I had one about Favre. I thought he was the best player in the draft the previous year, so one year later, what am I going to do if I can get him for our first-round pick? At the time, our quarterbacks in Green Bay were Don Majkowski, Blair Kiel and Mike Tomczak—a 10th and an 11th-round pick, and a free agent. You look around the league, and some teams have first-rounders backing up first-rounders. My attitude was you gotta keep going after it. If you have a conviction on a guy, you better go with that.”
Memo to Tampa Bay GM Jason Licht: The moral of this story, this year, is there isn’t a 100-percent sure thing, for a variety of reasons. You’d better go with your gut. The gut sounds like it’ll be Winston as we sit here, 10 days before D-Day.
Hall of Fame GMs on Winston vs. Mariota
The slog continues, endlessly. The NFL places the draft an arduously, ridiculously long 123 days after the regular season, and so we are left to be bored silly for 10 more days. I’m at the if-you-can’t-beat-’em, join-’em stage this week.
Before we learn the real story behind the Malcolm Butler interception, and why I think Big Ben is bound for the season-opener, and finally someone going on the record in San Francisco on L’Affair Harbaugh,two voices of sanity on the great quarterback debate of 2015.
In August, Ron Wolf and Bill Polian will become the first general managers since 1995 enshrined in the Pro Football Hall of Fame. Both are still active in the game. Wolf has been a consultant to several teams in recent years, most recently the Jets in a scouting and coach-and-GM-advisory capacity. Polian works for ESPN as an NFL analyst, and has been watching tape of college players preparing to work the draft.
Polian had to choose between Peyton Manning and Ryan Leaf in 1998 as general manager of the Colts, and between Kerry Collins and Steve McNair for the Panthers in 1995. Wolf, as Al Davis’ chief scout with the Raiders two generations ago, was a key man in the drafting of Ken Stabler. As Green Bay’s GM in 1992, Wolf traded with Atlanta for a third-string quarterback named Brett Favre.
I asked both Hall of Fame GMs over the weekend: If you had to choose between quarterbacks Jameis Winston and Marcus Mariota in this draft, who would you take?
In fairness, both answered with asterisks, which I’ll explain.
“I’d probably lean toward Mariota,” Polian said.
“If I had to pick, based strictly on what I know now, I’d pick Winston,” said Wolf.
The provisos: Polian said it’s unfair to make a definitive choice without knowing everything your organization would know about the mental makeup and off-the-field behavior of the players. Wolf said “it isn’t fair” for him to judge Mariota with finality because he’s done much more work on Winston, even seeing him on the field in warmups before the Florida State-Miami game last fall.
As draft day gets closer, expert opinions remain split on whether Marcus Mariota or Jameis Winston will be the better NFL QB. (Joe Robbins/Getty Images)
With those “yeah buts” out of the way, it was clear in talking to both men they have strong opinions on these players.
“I’ve seen Mariota on tape—I’d have to see a lot more of him—and I’ve seen Winston in-person and on tape,’’ said Wolf. “I’ve been exposed to Winston more. I watched Winston versus Miami before the game, down on the field, and then will his team back from a 16-point deficit. He’s an imposing guy. He has everything you’d want in a quarterback. I thought he was superb. What I know about Winston I like a lot. I’d take him in a heartbeat.”
Polian: “My answer has to be equivocal, because what I don’t have is the psychological reports on the players. Particularly on Winston, it’s beyond important. Combined with Winston’s 18 interceptions this year, I’d have to go Mariota.”
I asked: “If the psychological report on Winston was clean, would it still be Mariota?”
Polian: “Very, very close. But I’d probably lean toward Mariota, as I said. It’s closer than Manning-Leaf was. Way closer. More like Collins-McNair in ’95. With Mariota, I don’t think playing from the pocket will be an issue; he did a lot of that in the eight or nine games I saw. And he didn’t throw 18 interceptions either. On 14 of those 18 interceptions, Winston didn’t see linebackers underneath or he zeroed in on the receiver regardless of coverage.
“But look, both guys have a chance to be successful. They’re both gifted. Both have superior tools. The bottom line is, I know you’ve got to be totally dedicated to the job, to go through the learning curve and all the tough days you’re going to have early. Adversity will come. And I’ve got to go with the more sure thing in my mind—Mariota.”
Wolf sounded like he saw some Favre in Winston. In 1991, when Wolf worked the draft for the Jets as their personnel director, he had Favre the number one player on his personal draft list. The Jets, who didn’t have a first-round pick that year, were about to take Favre in the second when Atlanta swooped in to choose him. When Wolf got hired by Green Bay as GM late in 1991, Favre stayed on his mind, even though in Atlanta he had a crummy, party-filled rookie season.
“You have to have a conviction in that job, as general manager,” Wolf said. “I had one about Favre. I thought he was the best player in the draft the previous year, so one year later, what am I going to do if I can get him for our first-round pick? At the time, our quarterbacks in Green Bay were Don Majkowski, Blair Kiel and Mike Tomczak—a 10th and an 11th-round pick, and a free agent. You look around the league, and some teams have first-rounders backing up first-rounders. My attitude was you gotta keep going after it. If you have a conviction on a guy, you better go with that.”
Memo to Tampa Bay GM Jason Licht: The moral of this story, this year, is there isn’t a 100-percent sure thing, for a variety of reasons. You’d better go with your gut. The gut sounds like it’ll be Winston as we sit here, 10 days before D-Day.