JL, whipping boy

[fearsomefour]

JL takes some abuse from Rams fans in general and some here on ROD as well. I think some of it has to do with his contract, although, his cap number is $4.2 M this year and $6.4M next year. Not a bad salary for a top LB. The question with him has always been, is he a top performer? Here is a quick peak at his stats averaged from 2010--2014, a good 5 year window....

He has averaged 124.6 tackles per year.
He has 14 turnovers, Ints and fumble recoveries. An average of 2.8 turnovers per year.
He has 13.5 sacks over the 5 seasons. An average of 2.7 sacks per year.
His average rank (as low as 16 and as high as 4....D player rankings based on tackles) is 9.2 in the league. That rank is for all D players, not just linebackers.
So, the numbers tell the story in more than one way.
He is very consistent performer. He is very durable and does not miss time. In terms of being a tackler he is a top 10 performer in the league....for an average year for him. If there are 352 D "starters" (11 per team) JL averages finishing in the top 10 in tackles. No small accomplishment.
It also tells the story of him not being a big play LB. Other guys, guys like a Patrick Willis make their name making big plays, causing turnovers ect. Whether it is part scheme or just how his game works, he does not come up with many turnovers for a guy who rarely leaves the field.
His tackles number are down the last two years....a good thing I think as some of that weight has shifted to Ogletree and a better overall D performance.
So, a very consistent MLB who is one of the better in the league at getting tackle numbers but lacks big plays....worth an average of $5.3M over the next two years....yes, I think so.

 

[-X-]

There are maybe two or three positions on this team that are set in stone (e.g., don't need to be upgraded). When we get around to needing to upgrade the ILB position, then that means the rest of the team has been addressed in full. Because as far as liabilities go, he's way down the list.

 

[fearsomefour]

There are maybe two or three positions on this team that are set in stone (e.g., don't need to be upgraded). When we get around to needing to upgrade the ILB position, then that means the rest of the team has been addressed in full. Because as far as liabilities go, he's way down the list.

Amen brotha.

 

[Ramfreak]

In all those misleading stats, how many are made at the line of scrimmage and for losses? I'm willing to bet he's among the lowest in the league in those categories for his position. What's the average yards gained by the time he tackles? He's never been a Pro Bowler. Not even an alternate. Why have Quinn and Aaron Donald made the Pro Bowl so quickly? It's because they get into the backfield and create havoc. It's the same reason Patrick Willis and Ray Lewis were in the Pro Bowl as many times as they were. They make minus yards contact.
I see TJ McDonald run stuffing more than JL55. We certainly don't want JL55 in coverage either. Too slow. Where he would be most affect for us is making stops at the line of scrimmage and most of the time he avoids getting there. It's either he's avoiding the tackling or he's just that bad reading plays.
Our run D is average because of him.

 

[CGI_Ram]

JL55 is a solid player on the field, albeit rarely has the big plays and is a tier down from the pro bowl. That's how I see it, anyway.

Where he excels is with the whole package; durability, leadership in the locker room, and calls the defense.

As fearsomefour points out, the big part of his contract has passed. He's worth the balance.

 

[FRO]

Laurinaitis isn't a star. He is a very solid MLB. I think people want Patrick Willis or Ray Lewis type play out of him. That's not going to happen. He isn't a splashy guy, rather just a solid performer.

 

[Mojo Ram]

Best we've had since London Fletcher, and I remember all the shitty MLB's we had in between.

 

[fearsomefour]

In all those misleading stats, how many are made at the line of scrimmage and for losses? I'm willing to bet he's among the lowest in the league in those categories for his position. What's the average yards gained by the time he tackles? He's never been a Pro Bowler. Not even an alternate. Why have Quinn and Aaron Donald made the Pro Bowl so quickly? It's because they get into the backfield and create havoc. It's the same reason Patrick Willis and Ray Lewis were in the Pro Bowl as many times as they were. They make minus yards contact.
I see TJ McDonald run stuffing more than JL55. We certainly don't want JL55 in coverage either. Too slow. Where he would be most affect for us is making stops at the line of scrimmage and most of the time he avoids getting there. It's either he's avoiding the tackling or he's just that bad reading plays.
Our run D is average because of him.

The stats I could find didn't have tackle for loss number, although I sure those are listed somewhere. Part of that could be scheme as well. But, I hear what you are saying. Taking tackles of loss out of the equation consistent tackles at 2 yards past the line of scrimmage or at 4 yards past the line of scrimmage is a big difference.

 

[fearsomefour]

So,
JL was 17th in tackles for loss in 2010 with 13.
In 2011 he was ranked 36th with 11.
2012 not on the list.
2013 he was 83rd with 8.
2014 not on the list.

 

[blue4]

In all those misleading stats, how many are made at the line of scrimmage and for losses? I'm willing to bet he's among the lowest in the league in those categories for his position. What's the average yards gained by the time he tackles? He's never been a Pro Bowler. Not even an alternate. Why have Quinn and Aaron Donald made the Pro Bowl so quickly? It's because they get into the backfield and create havoc. It's the same reason Patrick Willis and Ray Lewis were in the Pro Bowl as many times as they were. They make minus yards contact.
I see TJ McDonald run stuffing more than JL55. We certainly don't want JL55 in coverage either. Too slow. Where he would be most affect for us is making stops at the line of scrimmage and most of the time he avoids getting there. It's either he's avoiding the tackling or he's just that bad reading plays.
Our run D is average because of him.

You call tackles and turnovers misleading, then talk about pro bowls? Quite possibly the most overrated accolade out there.

Also how can a guy finish with that many tackles if he doesn't go near the LOS? The defense can barely line up without him, but he can't read plays?

I certainly don't see TJ run tackling more than JL, unless he got all those tackles on pass plays.

We have havoc creating guys in the backfield already. If everyone was in the backfield all the time we'd give up 40 big plays a game.

And finally, this guy has never left the field for multiple coaching staffs. How can he suck so bad if every coach he has had won't take him off the field?

 

[Memphis Ram]

Where he excels is with the whole package; durability, leadership in the locker room, and calls the defense.

That's JL in a nutshell. He's also pretty decent with his zone drops and proved to be an effective blitzer last year, too. Surprised me.

The issue many, including myself, have with him, however, is his run defense. Specifically, it's simply not very often we've seen him diagnose a run play and make a tackle for loss. Or take on a blocker and make a tackle at the line of scrimmage. Or simply meet a RB in the hole and bring him down. It's never been his game and it has hurt the teams run defense, IMO.

 

[Mojo Ram]

Best we've had since London Fletcher, and I remember all the crappy MLB's we had in between.

And he's durable.

 

[Mister Sin]

I will say, I wish i had a MLB that was more athletic and made the big play, but i will not complain about having such a team player and team leader that is consistent as JL has been. When the time comes that we part, i hope to bring in an athletic freak, but he is a ram for life to me.

 

[Fatbot]

In all those misleading stats, how many are made at the line of scrimmage and for losses? ...

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/stuffs-and-stuff-yards/2014/

A 'stuff' is defined as the defense denying a running play at (or before) the line of scrimmage.

Stuffs by year:
JAMES LAURINAITIS
2009- 3
2010- 7
2011- 9
2012- 4
2013- 5
2014- 2
6 yrs, 30 stuffs = 5 stuffs/yr

PATRICK WILLIS
2007- 7
2008- 4
2009- 5
2010- 0
2011- 3
2012- 3
2013- 2
7 yrs, 24 stuffs = 3.4 stuffs/yr

 

[Memphis Ram]

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/stuffs-and-stuff-yards/2014/

A 'stuff' is defined as the defense denying a running play at (or before) the line of scrimmage.

Stuffs by year:
JAMES LAURINAITIS
2009- 3
2010- 7
2011- 9
2012- 4
2013- 5
2014- 2
6 yrs, 30 stuffs = 5 stuffs/yr

PATRICK WILLIS
2007- 7
2008- 4
2009- 5
2010- 0
2011- 3
2012- 3
2013- 2
7 yrs, 24 stuffs = 3.4 stuffs/yr

To be fair, Willis plays in a 3-4 defense and has had Bowman and I believe Takeo Spikes playing ILB with him during that time span.

 

[blue4]

To be fair, Willis plays in a 3-4 defense and has had Bowman and I believe Takeo Spikes playing ILB with him during that time span.

True, but it does shoot a hole in the "he can't play at the line of scrimmage" argument. After all, some of these things we get on JL about are somewhat scheme related as well. Especially when we are in the big nickel. Those charging the LOS plays are kind of Barron's and the safeties job sometimes.

 

[Memphis Ram]

True, but it does shoot a hole in the "he can't play at the line of scrimmage" argument. After all, some of these things we get on JL about are somewhat scheme related as well. Especially when we are in the big nickel. Those charging the LOS plays are kind of Barron's and the safeties job sometimes.

I disagree with your first sentence.
But, I agree with everything else.

Another thing to consider is the number of snaps these guys get as more snaps provides more opportunities. And I'm not talking about coaching decisions. I'm referring to a defense's ability to get off the field.

 

[Dxmissile]

In all those misleading stats, how many are made at the line of scrimmage and for losses? I'm willing to bet he's among the lowest in the league in those categories for his position. What's the average yards gained by the time he tackles? He's never been a Pro Bowler. Not even an alternate. Why have Quinn and Aaron Donald made the Pro Bowl so quickly? It's because they get into the backfield and create havoc. It's the same reason Patrick Willis and Ray Lewis were in the Pro Bowl as many times as they were. They make minus yards contact.
I see TJ McDonald run stuffing more than JL55. We certainly don't want JL55 in coverage either. Too slow. Where he would be most affect for us is making stops at the line of scrimmage and most of the time he avoids getting there. It's either he's avoiding the tackling or he's just that bad reading plays.
Our run D is average because of him.

You see TJ at the line of scrimmage because it's called scheme. JL primary job was always to patrol the middle of the field. That's why they have olgetree and now Ayers to attack the line of scrimmage GW will send Laurinaitis on occasion and he gets there. I think a lot of people are confusing a 4-3 linebacker with linebackers in a 3-4 scheme. Get over it.. people love Luke kuetchly but he is the king of assisted tackles.. how many 4-3 ilb are better?

 

[lockdnram21]

Overrated period

 

[Dxmissile]

That's JL in a nutshell. He's also pretty decent with his zone drops and proved to be an effective blitzer last year, too. Surprised me.

The issue many, including myself, have with him, however, is his run defense. Specifically, it's simply not very often we've seen him diagnose a run play and make a tackle for loss. Or take on a blocker and make a tackle at the line of scrimmage. Or simply meet a RB in the hole and bring him down. It's never been his game and it has hurt the teams run defense, IMO.

Simply put olgetree is horrible in run defense so maybe it's not JL that's missing assignments maybe just maybe it's the still raw ATHLETIC lb we have playing next to him