Jeff Fisher

[thirteen28]

This might all be well and true

But doesn't change the fact we can't tackle, cover , not foul, or develop players
Same can be said for Cleveland but they seem to have a winning record despite all the ugliness

I wouldn't necessarily agree with those points. Our secondary is tackling much better this season. We have several players that have developed quite nicely, most notably Brian Quick, but he's not the only one. And every team commits fouls, and in this day and age of football, it's harder not to do so with the ridiculous overemphasis on player safety that turns a routine arm brushing the QB's shoulder pad into a personal foul for roughing the passer.

What we can't seem to do right now is

a) figure out why our pass rushers can't get to the QB (some good scheme related theories on this board though)
b) pass block
c) put together a complete 60 minute game where our mistakes are few and minimized and
d) not get hosed by a soul-crushing call/non-call at a crucial point in a game.

Unfortunately, we only have control over the first three.

 

[jrry32]

Yep, forgot about those, particularly the first one. And that one occurred well before the Vikings had gained any real momentum.

Just rewatched the Cook play and McDonald play on coach's film. The same asswad ref flagged both of those plays. The humorous thing? Vernon Davis did something similar to what Cook did except he actually extended his arm into McDonald's upper body(maybe even the neck/face because TJ's head snapped back) to create separation(what he did could have actually been called a penalty if you were being ticky tack). Yet this same cocksucker that flagged Cook decided to flag McDonald for holding on this play...and McDonald did exactly what Perrish Cox did on the play where Cook was flagged.

It's laughable. I cannot believe the hypocrisy those two plays show. I want to punch that guy in the face.

 

[thirteen28]

Just rewatched the Cook play and McDonald play on coach's film. The same asswad ref flagged both of those plays. The humorous thing? Vernon Davis did something similar to what Cook did except he actually extended his arm into McDonald's upper body(maybe even the neck/face because TJ's head snapped back) to create separation(what he did could have actually been called a penalty if you were being ticky tack). Yet this same puking flesh weasel that flagged Cook decided to flag McDonald for holding on this play...and McDonald did exactly what Perrish Cox did on the play where Cook was flagged.

It's laughable. I cannot believe the hypocrisy those two plays show. I want to punch that guy in the face.

Get in line.

 

[Stranger]

Just rewatched the Cook play and McDonald play on coach's film. The same asswad ref flagged both of those plays. The humorous thing? Vernon Davis did something similar to what Cook did except he actually extended his arm into McDonald's upper body(maybe even the neck/face because TJ's head snapped back) to create separation(what he did could have actually been called a penalty if you were being ticky tack). Yet this same puking flesh weasel that flagged Cook decided to flag McDonald for holding on this play...and McDonald did exactly what Perrish Cox did on the play where Cook was flagged.

It's laughable. I cannot believe the hypocrisy those two plays show. I want to punch that guy in the face.

Is it the same ref who has the s-eating-grin on his face after Lloyd scored the long TD?

 

[Stranger]

I wouldn't necessarily agree with those points. Our secondary is tackling much better this season. We have several players that have developed quite nicely, most notably Brian Quick, but he's not the only one. And every team commits fouls, and in this day and age of football, it's harder not to do so with the ridiculous overemphasis on player safety that turns a routine arm brushing the QB's shoulder pad into a personal foul for roughing the passer.

What we can't seem to do right now is

a) figure out why our pass rushers can't get to the QB (some good scheme related theories on this board though)
b) pass block
c) put together a complete 60 minute game where our mistakes are few and minimized and
d) not get hosed by a soul-crushing call/non-call at a crucial point in a game.

Unfortunately, we only have control over the first three.

• I think we only have control over "b" in that list.
• We already know the answer to "a", but can't do anything about it.
• "c" is impossible in Goodhell's NFL.
• And "d" is the same as "c"

 

[Dieter the Brock]

I wouldn't necessarily agree with those points. Our secondary is tackling much better this season. We have several players that have developed quite nicely, most notably Brian Quick, but he's not the only one. And every team commits fouls, and in this day and age of football, it's harder not to do so with the ridiculous overemphasis on player safety that turns a routine arm brushing the QB's shoulder pad into a personal foul for roughing the passer.

What we can't seem to do right now is

a) figure out why our pass rushers can't get to the QB (some good scheme related theories on this board though)
b) pass block
c) put together a complete 60 minute game where our mistakes are few and minimized and
d) not get hosed by a soul-crushing call/non-call at a crucial point in a game.

Unfortunately, we only have control over the first three.

My comment was in relation to the list The Stranger wrote,

There are things on his list the Rams team could neutralize or avoid entirely if they would just put it together on the field, and do anything from my list or yours, i mean take your pick, a, b, or c. If they would pass block better, figure out why our pass rushers can't get to the QB, to my opinion that players are being underdeveloped like with Tavon

I'm just saying if what The Stranger is saying is true - then the players and coaches are making if mighty easy for the so-called "powers that be" to keep this team down. So until the Rams put it together on the field the list The Stranger wrote is completely irrelevant. It's only relevant when the Rams start to win as a team. And stop committing so many damn penalties

 

[Stranger]

My comment was in relation to the list The Stranger wrote,

There are things on his list the Rams team could neutralize or avoid entirely if they would just put it together on the field, and do anything from my list or yours, i mean take your pick, a, b, or c. If they would pass block better, figure out why our pass rushers can't get to the QB, to my opinion that players are being underdeveloped like with Tavon

I'm just saying if what The Stranger is saying is true - then the players and coaches are making if mighty easy for the so-called "powers that be" to keep this team down. So until the Rams put it together on the field the list The Stranger wrote is completely irrelevant. It's only relevant when the Rams start to win as a team. And stop committing so many damn penalties

My point is it's irrelevant what the team does on the field. If the 2001 Patriots team, which had no business being in the playoffs that year, can be handed a SB over one of the best offenses the league has ever seen, then this Rams team can easily be kept from winning, no matter what Fisher, Williams or the players do.

All the frustration we're witnessing on the field is nothing more than an extension of the same feeling we're exhibiting on this forum. It's unfair, it's unproveable, and it's not something we're allowed to talk about. Hence, emotions spill-out in the only outlets available.

 

[thirteen28]

My comment was in relation to the list The Stranger wrote,

There are things on his list the Rams team could neutralize or avoid entirely if they would just put it together on the field, and do anything from my list or yours, i mean take your pick, a, b, or c. If they would pass block better, figure out why our pass rushers can't get to the QB, to my opinion that players are being underdeveloped like with Tavon

I'm just saying if what The Stranger is saying is true - then the players and coaches are making if mighty easy for the so-called "powers that be" to keep this team down. So until the Rams put it together on the field the list The Stranger wrote is completely irrelevant. It's only relevant when the Rams start to win as a team. And stop committing so many damn penalties

Ok, I gotcha now. thanks for clarifying.

Although I'm going to amend your last statement to stop committing so many legitimate penalties

 

[blue4]

This might all be well and true

But doesn't change the fact we can't tackle, cover , not foul, or develop players
Same can be said for Cleveland but they seem to have a winning record despite all the ugliness

Cleveland became relevant to ESPN and the NFL Network when they drafted the sideshow Johnny Football. I've heard teams complain about extremely uneven officiating, but I've watched a couple Browns games. No mistakes there. And now they are winning, with about half the overall talent we have? Yes, it could just be their rookie HC is just that good, or it could be a team that's allowed to compete in a fair contest. No other game can be turned on a well timed call like football. You can't suddenly go from 0 strikes to 2 in baseball, which is basically what a 10 yrd bogus OPI call does to you. You can't strike a man out, and then watch him trot to first on a bogus "roughing the batter" call.

It may be just our bad luck, it may be not be dirty. But there's quite a lot of shady calls that the league can't/won't explain other than "oops." You can't tell me that the head ref can't look at a damn jumbo screen and see that a foul is bogus and pick a flag up, or that another ref can't overrule a foul call. That's stretching credibility too far, IMO. It's right there to see if anyone was interested.

 

[Stranger]

Cleveland became relevant to ESPN and the NFL Network when they drafted the sideshow Johnny Football. I've heard teams complain about extremely uneven officiating, but I've watched a couple Browns games. No mistakes there. And now they are winning, with about half the overall talent we have? Yes, it could just be their rookie HC is just that good, or it could be a team that's allowed to compete in a fair contest. No other game can be turned on a well timed call like football. You can't suddenly go from 0 strikes to 2 in baseball, which is basically what a 10 yrd bogus OPI call does to you. You can't strike a man out, and then watch him trot to first on a bogus "roughing the batter" call.

It may be just our bad luck, it may be not be dirty. But there's quite a lot of shady calls that the league can't/won't explain other than "oops." You can't tell me that the head ref can't look at a damn jumbo screen and see that a foul is bogus and pick a flag up, or that another ref can't overrule a foul call. That's stretching credibility too far, IMO. It's right there to see if anyone was interested.

You bring up a good point. I wonder if the NFL would have taken their boot off our throats had we drafted Johnny Football?

 

[jrry32]

You bring up a good point. I wonder if the NFL would have taken their boot off our throats had we drafted Johnny Football?

I'll bet you this, if the Rams move to LA, the refereeing will suddenly get a lot more favorable.

 

[Stranger]

I'll bet you this, if the Rams move to LA, the refereeing will suddenly get a lot more favorable.

i would never take that bet - i totally agree with u.

 

[fearsomefour]

The NFL is a social engineering tool that sidelines as an entertainment business. They've hired the son of a NY Senator to run things, and I'm sure he's well versed in the tactics. The goals are multi-fold. Let's speculate on some of them, shall we:

• Personal - Goodhell & Owners are exerting their power over a franchise that departed from the wishes of the owner's cartel and departed the LA Market (just ask Al Davis & the Raiders how vindictive the NFL cartel can be).
• Personal - Goodhell is targeting DC Williams, as this is part of his continued punishment
• Market - Goodhell is attempting to weaken Kroenke's position with StL gov't re: a renegotiated stadium deal by weakening local fan base & fan revenues through repetitive losing seasons. This is part of a larger agenda to "pursuade" Kroenke to move the Rams back to LA
• Power - certain owners, and their teams, get preferential treatment based upon their connections. The Rooney family is a great example of this (US Ambassador, Hollywood celebrities, relevant business circles). Kroenke & Roosenbloom aren't in the right circles.
• Social - Televised sports today is an analog for power relationships. Cheering for a team is a way of building into people irrational submissiveness to power... a form of creating passive submission to formal authority structures. Artificially improving the performance of some teams over others increases the fan base of these higher performing teams, making those team's cities more appealing, more powerful, and their fanbase more submissive. StL is no longer important from a geopolitical or global business perspective, but San Francisco & Los Angeles most certainly are. Hence, it's critical that the populations in these regions be more submission to power than populations in regions that are relatively unimportant.
• Marketing - the NFL marketing department seeks to manage outcomes in order to provide a media story consistent with marketing goals in order to increase positive media attention, increase reach & therefore revenues

Is this enough to get the conversation moving in a more serious direction?

If Goodell wanted to continue to punish Williams all he had to do was not reinstate him.
As for the rest.......um......

 

[dhaab]

It was partially deflated after the phantom PI that crushed their offensive momentum and turned a probable score into a punt. The rest was done on the TD pass. The swag was already gone by that time, it was time to regroup.

Yeah, but how mentally weak can this team be at this point? I mean, they almost remind me of the Fighting Illini football team. If just one thing goes wrong, many of them become timid and stop playing hard. It's bizarre for me to see professional players performing that way. Overall, I think it all goes to the head coach. This team has no swagger and the team leaders don't know how to get their teammates to battle back the momentum once it's lost.

 

[thirteen28]

Yeah, but how mentally weak can this team be at this point? I mean, they almost remind me of the Fighting Illini football team. If just one thing goes wrong, many of them become timid and stop playing hard. It's bizarre for me to see professional players performing that way. Overall, I think it all goes to the head coach. This team has no swagger and the team leaders don't know how to get their teammates to battle back the momentum once it's lost.

This team that you call mentally weak did overcome the bad calls in week 2 against Tampa Bay. And the most evenly officiated game, in Philly, this team you call mentally weak fell behind on the road 34-7 and came back to make it a one score game, and was within one or two plays of winning.

The problem is not that there is just a random bad call here or there. The problem is that there is a consistent and persistent pattern of egregiously bad calls against the Rams, ones that come at critical junctures of the game and change the flow and momentum. And when it happens that consistently and persistently, when it's not a random thing but a pattern, it would get into anyone's head, even a seasoned professional. The team leaders got their teammates to battle back after the momentum was lost in Philly, and did so big time, but that's the ONE game this season where the officials didn't make some kind of horrendously bad momentum shifting call against us.

It's one thing when a team loses momentum because of their own mistakes or because the other team plays better. But it's entirely something else when a team is playing well and the officials arbitrarily and capriciously take away the momentum they have otherwise rightfully gained.