Is our owner a good guy?

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Mister Sin

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Don't think he is a good guy at all, but he is a great owner of this team. And that's the only light I care about honestly.
 

Selassie I

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Seems like the right decision from the court to me.

I don't like random people walking all through my yard either.
 

Ramhusker

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I don't know. I'd like to think if my land blocked public lakes maintained by everyone's tax dollars and I was filthy rich, I'd make a path of my choice for people to access them. I mean how much would it cost me in the grand scheme of things?
 

1maGoh

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I don't know. I'd like to think if my land blocked public lakes maintained by everyone's tax dollars and I was filthy rich, I'd make a path of my choice for people to access them. I mean how much would it cost me in the grand scheme of things?
Depends on how much land around the lakes he owns. 200ft in any direction? Not a big deal to build a path. The surround 10,000 acres? Yeah, I wouldn't want anybody getting that deep into my property either.

Of course, he should probably have to pay an exorbitant tax to cover 100% of the maintenance of them in that case. They are, in effect, now his personal lakes. I doubt the law is setup to handle these kinds of situations in that way though.
 

RamFan503

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There are a few things that come to mind.

It appears that they were arguing for hunting and fishing access. As an avid hunter and fisher, I can't access many bodies of water or hunting grounds that are owned by logging companies. And these properties change hands pretty regularly. When you see the crap left behind on the accessible areas, you can understand why an owner would want to keep people out. Nothin unusual there.

I also have to question how much "maintenance"of these waters has been performed with public tax dollars. Maybe a lot. Maybe none. We don't even know if the lakes were stocked by public entities.

I don't know Canadian law but in the US, if a property owner owns the land under a body of water - even those considered navigatable - he owns the rights to that body of water if he owns or purchases the water rights. That includes preventing others from using them. If it is a navigatable river, stream, creek, etc..., If a property owner owns the land on both sides of the water, he owns the land underneath it. While he can't stop you from fishing it, he can forbid you from anchoring on that stretch and/or standing on that land, whether you are standing in the water or not.

I have run into this a lot in Oregon and Washington. You are required to keep rowing while you are on private land and you cannot get out of your boat to fish until such spot that you are either on public land or the owner only owns land on one side of the water. Then you are allowed to walk areas of the normal high water mark.

I don't know if Stan is a nice guy or not. But if we catch people on our ranch trying to hunt or fish the small creeks, we will trespass them and have the authorities write them a trespass violation. If they are carrying a gun, that is a felony trespass.
 

RamFan503

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Of course, he should probably have to pay an exorbitant tax to cover 100% of the maintenance of them in that case. They are, in effect, now his personal lakes. I doubt the law is setup to handle these kinds of situations in that way though.
There's the thing though. I'm going to guess that he is maintaining them at likely a higher level than was done previously. Even if it's all about money, I'm guessing he wants to increase the value - not decrease it.

If the lakes are becoming stagnant, polluted, or if he is doing things that are in violation of clean water acts and such, the government would be able to force him to clean it up or cease what he is doing at HIS expense. I'm not sure for what he would be paying an exhorbitant tax.
 

Dodgersrf

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Isn't it a liability, if something happens to someone on his land?

I dont know about Canada, but it is here in CA.
 

OldSchool

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So reading through that it looks like it's all the Canadian government's fault. What kind of idiot sells off the land all around two public lakes without leaving any access to the public lakes.
 

RamFan503

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So reading through that it looks like it's all the Canadian government's fault. What kind of idiot sells off the land all around two public lakes without leaving any access to the public lakes.
I believe it was all private land when Stan bought it. I think he combined several smaller pieces to make one very large one.

In the case of the Waggoner Ranch he did pretty much the opposite. The family wanted to keep it all intact and all other potential buyers were going to divide it up. From what I recall, Stan was the only would be buyer to agree to keep it all in one ranch. It is a very historic ranch and the US' largest single ranch under one ownership.
 

Ramhusker

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Isn't it a liability, if something happens to someone on his land?

I dont know about Canada, but it is here in CA.
Yes, the smart thing to do would be to donate a piece of land for access if it weren’t a burden. Of course, who knows what the long term plans are for the property.
 

1maGoh

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There's the thing though. I'm going to guess that he is maintaining them at likely a higher level than was done previously. Even if it's all about money, I'm guessing he wants to increase the value - not decrease it.

If the lakes are becoming stagnant, polluted, or if he is doing things that are in violation of clean water acts and such, the government would be able to force him to clean it up or cease what he is doing at HIS expense. I'm not sure for what he would be paying an exhorbitant tax.
Someone had mentioned that the government was maintaining the land at taxpayer expense but he has exclusive use because he didn't have to let anyone else get to it. Whether or not that's accurate and what's happening, under circumstances where the government maintains something exclusively for one person I think that person paying for the maintenance by themselves is fair. That's especially true for a luxury item like a lake. If he's maintaining it himself, such a tax wouldn't be necessary.
 

dieterbrock

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"U.S. Billionaire Stan Kroenke Wins Fight to Kill Public Access to Lakes"


Yeah, that sure sounds like an unbiased, purely fact based article....