Gun purchase

[Ramhusker]

Thinking of buying new guns for the house. I want to buy a pistol and rifle of the same caliber to make things simple. Any suggestions? I know 22 caliber ammo is cheapest so target practice wouldn't be so expensive but the knock down power is a little questionable. Also, would love to fit said guns with suppressors. It would really be nice to shoot without having to wear hearing protection especially when you are trying to teach the family about handling and shooting guns. Anyone gone through that paperwork and tax nightmare? I hear it is a 4 to 6 month process with $200 to $300 in fees.

 

[Stranger]

Considered a shotgun for home protection?

http://personalsecurityzone.com/Shotgun_for_defense.htm

 

[bluecoconuts]

You want to get a rifle and a pistol that both shoot the same type of ammo? The only thing that I can think of would be to get an FN Five-Seven pistol (as it uses the 5.7x28mm round, which is basically a small rifle round) and then getting an AR-57 (which is basically an AR with an upper receiver designed to fire the 5.7x28 round).... Then you'd use the same bullets for both firearms.


As for suppressors, it's honestly more trouble than it's worth. Other than the expense and the paperwork issue, suppressors don't last forever, so after a certain amount of rounds through it, it wont work as well. I wouldn't personally recommend them. Their shelf life isn't long enough in my opinion, unless you're a police officer/military personnel who get them issued to you, I wouldn't use one.

Or an assassin.... Then by all means. :ww:



Also the FN Five-Seven is a wonderful pistol. I don't own one, but I've fired them a lot, and they're very good pistols, I'd recommend them.

 

[RamFan503]

I'm not sure I would limit your choices to those that would fire the same round. I suppose it would depend on what you want to use the rifle for. I think you can get a stock for a Ruger Judge. The judge shoots both a 45 caliber Colt round and a 410 shotgun round. Thompson Center offers a rifle/pistol combo but IMO, the pistol is too long for close in use.

My suggestion is that you should buy guns that match what your intention is not just because you don't want to confuse the rounds or buy more than one type of round. Whatever gun you purchase for home protection is either loaded or it might as well be a hammer.

I have several guns. They all have their own use. One of the posters suggested possibly a shotgun. The nice thing about that is that it has very good knock down capability and you don't have to be extremely accurate. It's not great for after the intruder gets in close but it is a pretty good choice and in all honesty, if you are not versed in close in use of a firearm, your odds of being able to defend yourself with a gun in that situation is not that great.

Don't think you can rely on a .22 for home protection. You get some meth head busting down your door and the .22 would likely only piss him off. Sure it is lethal but has almost no knock down power.

Above all, get your family to the range and get them comfortable shooting whatever you choose and if possible from several positions. And skip the suppressor. They wear out and make the gun clumsy.

 

[Ramhusker]

Thanks for the suggestions guys. I still tend to lean on "cheap ammo" options which is 22 caliber. I've thought about knock down punch against a crazed crack head. Then I thought a 22mag with a 30 round clip could still get his attention. I mean I send a volley of a dozen shells down the hallway, I like my chances of a lethal hit but the velocity concerns me. I mean I'd hate to hit a family member a couple of rooms over with a 22. The judge is a good option I know but it might be a touch too much for most in my family to handle. I'll probably settle on a Kel Tec 22 Mag pistol, Ruger 10/22 rifle with scope and maybe a 20 ga shotgun. I know, all three different ammos. Suppressors do seem to be a friggin headache and I'll probably won't go there though I really want too.

 

[DR RAM]

12 gauge shotgun for home protection. I like a pump action, the sound alone should send the intruder running, nothing like it.

9mm and .40 (more knockdown) for your handgun, the ammo is still cheap. And don't let money ever come in to make a decision as critical as this. Get the right gun, it will be in your family forever. Definitely do training with EVERYONE in family.

You don't want to be sending multiple rounds down the hallway...it's not safe, and you must be sure of your target.

I have a 10/22 Ruger it's a nice gun but for plinking and target practice only.

If you end up using a handgun for home defense, I'd recommend a revolver for someone with your limited experience. It's a point, pull and shoot gun, every time. Semi-auto's are cool, but there are a bunch of safeties, cocking, etc. Not for beginners in a tense situation. Stick with a brand name. Ruger, Smith and Wesson, Colt, etc. Don't buy a cheap gun.

I own 2 AR15's, 2 shotguns, 4 .22's, a .44 special, a WW2 P38, 9mm, etc.

It's not too much of a hassle buying weapons, but depending where you are there may be a wait period, and some fee's associated. I don't know where you got the 200 - 300 bucks, unless you are talking about certain weapons that you have to register with the ATF. Nevermind, you are talking about suppressors. Just get good ear protection. Headphones are pretty cheap now. Like these. http://www.amazon.com/Howard-Leight...QJ9O/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1338150344&sr=8-1

Any questions, I'd be glad to answer.

Be safe.

 

[Yamahopper]

Okay were talking guns!!! Woot.

I have 41 guns at this time, some I just collect some I shoot. I like my .223 rem. it's sweet to shoot and can really reach out and touch something. I have a hard on for coyotes right now since they killed the cat that lived in barn a couple years ago and I've used it to send more than 100 to coyote heaven. Since it doesn't have much of a kick it would be good to learn on.
I love to shoot my 300 Win mag. That is one evil mofo. Wicked kick but wow I've dropped bull elk where they stood at 400 yards. I could stand outside my house shoot though the outside wall, every wall in my house and into a neighbors house.

A 22LR would be the thing to train family on , cheap to shoot, no kick. Then move up to maybe a SKS 5.56 , the euro trash ammo is cheap but good. low kick and just a blast with a big clip. I just bought a Russian Mosin-Nagat at Cabeles for 89 bucks. 7.62mm and cheap ammo. Shoots great and I just bought a box of tracers to have a little fun with.

For home def. the thing to remember is you don't want anything that shoots through multiple walls, even one wall may be to many if you have multiple ppl. in your house. This eliminates a lot of choices. Rifles are long and hard to maneuver in close quarters. 410 works well, 12 gauge is good too, but you have to downsize the shot size. Buckshot can go through a wall or two and still kill someone you don't want dead. #4 shot works well. But just me I'd rather be shot with a 12 ga. of #4 than a 22. Don't underestimate the power of a 22, I've killed coyotes and bobcats with one shot. The main thing is lots of rounds in the mag cause once you pull the trigger you don't stop till the threat is over.
I have a Tarsus 9mm handy at all times but I have no kids or close neighbors so I can just let them fly. Hi-Point makes a great low cost 9mm. I have one and it works great. I carry it in my jeep at all times.

I'm not sure where you live, here in MO. we don't have a lot of rules. I have concealed carry permit and were allowed to carry loaded in our cars without a permit. Most of my guns are bought in estate sales and auctions so paper work free.

 

[Ramhusker]

Thanks guys. It's been awhile since I've been around guns much. I was a marksman with the M-16 and I used to own a 357 that was awful accurate. My family is not gun savvy so a 22 is the best to buy first so they can shoot. Heck, I can get nearly 3000 rounds for $100 bucks. No other ammo comes close and I know getting hit with a 22 in the right place is the worst. If it were just me, I'd probably get a Taurus Judge. Love the idea of a pistol bringing a 410 shell to the party. I think a 38 is a good fit for the wife. I just don't want her using it on me! :whome?:

One more question though. Does a 22 Magnum hollow point travel through walls as bad as a 22LR? I know it has much better knock down punch but I'm thinking maybe it would mushroom out much more and maybe not have as much velocity thus not travel through walls as bad???

 

[RamFan503]

Thanks guys. It's been awhile since I've been around guns much. I was a marksman with the M-16 and I used to own a 357 that was awful accurate. My family is not gun savvy so a 22 is the best to buy first so they can shoot. Heck, I can get nearly 3000 rounds for $100 bucks. No other ammo comes close and I know getting hit with a 22 in the right place is the worst. If it were just me, I'd probably get a Taurus Judge. Love the idea of a pistol bringing a 410 shell to the party. I think a 38 is a good fit for the wife. I just don't want her using it on me! :whome?:

One more question though. Does a 22 Magnum hollow point travel through walls as bad as a 22LR? I know it has much better knock down punch but I'm thinking maybe it would mushroom out much more and maybe not have as much velocity thus not travel through walls as bad???

Talking dry wall and insulation - so I don't think there would really be much difference. I suppose you will get some mushrooming with a hollow point but it's not stopping unless you hit lumber. Yamahooper brings up some good points though. 22s are great for the family to learn with. Yeah they can be lethal but that's all about bullet placement - generally not a luxury you have in self defense situations.

As Doc said, wheel guns (revolvers) are great and ultra reliable. I have several of them. A 357 is nice because you can train with 38s and have 357s for protection rounds. I bought my wife a nice little Taurus 357 and she loves it. She can handle it quite well with either round. It is not too big of a frame for her hand either. And you can pick them up for a good price. Whatever you get, make sure that if it is used, it is nice and tight and that the action is clean and crisp. The wheel should spin free and smooth.

I have a little Taurus Millennium Pro in 40 cal. that I use for home protection and concealed carry. It has good knock down power and has 2 ten round clips. Still if I had to choose one hand gun for home protection, it would be a 357 revolver. And a shotgun is the other great choice. I know if I heard the sound of a pump being racked, I'd be looking for a way out.

 

[RamFan503]

Okay were talking guns!!! Woot.

I have 41 guns at this time, some I just collect some I shoot. I like my .223 rem. it's sweet to shoot and can really reach out and touch something. I have a hard on for coyotes right now since they killed the cat that lived in barn a couple years ago and I've used it to send more than 100 to coyote heaven. Since it doesn't have much of a kick it would be good to learn on.
I love to shoot my 300 Win mag. That is one evil mofo. Wicked kick but wow I've dropped bull elk where they stood at 400 yards.

Hey Yam - you have elk in MO or do you hunt elsewhere? You have a few more guns that I but I love my Sako 300 Ultra Mag for the same reason you love your Win Mag. I can load anything from 125 grain (4200 fps - wee!) on up to 220 grain bullets for it so I rarely get out any of my other guns when it comes hunting time. I've taken bear, deer, elk, pigs, a bobcat, and even coyotes with it. I'm just so damn comfortable with it that I have a hard time rationalizing using anything else.

 

[Memento]

Okay were talking guns!!! Woot.

I have 41 guns at this time, some I just collect some I shoot. I like my .223 rem. it's sweet to shoot and can really reach out and touch something. I have a hard on for coyotes right now since they killed the cat that lived in barn a couple years ago and I've used it to send more than 100 to coyote heaven. Since it doesn't have much of a kick it would be good to learn on.
I love to shoot my 300 Win mag. That is one evil mofo. Wicked kick but wow I've dropped bull elk where they stood at 400 yards.

Hey Yam - you have elk in MO or do you hunt elsewhere? You have a few more guns that I but I love my Sako 300 Ultra Mag for the same reason you love your Win Mag. I can load anything from 125 grain (4200 fps - wee!) on up to 220 grain bullets for it so I rarely get out any of my other guns when it comes hunting time. I've taken bear, deer, elk, pigs, a bobcat, and even coyotes with it. I'm just so damn comfortable with it that I have a hard time rationalizing using anything else.

Nope, I don't think there are elk in Missouri; we're too far south. We do have a serious deer problem, though. I wish that elk lived in my state; elk meat - as well as bison and deer meat - is absolutely delicious...

 

[-X-]

You ... ... ... ... hunters. :nono:

 

[Yamahopper]

Okay were talking guns!!! Woot.

I have 41 guns at this time, some I just collect some I shoot. I like my .223 rem. it's sweet to shoot and can really reach out and touch something. I have a hard on for coyotes right now since they killed the cat that lived in barn a couple years ago and I've used it to send more than 100 to coyote heaven. Since it doesn't have much of a kick it would be good to learn on.
I love to shoot my 300 Win mag. That is one evil mofo. Wicked kick but wow I've dropped bull elk where they stood at 400 yards.

Hey Yam - you have elk in MO or do you hunt elsewhere? You have a few more guns that I but I love my Sako 300 Ultra Mag for the same reason you love your Win Mag. I can load anything from 125 grain (4200 fps - wee!) on up to 220 grain bullets for it so I rarely get out any of my other guns when it comes hunting time. I've taken bear, deer, elk, pigs, a bobcat, and even coyotes with it. I'm just so damn comfortable with it that I have a hard time rationalizing using anything else.

No we don't have elk here, though they are reintroducing them which is a huge mistake. Back in the 80's I was into hunting big time. I used to go to CO. or WY most years to hunt elk. I got two 4x4's and a cow plus assorted deer. The cow I shot with a 30-06 and had to track it for a mile.
All we got here is whitetail and I kill more with my muzzleloader and bow than with a gun. my 300 mag is just to big for that, messes too much meat up. Beside my personal war on coyotes about the only other thing I hunt is feral hogs. South of me is really infested with them awful things, so a bunch of us go down and thin them out. I've shot them with a 30-30 and a 30-06 and had them just squeal and run off. The .300 mag blows them up.

I have run some ultramags thru my bolt action 700 but not my Browning BAR. They are seriously more potent than reg. ammo. Most of my ammo comes from a friend that reloads and they are a little hotter than off the shelf rounds. But they don't compare to the ultra's.

I don't really have many guns of great value, and to me there like golf clubs....a perfect one for each shot.

But some of my Favs.

M1 Garand. A hoot to shoot. And I know the back story of it from WWII. Just weirds me out to shoot a gun that I know has killed people.
My western auto 30-30. Just fun. And it never ever jams.
My Browning BAR. 300 mag. If you want to F something up this is the gun for it. Beat to hell when I got it but still works great.
Marlin .444. 265 grains of lead. Makes a huge hole.
Colt 45. It's a copy made in Brazil but still fun.
Had a Sharps 45-110. Was fun but at $5 a shot not that much fun.

 

[Yamahopper]

You ... ... ... ... hunters. :nono:

That's about 6 big pots of deer chilli right there.

 

[RamFan503]

You ... ... ... ... hunters. :nono:

That's about 6 big pots of deer chilli right there.

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

 

[RamFan503]

Okay were talking guns!!! Woot.

I have 41 guns at this time, some I just collect some I shoot. I like my .223 rem. it's sweet to shoot and can really reach out and touch something. I have a hard on for coyotes right now since they killed the cat that lived in barn a couple years ago and I've used it to send more than 100 to coyote heaven. Since it doesn't have much of a kick it would be good to learn on.
I love to shoot my 300 Win mag. That is one evil mofo. Wicked kick but wow I've dropped bull elk where they stood at 400 yards.

Hey Yam - you have elk in MO or do you hunt elsewhere? You have a few more guns that I but I love my Sako 300 Ultra Mag for the same reason you love your Win Mag. I can load anything from 125 grain (4200 fps - wee!) on up to 220 grain bullets for it so I rarely get out any of my other guns when it comes hunting time. I've taken bear, deer, elk, pigs, a bobcat, and even coyotes with it. I'm just so damn comfortable with it that I have a hard time rationalizing using anything else.

No we don't have elk here, though they are reintroducing them which is a huge mistake. Back in the 80's I was into hunting big time. I used to go to CO. or WY most years to hunt elk. I got two 4x4's and a cow plus assorted deer. The cow I shot with a 30-06 and had to track it for a mile.
All we got here is whitetail and I kill more with my muzzleloader and bow than with a gun. my 300 mag is just to big for that, messes too much meat up. Beside my personal war on coyotes about the only other thing I hunt is feral hogs. South of me is really infested with them awful things, so a bunch of us go down and thin them out. I've shot them with a 30-30 and a 30-06 and had them just squeal and run off. The .300 mag blows them up.

I have run some ultramags thru my bolt action 700 but not my Browning BAR. They are seriously more potent than reg. ammo. Most of my ammo comes from a friend that reloads and they are a little hotter than off the shelf rounds. But they don't compare to the ultra's.

I don't really have many guns of great value, and to me there like golf clubs....a perfect one for each shot.

But some of my Favs.

M1 Garand. A hoot to shoot. And I know the back story of it from WWII. Just weirds me out to shoot a gun that I know has killed people.
My western auto 30-30. Just fun. And it never ever jams.
My Browning BAR. 300 mag. If you want to F something up this is the gun for it. Beat to hell when I got it but still works great.
Marlin .444. 265 grains of lead. Makes a huge hole.
Colt 45. It's a copy made in Brazil but still fun.
Had a Sharps 45-110. Was fun but at $5 a shot not that much fun.

Cool stuff. Looks like we derailed another post. Oh well.

Yeah - I bow hunt a fair amount. My father in law used to make long bows and re-curves when he was still kicking. So I got into traditional archery pretty heavy. Still haven't taken a pig with one yet though. I've taken deer and elk and my first kill was actually a rat. Stuck him right to the side of my wife's studio from 25 yards. Pretty damn good shot for no sights if you ask me. My buddy and I laughed for hours. I am all about quick kills any time possible but watching that damn rat run around the arrow was frickin hilarious. God I hate rats!

Anyway, my biggest gun and mistake of a gun purchase is my 454 Cassul (sp?). It is fun to shoot 45s through but when you put a 320 grain bullet in ANY hand gun it is just no fun to shoot. So is that Colt 45 of yours a Taurus? Or is it a Colt knock off? I love my Garand. Kind of useless as tits on a duck for me but fun to shoot none the less. Mine has never been in combat though.

My dad has a massive gun collection (fellow Ram fan). He actually has a revolutionary war cannon out in front of his house that we shoot off every July 4th and New Years. Sans the cannon ball of course. My favorite of his guns is a lever action that was carried by one of Teddy Roosevelt's Rough Riders.

 

[Yamahopper]

Okay were talking guns!!! Woot.

I have 41 guns at this time, some I just collect some I shoot. I like my .223 rem. it's sweet to shoot and can really reach out and touch something. I have a hard on for coyotes right now since they killed the cat that lived in barn a couple years ago and I've used it to send more than 100 to coyote heaven. Since it doesn't have much of a kick it would be good to learn on.
I love to shoot my 300 Win mag. That is one evil mofo. Wicked kick but wow I've dropped bull elk where they stood at 400 yards.

Hey Yam - you have elk in MO or do you hunt elsewhere? You have a few more guns that I but I love my Sako 300 Ultra Mag for the same reason you love your Win Mag. I can load anything from 125 grain (4200 fps - wee!) on up to 220 grain bullets for it so I rarely get out any of my other guns when it comes hunting time. I've taken bear, deer, elk, pigs, a bobcat, and even coyotes with it. I'm just so damn comfortable with it that I have a hard time rationalizing using anything else.

No we don't have elk here, though they are reintroducing them which is a huge mistake. Back in the 80's I was into hunting big time. I used to go to CO. or WY most years to hunt elk. I got two 4x4's and a cow plus assorted deer. The cow I shot with a 30-06 and had to track it for a mile.
All we got here is whitetail and I kill more with my muzzleloader and bow than with a gun. my 300 mag is just to big for that, messes too much meat up. Beside my personal war on coyotes about the only other thing I hunt is feral hogs. South of me is really infested with them awful things, so a bunch of us go down and thin them out. I've shot them with a 30-30 and a 30-06 and had them just squeal and run off. The .300 mag blows them up.

I have run some ultramags thru my bolt action 700 but not my Browning BAR. They are seriously more potent than reg. ammo. Most of my ammo comes from a friend that reloads and they are a little hotter than off the shelf rounds. But they don't compare to the ultra's.

I don't really have many guns of great value, and to me there like golf clubs....a perfect one for each shot.

But some of my Favs.

M1 Garand. A hoot to shoot. And I know the back story of it from WWII. Just weirds me out to shoot a gun that I know has killed people.
My western auto 30-30. Just fun. And it never ever jams.
My Browning BAR. 300 mag. If you want to F something up this is the gun for it. Beat to hell when I got it but still works great.
Marlin .444. 265 grains of lead. Makes a huge hole.
Colt 45. It's a copy made in Brazil but still fun.
Had a Sharps 45-110. Was fun but at $5 a shot not that much fun.

Cool stuff. Looks like we derailed another post. Oh well.

Yeah - I bow hunt a fair amount. My father in law used to make long bows and re-curves when he was still kicking. So I got into traditional archery pretty heavy. Still haven't taken a pig with one yet though. I've taken deer and elk and my first kill was actually a rat. Stuck him right to the side of my wife's studio from 25 yards. Pretty damn good shot for no sights if you ask me. My buddy and I laughed for hours. I am all about quick kills any time possible but watching that damn rat run around the arrow was frickin hilarious. God I hate rats!

Anyway, my biggest gun and mistake of a gun purchase is my 454 Cassul (sp?). It is fun to shoot 45s through but when you put a 320 grain bullet in ANY hand gun it is just no fun to shoot. So is that Colt 45 of yours a Taurus? Or is it a Colt knock off? I love my Garand. Kind of useless as tits on a duck for me but fun to shoot none the less. Mine has never been in combat though.

My dad has a massive gun collection (fellow Ram fan). He actually has a revolutionary war cannon out in front of his house that we shoot off every July 4th and New Years. Sans the cannon ball of course. My favorite of his guns is a lever action that was carried by one of Teddy Roosevelt's Rough Riders.

That was a good shot on the rat :lmao: :lmao:
My Colt is a knock off, RG I think, but shoots very well. Best part about it is it has fake pearl handles so I always look like I just came from a whorehouse when I carry it.

My worst gun experience was when I bought a black powder navy pistol from Bass Pro. The first shot set the sleeve of my coat on fire. That was it for that gun.
The only thing I still want to hunt is a Bison. Permits are hard to get and expensive. But still would be fun and good eating.

Sounds like a great collection he has. I'd love to have a cannon.

 

[RamFan503]

The only thing I still want to hunt is a Bison. Permits are hard to get and expensive. But still would be fun and good eating.

A Bison hunt would be cool. I was doing hunter sight in at the range I used to belong to and a couple guys I helped chart shots for were filming their sight in and then were going on a Bison hunt that was supposed to air on one of the outdoor channels. Not sure if it ever did but they said they were going to include a spot on the sighting in of the rifles. If they did, I might be famous in Bison hunting circles. :jerkoff: :7up:

Some day I'll probably do that hunt. I just got invited to an elk hunt on a private 44,000 acre ranch coming up in October. Lookin' for my 300 UM to rock some poor elk's world. Meat in the freezer baby. :bangin:

 

[Username]

Thing about using shotguns (or rifles for that matter) for home protection is that the barrel doesn't allow for you to safely turn a corner.

 

[Ramhusker]

Thing about using shotguns (or rifles for that matter) for home protection is that the barrel doesn't allow for you to safely turn a corner.

Unless....... :hehe: