Former NFL QB Erik Kramer attempts suicide

[Prime Time]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...-for-injuries-after-reported-suicide-attempt/

Ex-QB Erik Kramer treated for injuries after reported suicide attempt
Posted by Zac Jackson on August 20, 2015

Getty Images

Ex-NFL quarterback Erik Kramer was being treated for injuries Wednesday night after a reported suicide attempt at a Los Angeles-area motel.

Kramer reportedly shot himself Wednesday evening, but his injuries were not considered life threatening.

His former wife told NBC News she believes Kramer is suffering from depression in part as a result of head injuries suffered during his football career.

“He is a very amazing man, a beautiful soul, but he has suffered depression since he was with the Bears,” Marshawn Kramer told NBC News. “I can promise you he is not the same man I married.”

Kramer, 50, helped the Lions to a 12-4 record in 1991 before later playing for the Bears and then the Chargers. A Los Angeles native, he broke into the NFL with the Falcons and also played in the CFL before playing in 13 games and throwing 11 touchdown passes with the Lions in 1991. He threw 29 touchdown passes for the Bears in 1995.

Kramer later worked as an analyst for FOX and on Bears preseason broadcasts.

In 2011, Kramer’s son, Griffen, was found dead during his senior year of high school of a drug overdose.

 

[Ram65]

I remember Kramer some...had to look up his stats.He was 6-2 in 1991 with the Lion. He was 9-7 as a starter with the Bears in 1995. I guess he was a part-time starter and backup QB most of his career. Sad to hear about his son's death and his depression. Hope he gets good help.

 

[Legatron4]

I just can't buy that head injuries result in deep depression like that. It is 99% because of his son. And that's what I feel terrible for. I'm in the very small minority that believes most of these guys had issues before they even played football. I know it has some added effect, but the guy barely saw the field. Probably not a popular opinion, but I stand by it.

 

[bskrilla]

I just can't buy that head injuries result in deep depression like that. It is 99% because of his son. And that's what I feel terrible for. I'm in the very small minority that believes most of these guys had issues before they even played football. I know it has some added effect, but the guy barely saw the field. Probably not a popular opinion, but I stand by it.

It's not a popular opinion because the medical evidence seems pretty damning at this point. I'm sure that his son's death played a huge role, but it's irresponsible to ignore the brain trauma angle.

Also... he barely saw the field? The dude started 67 games in the NFL (That's 4 season's worth) and saw time in 16 others. And that's ignoring all the years of college and high school ball.

 

[Legatron4]

It's not a popular opinion because the medical evidence seems pretty damning at this point. I'm sure that his son's death played a huge role, but it's irresponsible to ignore the brain trauma angle.

Also... he barely saw the field? The dude started 67 games in the NFL (That's 4 season's worth) and saw time in 16 others. And that's ignoring all the years of college and high school ball.

Aren't those studies conducted towards concussions? I know she said he suffered some head damage, but to what degree? I played football all throughout middle and high school. And I'm pretty normal. Peyton Manning has played 16 NFL seasons and he doesn't seem to be any different from what we've seen. I just don't see it affecting current players. It's all these guys that played 30 years ago. Maybe it's over a period of time? I don't know much about them. Just from what I've seen.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but maybe educate me on why all of these players, out of nowhere, are all depressed from playing football so many years ago. I feel like some of them want money from the NFL.

 

[bskrilla]

Aren't those studies conducted towards concussions? I know she said he suffered some head damage, but to what degree? I played football all throughout middle and high school. And I'm pretty normal. Peyton Manning has played 16 NFL seasons and he doesn't seem to be any different from what we've seen. I just don't see it affecting current players. It's all these guys that played 30 years ago. Maybe it's over a period of time? I don't know much about them. Just from what I've seen.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but maybe educate me on why all of these players, out of nowhere, are all depressed from playing football so many years ago. I feel like some of them want money from the NFL.

First no one ever said it would affect ALL players. That's like saying someone who smoked their whole life and never got lung cancer means that smoking doesn't cause lung cancer. The evidence suggests that repeated brain trauma can increase your chance of suffering from debilitating brain issues later in life.

Without having completely read all of the studies the gist that I got was that it does, in fact, become more likely to become an issue as they get older. Also concussion protocol didn't exist 20-30 years ago. Players just shook it off and went back in the game. Increasing their chances of suffering repeat concussions. So it wouldn't be surprising if it was more prevalent among players from 20+ years ago.

That being said players like Junior Seau and Adrian Robinson were playing within the last decade.

 

[PFaulk]

I just can't buy that head injuries result in deep depression like that. It is 99% because of his son. And that's what I feel terrible for. I'm in the very small minority that believes most of these guys had issues before they even played football. I know it has some added effect, but the guy barely saw the field. Probably not a popular opinion, but I stand by it.

I don't know whether Erik Kramer suffered from depression prior to playing football - his wife seems to think his mood changed as a result of football, that's probably good enough for me in this case.

On the larger point, there is a fair amount of scientific research that suggests that Traumatic Brain Injuries (or TBI) and depression are more strongly correlated than instances of depression among the general population.

http://www.msktc.org/tbi/factsheets/Depression-After-Traumatic-Brain-Injury

How common is depression after TBI?
Depression is a common problem after TBI. About half of all people with TBI are affected by depression within the first year after injury. Even more (nearly two-thirds) are affected within seven years after injury. In the general population, the rate of depression is much lower, affecting fewer than one person in 10 over a one-year period. More than half of the people with TBI who are depressed also have significant anxiety.

There's a lot we as a culture don't yet understand about neuropsychology and how our brains work. But I'm drawing a pretty strong inference something is going on here.

 

[drasconis]

I just can't buy that head injuries result in deep depression like that. It is 99% because of his son. And that's what I feel terrible for. I'm in the very small minority that believes most of these guys had issues before they even played football. I know it has some added effect, but the guy barely saw the field. Probably not a popular opinion, but I stand by it.

I do have to say that their life style makes me wonder about the baseline - can you really compare them to an average person when it comes to depression? These guys peak in their careers in their late 20-early 30s, they end by the age of 40 (usually). The go from a life where everything comes to them, given to them, is available to them. Many were gods in HS and in college...they turn 45 and they are forgotten (by comparison-I assume they are still home town hero's and such - but it isn't the same level). Would it be any surprise if depression was common?

This isn't to say that head injuries aren't cause in some cases or don't play a part....just that it seems like it would be much tougher to set a baseline to compare them to when it comes to depression.

 

[Prime Time]

https://www.nflconcussionsettlement.com/

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...-agree-to-765m-settlement-in-concussions-suit

NFL, ex-players agree to $765M settlement in concussions suit
Associated Press/

• • Published: Aug. 29, 2013
    

PHILADELPHIA -- The NFL has reached a tentative $765 million settlement over concussion-related brain injuries among its 18,000 retired players, agreeing to compensate victims, pay for medical exams and underwrite research.

A federal judge announced the agreement Thursday after months of court-ordered mediation. It came just days before the start of the 2013 season.

More than 4,500 former athletes -- some suffering from dementia, depression or Alzheimer's that they blamed on blows to the head -- had sued the league, accusing it of concealing the dangers of concussions and rushing injured players back onto the field while glorifying and profiting from the kind of bone-jarring hits that make for spectacular highlight-reel footage.

The NFL long has denied any wrongdoing and insisted that safety always has been a top priority. But the NFL said Thursday that Commissioner Roger Goodell told pro football's lawyers to "do the right thing for the game and the men who played it."

The plaintiffs included Hall of Famer Tony Dorsett, Super Bowl-winning quarterback Jim McMahon and the family of Pro Bowl linebacker Junior Seau, who committed suicide last year.

Under the settlement, individual awards would be capped at $5 million for men with Alzheimer's disease; $4 million for those diagnosed after their deaths with a brain condition called chronic traumatic encephalopathy; and $3 million for players with dementia, said lead plaintiffs' lawyer Christopher Seeger.

Any of the approximately 18,000 former NFL players would be eligible.

Senior U.S. District Judge Anita Brody in Philadelphia announced the proposed agreement and will consider approving it at a later date.

The settlement most likely means the NFL won't have to disclose internal files about what it knew, and when, about concussion-linked brain problems. Lawyers had been eager to learn, for instance, about the workings of the league's Mild Traumatic Brain Injury Committee, which was led for more than a decade by a rheumatologist.

In recent years, a string of former NFL players and other concussed athletes have been diagnosed after their deaths with chronic traumatic encephalopathy, or CTE. Those ex-players included Seau and lead plaintiff Ray Easterling, who filed the first lawsuit in Philadelphia in August 2011 but later committed suicide.

About one-third of the league's 12,000 former players eventually joined the litigation. They include a few hundred "gap" players, who played during years when there was no labor contract in place, and were therefore considered likely to win the right to sue.

 

[Legatron4]

I do have to say that their life style makes me wonder about the baseline - can you really compare them to an average person when it comes to depression? These guys peak in their careers in their late 20-early 30s, they end by the age of 40 (usually). The go from a life where everything comes to them, given to them, is available to them. Many were gods in HS and in college...they turn 45 and they are forgotten (by comparison-I assume they are still home town hero's and such - but it isn't the same level). Would it be any surprise if depression was common?

This isn't to say that head injuries aren't cause in some cases or don't play a part....just that it seems like it would be much tougher to set a baseline to compare them to when it comes to depression.

This is basically what I was getting at. Terrell Owens tried committing suicide before too. They never said anything about it being related to head trauma. So many of these guys could just be straight up depressed after football because they have nothing else. Do these guys get pensions?

 

[biggame1190]

Do not want to debate and though football could be a reason, these players are just like normal people and normal people can get dangerously depressed for many personal reasons. Just life crap. Doesn't have to be blamed on the hits he took in football. Hell after what happened to his son I don't blame the guy for hitting rock bottom, we all have issues we battle with ourselves at the end of the day whether we are plumbers, accountants, football players, or boxers. Some people just crack.

 

[PFaulk]

This is basically what I was getting at. Terrell Owens tried committing suicide before too. They never said anything about it being related to head trauma. So many of these guys could just be straight up depressed after football because they have nothing else. Do these guys get pensions?

It's certainly possible that some players are depressed as a result of external factors, like money problems or lacking purpose in their lives.

But it is growing harder for me to ignore medical science that suggests there is a strong correlation between head injury and depression - much stronger than the average population and depression.

This doesn't "make football evil" as I think some may be concerned with. It just means that we need to continue to be proactive treating head injuries in all walks of life, understand warning signs, try and develop new preventive measures for folks to avoid head injuries.

I think we're trying. But IMO it's not going to help burying your head in the sand.

 

[CGI_Ram]

Do not want to debate and though football could be a reason, these players are just like normal people and normal people can get dangerously depressed for many personal reasons. Just life crap. Doesn't have to be blamed on the hits he took in football. Hell after what happened to his son I don't blame the guy for hitting rock bottom, we all have issues we battle with ourselves at the end of the day whether we are plumbers, accountants, football players, or boxers. Some people just crack.

Thank you!

I'm not saying concussion syndrome isn't true either... But there are a lot of 50 year olds depressed and with stress issues that never took a hit on the football field.

As far as Kramer; I hope he gets help that works for him.

 

[Prime Time]

Do these guys get pensions?

http://www.cheatsheet.com/sports/wh...-has-the-best-retirement-plan.html/?a=viewall

National Football League
Retirement plan: Pension, 401(k), Annuity
Minimum salary in 2015: $435,000

The NFL’s pension plan is based on credited seasons. Players are fully vested and eligible for benefits once they have three credited seasons in the league, and can begin collecting at 55 years old.

A player’s monthly benefit is based on the number of credited seasons they achieve, and the time period of said seasons. Players will receive $660 per credited season every month for the 2015-2017 seasons, and $760 per credited season every month for the 2018-2020 seasons.

The NFL’s 401(k) program, which is otherwise known as the Second Career Savings Plan, offers players a 2:1 match up to $26,000 once players have two credited seasons in the NFL.

The last retirement benefit available to NFL players is an annuity plan. Once players have four credited seasons, the league will contribute $80,000 per credited season from 2014-2017, and $95,000 per credited season from 2018-2020. Players can begin collecting this benefit once they reach 35-years-old.

Full details of the NFL’s retirement plan can be found in the league’s Collective Bargaining Agreement.

 

[LACHAMP46]

Wow, I was looking up Tommy Krammer...then saw the team he played for...Detroit...I believe I played against Krammer many moons ago...He was a QB at Pierce college, and I was a cb at ELAC....They had a thing with throwing the bomb on the first play of the game...And Eric threw a good one...1985....gave up 600 total yards of offense...Pierce was like....in the day Nebraska & Oklahoma were really good. Think Bama...So they were a big red team called the Brahmas or something....

 

[JUMAVA68]

I just can't buy that head injuries result in deep depression like that. It is 99% because of his son. And that's what I feel terrible for. I'm in the very small minority that believes most of these guys had issues before they even played football. I know it has some added effect, but the guy barely saw the field. Probably not a popular opinion, but I stand by it.

I agree hope he gets the help he needs and finds peace of mind.

 

[Mackeyser]

I have a brain injury thanks to the Navy (well a Navy Doc). The lesion in my brain leads to basically daily migraines, although I've had a migraine last as long as twelve weeks.

Brain injuries change the brains function; they can change the chemistry, any damage can alter neural pathways, increases or decreases in certain kinds of neural activities can manifest in different personality traits being shown by the person.

I can tell you definitively that brain injury can and does do things like lead to severe depression. I've always been on a journey to be mindful and wanted to deal with this with my eyes open which is why I ride this raw and take no opiates for the pain. That mindfulness has allowed me to notice when my brain chemistry is off. It's not a super power, I don't have the foggiest idea which chemical is off or what's going on, but I absolutely CAN tell when my brain chemistry is out of whack and usually if I listen to my body, I can get things under control. Usually. I don't self medicate and I've learned to keep the lines of communication open with my docs.

I realize that it can be hard to believe, but I'm here to say it's true.

As for why some are affected and some aren't? Sam Bradford had two ACL injuries on minor impacts and Frank Gore has been a workhorse back for almost a decade. Why? Different builds. Each person has a different cranial cavity, different brain size (the more space between the brain and the skull, the greater the chance for concussion), different neck construction, etc. And...each hit is different. Peyton can play 16 years and avoid major injury (other than the pretty serious neck injury), but other guys have been injured in OTAs as rookies and never made it to a game.

The point is we can't use equivocation because there's no formula for this. Every person is unique and every hit has a unique set of forces and circumstances that will never be duplicated.

And the point has been well made in this thread that while the science is nascent, it's speaking clearly to causation (multiple concussion to CTE, for example) even if we don't fully understand every nuance to the nth degree.

I just wanted to share that. I don't know a lot of things, but I live with this every waking moment. And I've also lost a child, so it's not like I can't relate on some level. Every loss is different and I have no idea how his loss affected him. I do know, definitively that brain injury can cause exaggerated reactions especially with respect to depression, anger, hopelessness. So it's entirely possible that in this persons case, there was a negative synergy. I can certainly relate to that.

 

[dieterbrock]

Former NFL player or not my heart aches for any parent who loses a child. Depression from whatever the cause is lethal, unrelenting basically incurable at best manageable.
I hope he gets the help he needs. Just sad.

On a side note, I was a big fan of his. He threw a perfect spiral every time. Detroit had a run with him at qb. He was amazing. But iirc he kept getting hurt...

 

[fearsomefour]

Aren't those studies conducted towards concussions? I know she said he suffered some head damage, but to what degree? I played football all throughout middle and high school. And I'm pretty normal. Peyton Manning has played 16 NFL seasons and he doesn't seem to be any different from what we've seen. I just don't see it affecting current players. It's all these guys that played 30 years ago. Maybe it's over a period of time? I don't know much about them. Just from what I've seen.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but maybe educate me on why all of these players, out of nowhere, are all depressed from playing football so many years ago. I feel like some of them want money from the NFL.

This is the tricky thing with head injuries. You and I could take an impact located in the exact same spot on the head in the same conditions with the same force and come out with different results. My father in law had a profound head injury and he was depressed for several years after.

 

[fearsomefour]

I just can't buy that head injuries result in deep depression like that. It is 99% because of his son. And that's what I feel terrible for. I'm in the very small minority that believes most of these guys had issues before they even played football. I know it has some added effect, but the guy barely saw the field. Probably not a popular opinion, but I stand by it.

It is really hard to know. His wife is saying he was depressed for year, since his playing days.
I would agree that what happened to his son probably has a lot to do with. All sorts of people deal with depression and it is a real thing. If it was head injury related, from what I have seen it can cause a real sense of hopelessness and then you add his son on top of it....look out.