Cleveland involved in trade talks for #2

[CGI_Ram]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/1...l-pick-nfl-draft-uncertain-whether-make-trade

The Cleveland Browns have been engaged in trade talks involving the No. 2 overall selection in the NFL draft but are uncertain whether they will trade the pick, a team source told ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter.

"There is interest in the pick," the source told Schefter.

Although the Browns have been linked to each of the top two quarterbacks in this year's draft -- Jared Goff and Carson Wentz -- Cleveland's new-look, analytics-driven front office is seriously considering trading out of the No. 2 slot for multiple picks.

Sashi Brown, Cleveland's new director of football operations, acknowledged last week that "there has been some interest" in the No. 2 pick from other teams, though he noted those inquiries were preliminary.

Coach Hue Jackson said the team hasn't made up its mind on what will happen on draft night.

"Obviously, there are some talented players in this draft. We're still in our process, still figuring out our direction," he said Tuesday. "Again, that's still two weeks away. We're getting closer, but we're still a little ways away from having to really nail it all down."

The Titans traded the No. 1 overall pick to the Rams on Thursday, in exchange for Los Angeles' first-round pick, two second-round picks and third-round pick this season, along with a first-round pick in 2017.

"I don't think I reacted one way or the other because so many things are going to happen before the draft," Jackson said. "We just kind of stay true to our process and keep evaluating and keep working."

Jackson said he isn't sweating the Rams' pick because it -- and the aftermath -- are out of his control. Asked Tuesday what his team would do if the Rams selected the player the Browns hoped to draft, Jackson said, "then they do because we can't stop it."

"At the end of the day, the Rams are going to do what they feel they need to do, and the Browns are going to do what we feel we need to do," Jackson said. "There's no exact science, as you guys know, to all of this. It's going to unfold as it's going to unfold. And if I know Sashi, he's prepared and ready for anything that can happen over the next couple weeks, up to and through the draft. That's just the way you have to be, and that's the way you have to play it. We don't get to control your own destiny that way. You have to go with it a little bit and understand what's happening and work from there. I'm sure we'll do that."

Multiple teams, including the Philadelphia Eagles, have been identified as potential trade partners for the Browns, who have hosted both Goff and Wentz for visits, despite the offseason signing of Robert Griffin III.

Brown said last week that Cleveland will take the player "who will give us the best chance to win over the long term." He also said he is confident Browns owners Jimmy and Dee Haslam will give the new regime the chance to prove itself.

"I absolutely think that Jimmy and Dee understand the importance of continuity," Brown said. "There is a commitment from the top down to build something that is sustainable."

The Haslams have fired three coaches, three general managers and one CEO in four years. They have hired three coaches and three GMs. None had more than two years in the job.

Also Tuesday, Jackson said the league has asked him about Josh Gordon, and he reiterated that it's out of his control.

"Again, it's still in the league's hands. We all know he's a very talented player, and we wish him well. We want him to do what he needs to do to get his career back on track because of his talent and the type of person he is," he said. "I don't think Josh is a bad guy at all. But I think, at the same time, he has to do what he needs to do to get himself back in the good graces of the National Football League. And then when that time comes, hopefully we'll have an opportunity to sit down and talk to him about what his future could be."

 

[PressureD41]

 

[PressureD41]

Hey Whiner Nation how you like them apples?!?!? :mrburnsevil: :rolllaugh::neener:

 

[Akrasian]

Hopefully Cleveland can then trade back up just in front of the Niners and take Lynch, leaving an entire fan base distraught and stuck with Kaepernick.

 

[thirteen28]

(to the tune of the Dragnet theme ... dating myself here)

Dumbbbbb dumb dumb dumb.

Dumbbbbb dumb dumb dumb DUMBBBB!!!

 

[Ram65]

Eagles talking to Cleveland was big here today on talk radio. Fans seem to want to keep the picks because Kelly really depleted the talent. Thinking is that they would get Wentz. Some not sold on Wentz' worth vs the lost picks. Getting that 2nd round pick was big for the Rams and could hurt the Eagles. If they do get the #2 pick the Rams and Eagles futures will be tied together for a long time. Good for me in Eagle territory.

 

[thirteen28]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/draft2016/story/_/id/15232563/the-day-browns-passed-big-ben

The day the Browns passed on Big Ben

"When Cleveland passed on me, technically my hometown team, that was it. I couldn't wait to have a team and play the Browns at some point."

-- Steelers quarterback Ben Roethlisberger, who is 19-2 in his career against Cleveland.

The most decorated quarterback jersey in Cleveland contains 24 names. The list could have stopped at six: Couch, Detmer, Wynn, Pederson, Holcomb, Roethlisberger.

The Browns should be drafting a playmaking safety or wide receiver for a playoff-caliber team instead of potentially the franchise's 25th starting quarterback since 1999. This reality made one longtime NFL coach nearly spill his craft beer just thinking about it at the NFL combine. He was with the Browns 12 years ago. He knew what happened in that draft room in Berea, Ohio, with the Browns on the clock with the No. 6 pick in the 2004 draft.

"He was right there," the NFL coach said. "Once Sean Taylor was off the board, everything got crazy. Ben was discussed."

Before Roethlisberger began to terrorize the Browns twice a year for more than a decade, he was a lanky kid from Findlay, Ohio, who would have gladly played for Cleveland. Why is the Browns' universe too cruel to let this happen? In talks with people involved with the process from all angles, ESPN examines the mechanics of how Roethlisberger never did put on the orange and brown, how the Steelers stumbled into a gem and what it says about the draft process.

The rain-soaked workout
Ryan Tollner, Roethlisberger's agent: "They were very secretive about it. They shot in and worked him out at Miami (Ohio). I don't believe they were at his pro day, where everyone walked away saying that was one of the best throwing sessions they'd ever seen."

Baltimore Ravens director of player personnel, 2002-04 (and Cleveland's GM from 2005-08): "We had Roethlisberger rated ahead of those two [Manning and Rivers]. It might have been a mixed bag [leaguewide]. Some people had a problem to some extent getting past Philip's throwing motion. And with Ben, for some evaluators, you're a lot more comfortable when these players had gone through quality competition."

Philip Rivers over Ben Roethlisberger, based on the evaluations of the personnel department. I think that they felt ultimately Rivers wouldn't be there. If he did wind up there, I think we would have taken him. If I'm not mistaken, that was a draft-day effort [to trade up for Rivers]. I did hear that after the fact."

Former Giants general manager Ernie Accorsi wrote in his book "The GM" that the Browns offered a first- and second-round pick for New York's No. 4 pick. Accorsi was unavailable for comment. The way Policy remembers it, all the quarterback reports from team personnel emphasized Rivers, and the sentiment was Roethlisberger would be great value in the late-first or early-second round. That's surprising to hear on the surface, but the truth is scouting evaluations can vary wildly, a reality that deepens the draft intrigue every year.

So, there was Pittsburgh ...

Jimmy Graham, you can place him in different formations and personnel groupings. That would be a three-to-five-time Pro Bowl player."

Winslow, the Browns' first pick that year, wasn't exactly a bust. He finished his career with 469 catches and 5,236 yards in 10 seasons, including five injury-plagued years with Cleveland. Quarterback wasn't the proverbial '"need" that year. Davis was on the Dallas Cowboys staff in the early '90s, and Winslow was supposed to be his Jay Novacek.

Montgomery: "I knew his name was dancing around the Browns, and being an Ohio guy, Ben wouldn't have minded [being drafted by the Browns] at all. He lived closer to the Bengals, though. And [former Miami coach Terry Hoeppner] was convinced the Giants would take him. I think Ben thought that, too. That's where the buzz was, with the Giants."

Policy: "Some of our coaches especially liked [Roethlisberger] a lot. They thought he was tough, he's what Cleveland needed. He would fit the profile of the AFC North. The scouts and Butch Davis' chief personnel guy [Pete Garcia] really tried steering everybody away from Ben, almost putting him in the position where he's not our guy. He didn't have a shot. They made up their minds, he was coming from a less-than-sophisticated program, a smaller school, a program not nearly as competitive as a top-10 pick would be coming from, and that was their position, and they prevailed. Butch had final say. We are picking too high for him. That was the sentiment."

Draft day (and the aftermath)
An oversized figure sat inside Madison Square Garden wearing a three-button pinstripe suit, trying to play it cool with his group. His whole table was confused by the Eli Manning-Philip Rivers swap of top-four picks, considering the interest the Giants had shown. Everyone knew Buffalo at 12 was Roethlisberger's ceiling. But this kid grew up two hours from Cleveland. He played college ball four hours from Cleveland. The state's biggest university, Ohio State, viewed him mostly as a tight end. As if that weren't enough fuel, he watched the Manning name dominate the draft. Paul Tagliabue announced the pick for Cleveland: Kellen Winslow, tight end, University of Miami. Roethlisberger had his own private announcement. He told his agent the team would regret the decision.

Roethlisberger: "Two quarterbacks had already been picked, so as a competitor, I felt underestimated. When Cleveland passed on me, technically my hometown team, that was it. I couldn't wait to have a team and play the Browns at some point. Funny how it works out I'd go to Pittsburgh and play them twice a year."

Cleveland Browns Stadium, and when we drafted Kellen, there was shock. I remember the fans moaning a little bit with the expectations we were getting a quarterback. That was the expectation -- Jeff would be here 1-2 years, groom a new guy for the future, and the new guy would take the Browns to the Super Bowl."

Tollner: "We believe either Ernie [Accorsi] or Tom Coughlin had told Terry they would take Ben at [No.] 4 if they couldn't get the trade done. So, when they announced there had been a trade, we prepared Ben [and told him] that things could take a while. Then, quietly, once he passed Cleveland, we were sort of in disbelief. If they did their due diligence, they had this kid from Northwest Ohio, they played in the state of Ohio in college, his pro day was lights out, he was a prototypical guy with unusual athleticism."

Davis: "I can't remember [what happened in the draft room], but it was never chaotic or anything. We spent an awful lot of time planning that. There was a concert of people who made their opinions known as to, 'this is what we want to try to do.' ... As much as we fell in love with different quarterbacks, financially, I don't know if we could have pulled it off. We thought let's keep trying to work with [Couch] and Jeff."

Policy: "[The sentiment was] if [Roethlisberger] goes to the second round or the bottom of the first, fine."

Mike Mularkey, former Buffalo Bills head coach: "We were going to take him at 12. Thanks for reminding me."

Colbert: "We couldn't trade up because we knew the cost to trade up was very expensive. ... Tommy Maddox was coming off a pretty good season, and we were looking to shore up our offensive line. If we had the opportunity to add a young quarterback, because Tommy was a little bit older, we were going to do that."

You know the story by now: The Steelers drafted Roethlisberger at No. 11 and are still reaping the benefits. Two Super Bowls later, Roethlisberger, 34, is widely considered a top-three-to-five quarterback in today's NFL. Roethlisberger is 19-2 against the Browns, but that's not the worst of it. Roethlisberger has 5,323 career passing yards against Cleveland. Of the Browns' 20 quarterbacks since that draft, Derek Anderson is the only one to surpass that yardage total in a Browns jersey.

Kiper: "Jeff Garcia was the reason they didn't draft Ben Roethlisberger. History could have been rewritten."

Roethlisberger: "My hometown has always been predominantly Browns fans. When the Steelers picked me, some converted and some refused. As a young guy, it bothered me some. I was very motivated by people who supported me and people who didn't."

Davis: "In retrospect, obviously it would have been a wise decision on our part to take a Rivers or a Roethlisberger. You keep building with pieces, and you feel hopefully, eventually, you'll get the right quarterback. ... I think everybody's come to the realization that you can't coach around the quarterback. They've all got one."

If the Browns had picked Roethlisberger, their infamous jersey probably wouldn't exist, or it likely would have just six names on it. PRNewsFoto/Brokaw Inc/AP Photos
Colbert: "Coach [Bill] Cowher unselfishly made the statement that, for the sake of the organization, if a quarterback is available, we should give it serious thought. Was that the most immediate need? No, because we didn't plan on Ben playing his rookie year. ... Tommy [Maddox] gets hurt in the first game, the rest was history."

Montgomery: "[The Browns] could have used him. Maybe they wouldn't be on the 20th-something quarterback since then."

Roethlisberger: "In my earlier years, I thought about it every time I played them. It served me well. Now, I just want to beat them twice a year because my team needs it."

Sometimes, scouting quarterbacks can be very simple ...

Savage: "Legendary scout Ernie Plank ... introduced the 49ers to [Joe] Montana, and his territory included some AFC North spots. [Plank] scouted Miami (Ohio) one day and saw a freshman and said, 'Boy, we're going to have a quarterback at Miami.' That was at least two years in advance before Roethlisberger was a known NFL prospect. Nobody could even pronounce his name at that point."