Cheating in Sports

  • To unlock all of features of Rams On Demand please take a brief moment to register. Registering is not only quick and easy, it also allows you access to additional features such as live chat, private messaging, and a host of other apps exclusive to Rams On Demand.

Should all athletes and/or teams who get caught cheating lose their medals / trophies / wins?

  • Only if it's the Patriots

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Never

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • "If you ain't cheatin', you ain't tryin'"

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    14

JonRam99

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 4, 2014
Messages
2,030
Name
Jonathan
Having been on the other end of this as Rams fans from the 2001 Spygate scandal, how do you all really feel about cheating? In the Olympics, athletes who get caught doping or cheating get their medals stripped & handed to the next runner up. I feel this protects the integrity of Olympic sports. Lance Armstrong got ALL his Tour wins vacated too -- being someone who used to look up to him, I hate it, but it's the right thing to do. USC under Pete Carroll also comes to mind.

But, when the Patsies were dinged by the NFL for what seemed like a slap on the wrist, do you feel like that helped us fans trust the NFL? or did you lose trust in it? Loaded question, sorry. Or, how about the 2017 Astros who were caught cheating in the WS? MLB slapped them on the wrist too. In a close 4-3 win over the (ahem) LA Dodgers, don't you think their cheating made a difference in their win?

Astros fans, and Pasty fans, would tell you to quit yer cryin', everyone cheats, etc., etc. But I know for a fact that many fans have left both the NFL and MLB for it's loss of integrity. Those slaps on the wrists were slaps in our faces. Don't these teams play for the fans anyway? or, do they just not care that much about us anymore because it's all about the TV sponsorship $$$ now? I guess they found out when stadiums were empty last year. Do sports rules even matter anymore, or is it all just for show? I guess it's possible, if you can control everything the TV audiences see.

If I were the 'stros or the 'pats, I would voluntarily vacate my wins & hand my trophy to the Dodgers / Rams, because no matter what, it will never erase the stain from my victory. So what if new fans are born everyday, who won't remember what they did; so what if some fans will look the other way, just because they want some entertainment? or because they're fans of the winner (who happens to be owned by a powerful team owner)? Their selfishness harms the entire league. So I guess you all know where I stand on this lol, not just because I'm a jilted Rams fan, but because I care about the sports I watch -- I hate feeling like I'm watching something fake. If I wanted to watch a fake sport I'd watch "pro" wrestling.
 

snackdaddy

Who's your snackdaddy?
Joined
May 6, 2014
Messages
10,719
Name
Charlie
I still think the Astros should be stripped of their World Series title. No, you can't give it to the Dodgers because you can't assume anything. But we know they cheated. They admitted it. In the record books label 2017 World Series champs as vacated.
 

Memento

Your (Somewhat) Friendly Neighborhood Authoress.
Joined
Jul 30, 2010
Messages
16,889
Name
Jemma
I can agree with vacating records. That would include the 2013 Red Sox; the WS MVP was Ortiz, a known steroid user. Hell, the 2004 Red Sox were full of steroid users as well.
 

JonRam99

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 4, 2014
Messages
2,030
Name
Jonathan
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #4
I can agree with vacating records. That would include the 2013 Red Sox; the WS MVP was Ortiz, a known steroid user. Hell, the 2004 Red Sox were full of steroid users as well.
I can't remember, wasn't that the one they swept our Cards? What were they doing?
edit: 4-2 Sox over Cards. 'Roids have been so prevalent, hard to say they should vacate for that, (honestly I'm not 100% sure AP wasn't using) but was there something else?
 
Last edited:

Tano

Legend
Joined
Jun 11, 2017
Messages
8,844
USC under Pete Carroll also comes to mind.
Thing is - USC didn't outwardly cheat. They did not do any recruiting violations.

In addition, they did not know Bush was getting the stuff he was getting and his Lake Elsinore home is a 3 hour drive from the campus

Hard to know that he was getting stuff.

They probably shouldn't have had such a blind eye to everything going on and they did let the students do stuff on campus that wasn't right so they should have been penalized a bit. I just felt the penalties were too harsh.
 

JonRam99

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 4, 2014
Messages
2,030
Name
Jonathan
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #6
Thing is - USC didn't outwardly cheat. They did not do any recruiting violations.

In addition, they did not know Bush was getting the stuff he was getting and his Lake Elsinore home is a 3 hour drive from the campus

Hard to know that he was getting stuff.

They probably shouldn't have had such a blind eye to everything going on and they did let the students do stuff on campus that wasn't right so they should have been penalized a bit. I just felt the penalties were too harsh.
Ah, I wasn't aware, that's a lot of punishment if that's all it was. Maybe someone just didn't like USC? Was there someone in the NCAA that had it out for USC?? They were pretty dominant under Carroll with Reggie B. IIRC.
That's the other side of this argument... some teams with powerful connections get away with murder, while other smaller schools, small market teams, etc. get to be the ones that the 'powers that be' make an example of, to show off their power & look like they're cracking down when they're really turning a blind eye to the crap that the big money schools / teams are doing.
 

Tano

Legend
Joined
Jun 11, 2017
Messages
8,844
Ah, I wasn't aware, that's a lot of punishment if that's all it was. Maybe someone just didn't like USC? Was there someone in the NCAA that had it out for USC?? They were pretty dominant under Carroll with Reggie B. IIRC.
That's the other side of this argument... some teams with powerful connections get away with murder, while other smaller schools, small market teams, etc. get to be the ones that the 'powers that be' make an example of, to show off their power & look like they're cracking down when they're really turning a blind eye to the crap that the big money schools / teams are doing.
They were out to get USC because USC basically said FU to them during the investigation and didn’t cooperate with them at all so the NCAA decided to make an example of USC and destroyed them for 10 years. Took that long to even remotely recover from the sanctions.

The NCAA also said that USCs running back coach was aware of Bush’s actions but did not provide any physical proof.

Thr running back coach was fired as a result of this accusation and he filed a lawsuit against the NCAA. No word on what happened in that lawsuit. I was so curious to see if the NCAA actually had that evidence.
 

Tano

Legend
Joined
Jun 11, 2017
Messages
8,844
I just read that they settled out of court. So no idea if they had evidence or not.

However, Judge during the trial said that the NCAA displayed malicious intent against the running back coach and I think the NCAA knew that their actions would have been shown to be malicious to USC as well so they decided to settle out of court.

It would have been terrible publicity for them if it was shown that they really didn't have much evidence against USC but only heresay of USC football students were getting away with anything on campus.

USC also sued the NCAA but the Judge would not hear the case since it involved rules created by the NCAA which USC was part of.

I am not saying that right but something about we can't get involved since its not public laws that are being violated.
 

JonRam99

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 4, 2014
Messages
2,030
Name
Jonathan
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #9
I just read that they settled out of court. So no idea if they had evidence or not.

However, Judge during the trial said that the NCAA displayed malicious intent against the running back coach and I think the NCAA knew that their actions would have been shown to be malicious to USC as well so they decided to settle out of court.

It would have been terrible publicity for them if it was shown that they really didn't have much evidence against USC but only heresay of USC football students were getting away with anything on campus.

USC also sued the NCAA but the Judge would not hear the case since it involved rules created by the NCAA which USC was part of.

I am not saying that right but something about we can't get involved since its not public laws that are being violated.
So, he & USC were punished severely for "not cooperating" with the NCAA. Yet surely the NCAA looks the other way when teams they favor commit "minor" violations that "probably" don't affect the outcome of games.

I think this poll has been up long enough for folks to understand why I posted it. It has plenty of views, but so far only 10 ROD members care enough about cheating in sports to vote. Even when it hurt their own team(s) (Rams, Dodgers).
 

Tano

Legend
Joined
Jun 11, 2017
Messages
8,844
So, he & USC were punished severely for "not cooperating" with the NCAA. Yet surely the NCAA looks the other way when teams they favor commit "minor" violations that "probably" don't affect the outcome of games.

I think this poll has been up long enough for folks to understand why I posted it. It has plenty of views, but so far only 10 ROD members care enough about cheating in sports to vote. Even when it hurt their own team(s) (Rams, Dodgers).
I don't look at the General Sports Talk folder that often and just accidentally saw this one. I am wondering that a lot of others aren't viewing this folder as well.

And I agree completely with your statement. NCAA got pissed at USC for not cooperating and let them have it. How dare a school obstruct an investigation by the mighty NCAA. We will show them.
 

JonRam99

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 4, 2014
Messages
2,030
Name
Jonathan
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #11
I don't look at the General Sports Talk folder that often and just accidentally saw this one. I am wondering that a lot of others aren't viewing this folder as well.

And I agree completely with your statement. NCAA got pissed at USC for not cooperating and let them have it. How dare a school obstruct an investigation by the mighty NCAA. We will show them.
ah, makes sense.... mebbe I make one called "cheating in football"? lol