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What is a "true #1 WR"??

Discussion in 'RAMS - NFL TALK' started by blackbart, Mar 8, 2014.

  1. Boffo97 Well-Known Member

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    So you've resorted to coded messages.
    Agahst... that's the only way to describe my feelings.
    Maybe you thought some sort of point was being proven.
    Maybe you were just being silly.
    You never see me being silly like that.

    We must not resort to subliminal messaging.
    At least, not yet.
    There's still lots of time until the draft.
    Knowledge gained before then will help solidify our pick.
    I might change my mind.
    No one knows what will happen.
    So let's not have any coded messages, okay?
     
    #41
  2. PhxRam The Estimated Prophet

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    I want you to know I agree with you BTW..
     
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  3. RamFan503 Grill and Brew Master

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    Yeah... certainly. I have absolutely fat chance no problem with that.
     
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  4. Ramsey Member

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    Like most of the NFL, the Rams don't have a #1 wide receiver.
    The Bears could be said to have two #1 WR's last year, in Brandon Marshal and Alshon Jeffery. I believe the Bears picked Alshon right after the Rams picked Quick.
     
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  5. Alan Well-Known Member

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    Isn't hindsight great? :whistle:
     
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  6. jjab360 Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
     
    #46
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  7. blackbart Well-Known Member

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    [QUOTE="Boffo97, post: 270828, member: 1192"}

    I'd still say what looks like total failure by Snead & Fisher is signing a big bucks LT (Long who probably will not be ready to start the 2014 season) when we already had an LT (Saffold who has not played a full season), and now people want to draft another LT(The future guy protecting our QB's blind side). (Although thankfully, if the Rams go that route, Long can be cut next year with only $2.4 million in "dead money", but for this year, we would have a fully guaranteed salary $9.25 million lame duck.) (Or he could be moved to RT to replace Barksdale)[/QUOTE]
     
    #47
  8. mr.stlouis Well-Known Member

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    Somebody we don't have...
     
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  9. Memphis Ram Well-Known Member

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    Or need really.:whistle:
     
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  10. Boffo97 Well-Known Member

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    The Rams currently seem to think otherwise.

    And neither did Long. Will people want another tackle if Robinson/Matthews gets hurt?

    Who I have no objection to drafting when we actually don't have one.

    He would become an extremely high paid RT then.

    Now obviously, there are benefits to drafting one of them and playing them at guard in the short term. I'd rather get something we don't have (a #1 WR) over something we do (a starting LT). It isn't cut and dried one right way, one wrong way.
     
    #50
  11. blackbart Well-Known Member

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    Is there any way to know what we really have at WR since half of the big 4 has not played a full season with our starting QB? And Quick only got 5 full games with him in his second year?

    I hate the long period to the draft this year. This week should show some clues to what will be needed in the draft.
     
    #51
  12. Boffo97 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, someone we have COULD step up to be a #1 WR. And someone COULD step up to be an elite OT. Neither is LIKELY, but both are possible. So... non-factor.

    This I agree with. But the long wait should mean we have a better handle on Long's health situation when we draft.
     
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  13. RamFan503 Grill and Brew Master

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    You mean like we kept hearing with Wells when he had a simple knee scope?


    Will people want another receiver or three if Watkins isn't all that or gets hurt?


    You mean when we are potentially faced with a choice of mediocre talent at O-line and a stud WR sitting there instead of what seems like is the other way around?


    Or he would play out at least four years of his contract at LT and be ready to move over under friendlier terms when our young guy is ready to take over that post. Is a rookie LT not going to struggle at all if he starts at LT rather than learn from a great one like Long?

    I think something most of us can agree on - hopefully.

    My difference is that we don't have much in the terms of talent along the O-line. And we are no where near the point as a team of being able to reload as players age. We went after Long but we need real talent and we have a bunch of recent picks that are too young to know about at WR. Including one that is of very similar stature, had similar numbers in his last season in college, and came from the same conference. And a second-year-to-be WR whose stats blew Sammy's out of the water. Oh... and an all purpose threat who had almost as many yards receiving alone in his last year as Sammy did last year.

    We have lots of resources committed to skill positions and virtually nothing on the O-line even though there are always 5 linemen on the field for EVERY snap.
     
    #53
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  14. Boffo97 Well-Known Member

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    If Long is having setbacks in being back Week 1, the Rams will have that info. We don't. People are assuming it's the case, but we don't know.

    Since Watkins would be drafted to be a #1 type, he'd be given time to show it. The only WR drafted as even possibly a #1 type is Quick, and his window is closing quickly (pardon the pun). Whereas we just got a new LT last year.

    If you're calling Watkins mediocre, a lot of people are going to disagree with that. And at the same time, Robinson/Matthews don't seem to be Pace "must grab" level either.

    I really don't see Long staying on past 2014 regardless of how well he plays if there's an early 1st rounder waiting to take his spot at LT, and making too much to be a RT. I could be wrong, but I don't see it.

    It's only "virtually nothing" on the O-line if you only look at the draft. We've been very active there in free agency.

    And yes, I acknowledged that a #1 WR *could* come out of what we already have. A hidden gem *could* come out of what we already have on the line (and on the safe assumption Long is returning, we already have someone very talented there.) Neither is likely though. The OL does need help, I freely admit that. I just think we can get a stud WR (*if* the Rams view him as such) AND fix the main problem, which is guard. Then if Long needs to be replaced next year, draft a tackle then. I'm sure they'll be another "once in a decade" guy then too. ;)
     
    #54
  15. RamFan503 Grill and Brew Master

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    Much like we didn't know with Wells. The coaches were saying he would be ready. And in reality, there was no reason to believe otherwise after a simple procedure. I really don't think the coaching staff kept saying next week, next week, next week in an attempt to blow smoke up our asses. They believed he'd be ready. He wasn't. Now Long is supposed to be ready. Hopefully so because he would be one of two players along a 5 man line that we are counting on starting.


    Why is it ok to give Watkins time to contribute when it is not ok to give a future LT time and reps at Guard? At least a future starting LT is going to give you very good minutes at Guard while he is getting it. A WR that is not getting it from day one (and I'm not saying Watkins definitely won't) gets us no where for another couple years and we just keep saying 2016, 2017, etc...

    Meanwhile, we have an LT now that is going to be starting to drop off and may not even be able to start the year, a RT that was released by the Raiders - a team that NO ONE can say has talent on their O-line - yet he is better than any of our other options, a 30-something Center that has been injured more than not, a FA Guard that wants to play LT and is looking for a big pay day so likely won't be back with us, another RG that is likely to be cut, a LG that would barely stick with other teams' practice squads if he was eligible, a second year, fourth round Guard/Center that couldn't see the field with that kind of depth in front of him, and a back-up Center.


    I didn't call Watkins mediocre (ok - maybe I intimated it) but he has mediocre measurable - yet great stats. And actually, people are referring to Robinson on that level of upside and his measurables fit. Matthews is being talked about as a can't miss very good - not elite prospect. And the measurable are there.


    Even more reason to grab one NOW. Let the kid learn for a year and be a big active body at Guard - then if you decide to cut Long (which I don't think they do) you have $2.4 mil going against your cap. That's very manageable.


    And we see the ROI there don't we? How many games missed by those FAs? What kind of talent do we really have there? Coach Bou can put together a decent O-line with the parts and talent level he's been given. I personally don't think we stand a chance in hell winning this division let alone any SBs with this kind of O-line and an offense built around a pocket passer.

    We have skill players with the numbers to back-up the notion that they could make for a very explosive offense. We have a LT and virtually nothing else to suggest that we have the makings of a very good offensive line. We went O-line in the 4th round over the past couple of seasons. And we have received basically one series of downs out of them. Just like WR, you are not going to get true starting or elite talent with later round picks. But we have used several high picks on skill players/WRs of late on a position that may have three to four on the field at most while the O-line is ALWAYS on the field.

    I would agree that you can get depth and find an occasional diamond in the rough in later rounds for the O-line. Same can be said of WRs. We let DA and Gibby hit FA because what we had was likely going to be better. Let them get better before we already start to take snaps away from them by taking yet another skill player that needs the ball and likely won't get it if our QB is on the turf or having to throw within 2 seconds again.
     
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  16. Boffo97 Well-Known Member

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    The big thing we seem to be going round and round on though is that it seems, at times, that some of the people in the draft a tackle camp are creating a false dilemma: #1 WR or fix the OL. No one's saying don't fix the OL. What we're saying is that it's possible to do BOTH. Sure, you won't get your elite tackle (unless you want Lewan, which makes me very uneasy) or we do some fancy tradeups (or someone takes one HELL of a tumble). But it's not a choice of draft a tackle to play guard for who knows how long or OL is still broken.

    And honestly, if we are going to draft a tackle, I want Matthews over Robinson... Robinson seems a real boom or bust type guy.
     
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  17. RamFan503 Grill and Brew Master

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    Actually, I think you can't take Watkins and seriously fix the O-line unless you want to take the same approach that hasn't worked out. So to me - by saying you want to take Watkins instead of one of the two clearly best O-linemen in the draft at a point you KNOW for absolute certainty you will get them, you are stuck hoping someone worth a damn is there in later rounds after 32 teams with O-line needs are sifting though the left overs. At some point we need to address the O-line with real and young talent. But I guess there is always next year, or the year after. We should use all our early picks on everything but the O-line every year so that we can pay - as you intimated - way too much for a #1 O-lineman that someone else has already gotten the best years out of. We have a fair bit of talent in our WR corp. We have almost none on our O-line. Do you really think we EVER get value out of Sam if we don't protect him? Do you think we will ever have a reliable rushing attack if we have the likes of Williams at LG? I don't.
     
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  18. iced Well-Known Member

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    Problem is you don't have to spend a top 5 pick on a tackle and convert them to a Guard to fix the o-line - there are plenty of talented Guard prospects that will more than likely be available in the first 2 rounds.

    I'd be in the draft a Tackle camp if we didn't have a LT - but we do. And last I checked, Jake Long signed a 4 year deal one year ago, and I don't see him being cut any time soon...Oh and unlike our Wide Receiver position, Jake Long played at a high level - top 5 even. And according to some health experts, The Rams expectation of Jake Long being back week 1 is not far fetched or unrealistic.
     
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  19. shaunpinney Well-Known Member

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    To agree with most guys on here - there aren't that many "true" number 1 WR's in the NFL, our's seems to rotate, depending on the game or how the opposing defences are playing - which i think is good.

    I think our balance is almost there, this year we have a running game and hopefully Sammy will be back all guns blazing, so we will have a passing game - we have Austin, Givens who can both be threats and Cook and Kendricks who can also be threats, that's 4 guys in need of covering. I wouldn't say that Seattle has a true number one go-to guy, and they did ok last year - they have Marshawn Lynch. We now have Zac Stacy.

    I'm not saying we're perfect and I wouldn't oppose picking up another elite WR in this year's Draft (Watkins / Lee / Evans) or in bringing back Amendola (Sammy's go-to-comfort blanket guy) or bringing in someone like Decker / Nicks / G. Tate to give us another target, because I think that's how were going to play, multiple targets & multiple threats.
     
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  20. Ram_of_Old Guest

    A number 1 receiver is a WR that demands double coverage from a defense. Do the Rams have someone like this?
     
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