The Rams should trade WR Sammy Watkins for Lions CB Darius Slay

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Thoughts?


  • Total voters
    36

iamme33

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dan
Thomas or Reynolds just jags right now, SW a whole different level, best tools of all Ram Receivers
train

I am sure i'm in the minority on this but I have doubts about sw skills. I just wonder if the injuries in buffalo took some of his speed or courage. while most think he quit on routes because he wasn't being targeted. I think he quit for fear of big hits. also most think an off season and full training camp will really improve him but i think we should have seen improvement during the season. I know that during the season they are installing game plans and don't have time to work with one player but he still should have picked up enough to show improvement. anyway i'm going to trust the coaching staff on this if they resign him I will be happy to be wrong.
 

Rabid Ram

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Primarily what i see here is Alot of opinion about a player op doesn't care for and more for a player op cares for that doesn't fit scheme.
 

kurtfaulk

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after they get to the bottom of his inability to work his way back to a ball. not every pass is gonna land a foot in front of him. sometimes a wr has to stop or slow down or fight for a deep ball. they need to find out why he point blank refuses to change speed or direction when a deep ball is thrown his way. must be frustrating for goff. maybe that's why he doesn't target him deep much.

.
 

So Ram

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after they get to the bottom of his inability to work his way back to a ball. not every pass is gonna land a foot in front of him. sometimes a wr has to stop or slow down or fight for a deep ball. they need to find out why he point blank refuses to change speed or direction when a deep ball is thrown his way. must be frustrating for goff. maybe that's why he doesn't target him deep much.

.

Tavon , Just is to small & not a good route runner. Can’t throw fades so CB’s can cheat on him.

Sammy Watkins I think your spot on with. Sort of mind boggling with his talent , that he quits so easy.

Copper Kupp takes to straight of an angle , cause for no separation on certain routes. Solid WR , but seems to get banged up a bit . The good thing about him is he just broke The RMs rookie record for receptions . Hard to believe?

Reynolds is a WR I’m really high on . He seems to always find a way to make plays . Like you say about Goff to Watkins. Reynolds is the opposite. He keeps working hard & Goff said after a TD play that that was all Reynolds on that play.
 

Adi

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Resign Watkins then trade him?

Number 1 Recievers are harder to find that a good CB. Just look at our team over the last decade.

I would never do that trade
 

VegasRam

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Nah I stopped after the first two sentences. Sorry.

Make that 3.

As to the OT, I am all in on Watkins, and really don’t give s fuck what he costs.

He’s the real deal, and while I am not blind to the apoarent disconnect between him and Goff, I think it’ll be fixed, and I think the reason’s been stated enough to where it doesn’t bear repeating.
 

So Ram

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Make that 3.

As to the OT, I am all in on Watkins, and really don’t give s freak what he costs.

He’s the real deal, and while I am not blind to the apoarent disconnect between him and Goff, I think it’ll be fixed, and I think the reason’s been stated enough to where it doesn’t bear repeating.

I guess you have to lock him up now ,forever give hold your peace.

Sammy should have been granted a 5th year like Aaron Donald . If Snead just only could’ve made that deal earlier.

The thing that most fans don’t recall is Greg Robinson was drafted before both Sammy Watkins and Aaron Donald Donald.

Sammy cost the Bills a 2014 (9th), & 2015 fist & 4th.

Still pisses me of The Rams could have kept trading back. Fisher should have said to call every team & let’s keep adding value Go work your magic Lea
 
Last edited:

dieterbrock

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Sammy should have been granted a 5th year like Aaron Donald . If Snead just only could’ve made that deal earlier.
Well, had Sammy not had his 5th year declined, he may not have been traded.
His option was declined 1st week of May, only a couple days after they drafted Zay Jones. He wasn’t traded until mid August
 

Prime Time

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The following article is a mess to read but essentially what he's saying, as far as I can tell, is that he doesn't have much hope for Sammy Watkins in 2018.
********************************************************
https://www.profootballfocus.com/ne...-watkins-unsustainable-touchdown-luck-of-2017

Sammy Watkins' unsustainable touchdown luck of 2017
BY DANIEL KELLEY

USATSI_10459051.jpg

Dec 3, 2017; Glendale, AZ, USA; Los Angeles Rams wide receiver Sammy Watkins (12) scores a touchdown during the second half against the Arizona Cardinals at University of Phoenix Stadium. Mandatory Credit: Matt Kartozian-USA TODAY Sports

Are you a tight end? Are you a 2011 Packers wide receiver? If you answered “yes” to either of those questions, then congratulations! There’s a chance you can maintain ridiculous touchdown luck multiple seasons in a row. If you answered “no” — and I’m sorry, Sammy Watkins, but we’ll get to that — you likely cannot.

Let’s back up a little. There are certain thresholds that signify receiving touchdown luck. Personally, my favorite is 10 percent. If you are scoring a touchdown on 10 percent of your targets, well, congrats on a nice season, but maybe don’t get too comfortable at that rate.

Since 2007, there have been 1,388 player-seasons with at least 50 targets. Of those, 64 have reached the 10-percent touchdown rate, ranging from 2011 Robert Meachem and 2010 Greg Jennings at exactly 10 percent up to 2014 Julius Thomas at exactly 20. That’s 64 of 1,388, or 4.6 percent of player-seasons. Let’s call that appropriately exclusive. Take out the 2017 seasons (because I want to look at the next year, and those guys haven’t had a next year), and it’s 60 of 1,265, 4.7 percent.

So, from 2007 to 2016, 60 players had a 10-percent touchdown rate on 50-plus targets. Of those 60, two (2012-13 Danario Alexander and 2013-14 Marvin Jones) did not play at all the next season. So 58, then. Those 58 players averaged 10.8 touchdowns on 87.12 targets (12.7 percent). A year later, that same group averaged 5.5 touchdowns on 83.8 targets (6.8 percent). Essentially, guys who score touchdowns at a 10-percent rate one year see that rate cut in half the next.

But there are exceptions to every rule. What players have broken the string, and reached a 10-percent touchdown rate in consecutive seasons? Well, let’s look:

Players with a 10% TD rate on 50+ targets consecutive years, 2007-2016
First year/ Second year
Player/ Year/ Tgt/ TD/ Rate/ Year/ Tgt/ TD/ Rate

Visanthe Shiancoe 2008 57 7 12.28% 2009 74 11 14.87%
Fred Davis 2009 65 7 10.77% 2010 28 3 10.71%
Kenny Britt 2010 66 9 13.64% 2011 25 3 12.00%
Rob Gronkowski 2010 57 10 17.54% 2011 121 17 14.05%
Rob Gronkowski 2011 121 17 14.05% 2012 77 11 14.29%
Donald Driver 2011 54 6 11.11% 2012 13 2 15.39%
James Jones 2011 54 7 12.96% 2012 93 14 15.05%
Julius Thomas 2013 88 12 13.64% 2014 60 12 20.00%
Tyler Eifert 2015 66 13 19.70% 2016 39 5 12.82%
For those following along at home, let’s break that group down:

  • Nine players total;
  • Six tight ends;
  • Two receivers on the 2011-12 Packers;
  • Four players who didn’t even get to 40 targets in the second year, so they wouldn’t qualify for the initial sample;
  • 2010-11 Kenny Britt, whose 2011 was basically a wash anyway.
In short: If you are a wide receiver who puts up ridiculous touchdown luck one year, the only way you’re likely to do it again is if you have Aaron Rodgersas your quarterback.

Sammy Watkins (probably) does not have Aaron Rodgers as his quarterback.

Sammy-Watkins.png


What does it mean for 2018? Four players qualified for our sample in 2017. Three (Tyler Kroft, Jimmy Graham, Kyle Rudolph) were tight ends, and while their production is unlikely to repeat in 2018, there’s at least precedent for them to do so. The fourth, as was so subtly hinted at above, was Sammy Watkins.

Watkins did not have a vintage Watkins year as a Ram. He put up his lowest PFF grade (76.2) since his rookie year, averaging only 4.7 targets per game (he averaged 7.2 in three years as a Bill) and tying with Ted Ginn as the No. 33 fantasy wide receiver. But where he lacked in yardage, he more than made up in scoring, as Watkins scored eight times on only 66 targets, good for an NFL-best 12.12-percent rate in 2017.

As we’ve seen above, wide receivers just don’t do that two years in a row. Watkins is a free agent this offseason, so it’s theoretically possible he lands with Aaron Rodgers, but it remains unlikely. Considering his injury history, it’s unlikely any team signs Watkins as its clear-cut No. 1 receiver, as he was in Buffalo.

Factoring in Watkins’ likely touchdown regression and the fact that he’s going to be one of multiple mouths to feed wherever he lands, and the Watkins who has been a top-30 WR draft commodity the last three years isn’t likely to appear in 2018. Instead, we will have a health-dependent flex option at best who is likely to see his scoring fall off this year. Tread carefully.
 

JKBOGEN

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  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
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Make that 3.

As to the OT, I am all in on Watkins, and really don’t give s freak what he costs.

He’s the real deal, and while I am not blind to the apoarent disconnect between him and Goff, I think it’ll be fixed, and I think the reason’s been stated enough to where it doesn’t bear repeating.
So you would pay him DeAndre Hopkins money when he's not even half of Hopkins?
 

majrleaged

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The following article is a mess to read but essentially what he's saying, as far as I can tell, is that he doesn't have much hope for Sammy Watkins in 2018.
********************************************************
https://www.profootballfocus.com/ne...-watkins-unsustainable-touchdown-luck-of-2017

Sammy Watkins' unsustainable touchdown luck of 2017
BY DANIEL KELLEY

USATSI_10459051.jpg

Dec 3, 2017; Glendale, AZ, USA; Los Angeles Rams wide receiver Sammy Watkins (12) scores a touchdown during the second half against the Arizona Cardinals at University of Phoenix Stadium. Mandatory Credit: Matt Kartozian-USA TODAY Sports

Are you a tight end? Are you a 2011 Packers wide receiver? If you answered “yes” to either of those questions, then congratulations! There’s a chance you can maintain ridiculous touchdown luck multiple seasons in a row. If you answered “no” — and I’m sorry, Sammy Watkins, but we’ll get to that — you likely cannot.

Let’s back up a little. There are certain thresholds that signify receiving touchdown luck. Personally, my favorite is 10 percent. If you are scoring a touchdown on 10 percent of your targets, well, congrats on a nice season, but maybe don’t get too comfortable at that rate.

Since 2007, there have been 1,388 player-seasons with at least 50 targets. Of those, 64 have reached the 10-percent touchdown rate, ranging from 2011 Robert Meachem and 2010 Greg Jennings at exactly 10 percent up to 2014 Julius Thomas at exactly 20. That’s 64 of 1,388, or 4.6 percent of player-seasons. Let’s call that appropriately exclusive. Take out the 2017 seasons (because I want to look at the next year, and those guys haven’t had a next year), and it’s 60 of 1,265, 4.7 percent.

So, from 2007 to 2016, 60 players had a 10-percent touchdown rate on 50-plus targets. Of those 60, two (2012-13 Danario Alexander and 2013-14 Marvin Jones) did not play at all the next season. So 58, then. Those 58 players averaged 10.8 touchdowns on 87.12 targets (12.7 percent). A year later, that same group averaged 5.5 touchdowns on 83.8 targets (6.8 percent). Essentially, guys who score touchdowns at a 10-percent rate one year see that rate cut in half the next.

But there are exceptions to every rule. What players have broken the string, and reached a 10-percent touchdown rate in consecutive seasons? Well, let’s look:

Players with a 10% TD rate on 50+ targets consecutive years, 2007-2016
First year/ Second year
Player/ Year/ Tgt/ TD/ Rate/ Year/ Tgt/ TD/ Rate

Visanthe Shiancoe 2008 57 7 12.28% 2009 74 11 14.87%
Fred Davis 2009 65 7 10.77% 2010 28 3 10.71%
Kenny Britt 2010 66 9 13.64% 2011 25 3 12.00%
Rob Gronkowski 2010 57 10 17.54% 2011 121 17 14.05%
Rob Gronkowski 2011 121 17 14.05% 2012 77 11 14.29%
Donald Driver 2011 54 6 11.11% 2012 13 2 15.39%
James Jones 2011 54 7 12.96% 2012 93 14 15.05%
Julius Thomas 2013 88 12 13.64% 2014 60 12 20.00%
Tyler Eifert 2015 66 13 19.70% 2016 39 5 12.82%
For those following along at home, let’s break that group down:

  • Nine players total;
  • Six tight ends;
  • Two receivers on the 2011-12 Packers;
  • Four players who didn’t even get to 40 targets in the second year, so they wouldn’t qualify for the initial sample;
  • 2010-11 Kenny Britt, whose 2011 was basically a wash anyway.
In short: If you are a wide receiver who puts up ridiculous touchdown luck one year, the only way you’re likely to do it again is if you have Aaron Rodgersas your quarterback.

Sammy Watkins (probably) does not have Aaron Rodgers as his quarterback.

Sammy-Watkins.png


What does it mean for 2018? Four players qualified for our sample in 2017. Three (Tyler Kroft, Jimmy Graham, Kyle Rudolph) were tight ends, and while their production is unlikely to repeat in 2018, there’s at least precedent for them to do so. The fourth, as was so subtly hinted at above, was Sammy Watkins.

Watkins did not have a vintage Watkins year as a Ram. He put up his lowest PFF grade (76.2) since his rookie year, averaging only 4.7 targets per game (he averaged 7.2 in three years as a Bill) and tying with Ted Ginn as the No. 33 fantasy wide receiver. But where he lacked in yardage, he more than made up in scoring, as Watkins scored eight times on only 66 targets, good for an NFL-best 12.12-percent rate in 2017.

As we’ve seen above, wide receivers just don’t do that two years in a row. Watkins is a free agent this offseason, so it’s theoretically possible he lands with Aaron Rodgers, but it remains unlikely. Considering his injury history, it’s unlikely any team signs Watkins as its clear-cut No. 1 receiver, as he was in Buffalo.

Factoring in Watkins’ likely touchdown regression and the fact that he’s going to be one of multiple mouths to feed wherever he lands, and the Watkins who has been a top-30 WR draft commodity the last three years isn’t likely to appear in 2018. Instead, we will have a health-dependent flex option at best who is likely to see his scoring fall off this year. Tread carefully.
More targets next year, at least same TDs
 

VegasRam

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So you would pay him DeAndre Hopkins money when he's not even half of Hopkins?
I'm not paying him anything. I'm saying if the Rams decide to pay him, I'm OK with it, regardless of his performance last year.
So a megacontract, maybe not so much, but wouldn't mind a tag. I just think he's worth taking a longer look at, even though he may cost more than his (Ram) performance to date would warrant.
 

BonifayRam

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I'm not paying him anything. I'm saying if the Rams decide to pay him, I'm OK with it, regardless of his performance last year.
So a megacontract, maybe not so much, but wouldn't mind a tag. I just think he's worth taking a longer look at, even though he may cost more than his (Ram) performance to date would warrant.

Sammy might have some competition getting that high Franchise Tag $$$ coming from UFA DB Lamarcus Joyner.
 

Corbin

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I’m starting to lean on drafting a CB, a let Watkins and Tru walk.

Is it me but I don’t get why everybody is talking mega WR contract here? His stats, playing etc isn’t like any other big time WR. His contact should be 6-10 mill a year tops but make in incentive loaded. I have a feeling he wants to be here. Tru IMO is all about the money. Going to be interesting in about a month.
 

So Ram

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Well, had Sammy not had his 5th year declined, he may not have been traded.
His option was declined 1st week of May, only a couple days after they drafted Zay Jones. He wasn’t traded until mid August

I know that. The Rams had also just drafted Copper Kupp , Josh Reynold.
Both played in Senior Bowl as well. Jones is the real deal as well.

I was very surprised McVay & Snead pulled off that trade. Sammy was an upgrade for sure. This Rams WR group is totally legit !! I’m not sure Sammy was worth the 2nd rd pick.

The franchise tag has its player value ? Control for a year is huge because the player has to perform to get his next big contract.

Want diss a franchise player bring back in compensation ? Does Tru bring back a 3rd rd pick ? Then next year would Sammy bring back the same ? Is he worth the big price tag under the cap this year ?

The salary cap is going to be The Rams biggest issue. They have found great talent.

Donald,Gurley,Goff .

My think was The Rams have Donald tied up for the next 3 years , but only true if they don’t have to franchise Gurley on his first year of FA eligibility .

Any - thanks for solid info. It’s going to be interesting on what happens in 4 weeks.