So, who initiated the tradeup for Goff?

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Rams43

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We’ll probably never know for sure.

But here’s my take, strictly from deductions made from things that I THINK I know.

Kroenke is a hands off owner. So it would be out of character for him to have initiated this trade idea, other than possibly in an offhand remark to Demoff. Maybe.

I seriously doubt that it was Fisher’s idea. He lacked the imagination or knowledge on O matters, preferring to focus on the D. I don’t think that either is disputable.

I kinda doubt that it was Demoff, either. He doesn’t involve himself in deciding personnel matters, preferring to sign the players that Snead and his HC request, where possible.

So, by a process of elimination, I deduce that it was most likely Snead’s idea.

Snead loves to trade and he’s darned good at it.
Snead was in the best position to recognize the talent in both Wentz and Goff and could see how it might translate to wins for the Rams.
Snead was in best position to know that QB talent didn’t look great in ‘17 where the Rams would likely pick, so timing was of the essence. Had to be in ‘16.
Snead knew that there would not likely be a winning season if the Rams stayed with the status quo, so SOMETHING had to be done.
Snead best knew that such a blockbuster trade could be accomplished without crippling the Rams for years, something that many could not see.

It was an “All In” move that required the blessing of Kroenke, Demoff, and Fisher. But I suspect that it was Snead that got the ball rolling in the first place.

Hindsight tells us that it was a brilliant move, no matter whose idea it was. Hindsight also tells us that it was but one of two brilliant necessary moves in order to return the Rams to playoff status. Cough, cough...
 

Ram65

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It was an “All In” move that required the blessing of Kroenke, Demoff, and Fisher. But I suspect that it was Snead that got the ball rolling in the first place.

Interesting topic on a slow day here thanks.

They may tell us one day. Here is another angle. It could have been Kronke and Demoff coming to Snead first. They knew moving to LA that some kind of move to get a QB would get some nice press and PR points for their Rams. The Rams didn't have a franchise QB or even a future QB. They could have asked Snead if there was a QB that could be a franchise QB in the 2016 draft. Snead could have said yes but, we have to move up etc.....Stan is a smart man. He knows when to step in a make something happen. This could have been the right time.
 

Riverumbbq

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Well, any number of scenarios are in order until the Rams themselves come forward with a statement. Besides the earlier assessments, I've also given some thought to Fisher using this as a method of pro-longing his career, in that a rookie QB unready or remaining on the bench offers an excuse for poor performance elsewhere. Ultimately, feeling under pressure to get our expensive new toy on the field, he pushed a guy without proper guidance or development into a situation almost guaranteeing failure. To spend the assets the Rams did on Goff without securing a top of the line QB whispering coach to mentor him is damn near criminal. Anyway, I wouldn't be surprised if this was one of the few combination Snead/Fisher collaborations, only that Fisher had absolutely no realistic means of developing such a quality offensive addition. jmo.
 

Merlin

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Snead already said the catalyst was his room at the draft being next to that of the Titans' GM. So I think that part is answered really.

The question from there is to what extent Fish was onboard. Did Snead use Demoff to strong arm him to take the QB? Or did Fish see the writing on the wall and knew he had to be a team player and not make a stink?

Either way logic dictates that Fisher wasn't a huge fan at least initially of taking a QB, not to mention trading up for one, in his fifth and decisive season where he knew a rook wasn't going to help him in wins & losses. Since he and Snead had a known rift at that point I would assume Demoff had to persuade him that it was for the future and that would be taken into account end of season wrt his contract status.

I remember Fish saying he felt like he wasn't in the plan for the new stadium. That stuck in my mind in his post-firing interview with someone, forget who. But that plus his "contract" that happened midseason makes it look like Stan paid him off and probably because he appreciated all he had done raising the bar a bit plus being a team guy. Gotta think at some point all the details will come out on that stuff.
 

LesBaker

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We already know it was Snead, he told the story about how the Rams and Titans were in close proximity at the combine and Snead floated the idea of trading since he correctly assumed they weren't going to use the #1 overall for a QB since they just got Mariotta. They were actually pretending to go to the bathroom so they could talk in the hallway about the deal!

In the last handful of years while people have been smashing Fisher and Snead I've maintained all along that IMO he is excellent. The Rams were some 7-9 bullshit that's true but how many teams win that many games with 2nd and 3rd string QB's unless there is other talent on the field. Look at the players Snead has added via trade and draft, it's a nice list. I give him credit for the years Fisher was here even though Fisher had final say because he was presenting the players to Fisher for him to consider and select from. So in essence those were his picks too. Good and bad.

If you remove the first year in LA, and by the way the Rams winning 4 games was a record for a team that moved in it's first year.......Fisher went 27-36 and with what the Rams had at QB there is no way you win that many games without talent elsewhere on the roster.

We are seeing the results now that the QB they selected is in place. It's been argued that the best thing to build a team is to build it and THEN go out and get the QB. And it's been argued that you get the QB and THEN add pieces. Right now I don't care, we got our guy!

People need to be reminded that PCooper and THemmingway came out of that trade via picks from the Titans too. We didn't mortgage the future and get nothing in return like people would have you believe.

Snead is fearless, perhaps the ballsiest GM I can remember. I've never seen someone so willing to make deals and move if he feels good about it.

@Merlin are you sure it was at the draft? The deal was done early April wasn't it?
 

thirteen28

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Snead already said the catalyst was his room at the draft being next to that of the Titans' GM. So I think that part is answered really.

@Merlin are you sure it was at the draft? The deal was done early April wasn't it?

They were next door to each other at the combine, that's where the talks started. They culminated with the trade going down in early April.
 

Bootleg

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Goff was Fisher's guy all the way. Snead may have arranged the nuts and bolts of the trade-up deal, but Fisher was on to Goff as early as 2014, and by 2015 thought Goff was something special.

Near the middle of the article is a story about Fisher and his son, while watching tape of another player, getting blown-away by Goff :
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...-la-rams-decided-on-jared-goff-with-no-1-pick
 

Riverumbbq

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After going back and googling several articles all dated April 14, 2016, it's amazing how many and how vehement many were about this being a completely lop-sided affair favoring Tennessee. On top of this, where many deemed Wentz as the better QB, again lop-sided opinion makers. While reading these various articles, I came across one which has two videos, one of Ian Rappaport & another by Mike Silver essentially approving Goff to L.A., with Silver's being especially forthright. Even the author of this piece suggests of the trade; "It is essentially the Rams' karmic payback for fleecing the Redskins back in 2012 for a treasure trove of picks that led to the selection of Robert Griffin III". Most were prejudging this trade as a poor move by L.A., but that's not why I bring you this article, i'd have you view the two videos which speak better for L.A. motivations. Sure, L.A. gave up several picks, but the 'karmic' universe is yet to judge the Goff/L.A. experience, although any number of former detractors examining Goff's 2'nd year in the league might be re-evaluating or second guessing their own talents.

Please check out the Rappaport & Silver videos here :

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...ams-trade-up-to-acquire-no-1-pick-from-titans


here Peter King dates trade talks back to March 28 :

https://www.si.com/mmqb/2016/04/14/titans-rams-draft-trade-number-1-pick
 
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BeefJurky

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I'm almost certain Fisher did not want Goff.
I think around the time of the preseason after Goff was drafted this was pretty apparent and heavily rumored.
 

Merlin

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They were next door to each other at the combine, that's where the talks started. They culminated with the trade going down in early April.

Memory fail. But the combine demonstrates the point even better lol.
 

Merlin

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Remember this? Still cracks me the F up loooooool:

goffart-900x505.jpg
 

kurtfaulk

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I'm almost certain Fisher did not want Goff.
I think around the time of the preseason after Goff was drafted this was pretty apparent and heavily rumored.

i agree. i think he was told this is who we're getting and he had to play along.

.
 

LARams_1963

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I was talking with a guy during our Redskins tailgate. His daughter was somehow tied into the Fisher family, can't remember how for sure. Anyways, he said at a family function (since Fish was canned) he had the chance to chat with Fish. He didn't ask the direct question that was asked by the OP, but he did have a conversation about Goff with Fish. Basically the guy said Fish was completely gaga over Goff. Fish also referenced the tryout in the rain that Goff had and talked about how blown away he was by Goff. I think, it was a group decision, but Fish gave his seal of approval.
 

fearsomefour

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Its easy to assume and love up on Snead because it is working out.
If Goff was a bust instead of busting out Im sure a fair amount of blame would go all over.....so, I am going to make assumptions the other way.....all the credit goes to Fisher with an assist from Jared Cook.
 

Young Ram

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It was Fisher and Co. He was forced to play backup QBs for the majority of his stint here mostly due to injuries. He knew he needed a franchise guy and traded up and got him in Goff. Unfortunately for him it was too little too late and his offensive coaches certainly didn’t do him any favors. That falls on his shoulders though.

I know many here hate Fish but I am glad he was our coach because he rebuilt the roster and brought in some good to great players.
 

UKram

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I think fisher wanted no part of Goff ... and the only thing I base my assumption off is the way the kid was treated when he came in

The first game back in LA against our divisional rival whiners the hometown kid the number one overall pick in the NFL draft MONDAY NIGHT FOOTBALL .the entire football world would be watching ... and he didn’t even dress the kid ... I think it was a bit of dick swinging by Jeff .. you can make me pick but you can’t make me play him

I think he honestly would have stuck with case if he could have got away with it ..but fans were calling for Goff after seeing how well Dak and Wentz were doing and the pressure got to him
 

CGI_Ram

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I hate to give the boring answer, but it was likely a team decision that involved all of them.

The team would have completed their roster review and graded their needs. They would have discussed all the likely offseason scenarios, players to retain, free agents they’d have interest, and prioritized the holes on the roster.

When they poked around with Tennessee they got a good indication that something could probably be worked out. That’s probably where Snead took over.

Given the appeal of Goff (and perhaps Wentz too) it was probably just a matter of if the deal could be made reasonably, given QB was probably the number one priority.

I’m sure there were a lot of inputs. Among them the QB class and their projection for that position in the coming drafts... and the proximity to the #1 spot... and they dynamic that Tennessee already had a QB.

The strategy of football is fascinating. It’s among the reasons I love this sport. The strategy of building a team, retaining players / cap philosophy, the draft, and the game day matchup strategies. One strategy after another.
 

jap

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It was Fisher and Co. He was forced to play backup QBs for the majority of his stint here mostly due to injuries. He knew he needed a franchise guy and traded up and got him in Goff. Unfortunately for him it was too little too late and his offensive coaches certainly didn’t do him any favors. That falls on his shoulders though.

I know many here hate Fish but I am glad he was our coach because he rebuilt the roster and brought in some good to great players.

I was not a fan of The Fisher King when he was selected as our HC. I still remember after our Horns beat his Titans in the SB how Fish played us really hard the following pre-season, as though it was a damn playoff game---keeping his starters in really late against our 2nd stringers in an all out effort to defeat us in a totally meaningless game! SoI was not happy about him coming to Saint Lou.

Nevertheless, Fish played both defense and special teams in Chicago and understood those units exceedingly well. The arms buildup on defense whether by draft, trade, or FA signings (Brockers, Aaron Donald, 'Tree, Mark Barron, Tru, Lamarcus Joyner, etc) and special teams (Johnny Hekker, Greg the Leg, Jake McQuiade) was accomplished under his regime.

In a league whose rules are biased towards QB play, you have to know something about QBs, even if it is only a dim recognition of great play . . . regardless of whether one has the acumen to distinguish the underlying elements that constitute great QB play. And so it was that The Fisher King reached out to his NFL coaching/personnel contacts to inquire about viability of Sam Bradford as an NFL starting QB and was told Sam was the real deal talent-wise. It was the presence of Sam the Ram that tipped Fish towards signing with the Horns over other team candidates.

Fish's flaw was his inability to know how to use offensive pieces well and his stubborn insistence on laying his heavy hands on the offensive scheming---no matter how bad or gifted the offensive coordinator was. This virtually nullified any attempt to sign well qualified OC talent as none of the better offensive strategists were willing to have their work sullied by The Fisher King's interference. So we had solid defenses and special teams with a sprinkling of offensive talent via Fish (Todd Gurley, Rob 'Jaws' Havenstein, Tavon Austin, Greg Robinson! [Oops!!!]).

Everything imploded in 2016 with the relegation of the Golden Arm to the bench while journeyman Case Keenum was chosen to lead the Horns as a starting QB. Case hung tough until his glaring limitations forced him to the bench and the NFL green Golden Arm was tossed to the wolves without a solid coaching foundation to stand on. Fish was removed from is throne, but his defensive and special teams legacy remains.