Sam Or Cutler?

[mr.stlouis]

Trust me, I've posted on other boards where the majority might pick Jay... :cray:

Well those guys are smoke crack for a hobby so there...

 

[NJRamsFan]

How did I question your fandom? I questioned your accuracy and the validity of your statements.

And if your response to my post is "you guys are right, Bradford is da gawd, blah blah blah", then you're not doing much to bolster your original assertion. That's just using sarcasm to discredit all the work I did to debate you. That won't get you very far on any board. Never mind this one. And the fact that I made this one (board) has nothing to do with how I met your claims with arguments of my own. I don't even own it anymore, so now you have even less reason to call me out personally. Stick to the topic at hand and see if you can stay on point. You made some statements you regarded as truths, and I debunked them using your own standards of measure. You can take it from there, or not. It's really up to you.

so how is bradford BETTER...? because he was close to cutler in an injury year for both? or because his 2 best years stack up with cutlers worst? And anyone claiming I'm saying cutler IS elite is reading what they want to read...over and over I've said he has shown he is capable of performing at an elite level when bradford hasn't

i was thrilled at the season bradford was having this year but irregardless he didn't finish it...he only threw 14 tds this year...he had like 1500 yds...was he on pace to put up good numbers? yes...but is this a good season...no...

Bradford might be better over time but that remains to be seen and none of us know for sure but to say he's better now...i just don't see it...the numbers are close...thats fine...the wins aren't and obviously that blame doesn't fall solely on bradford however it doesn't excuse him none the less..

 

[moklerman]

How did I question your fandom? I questioned your accuracy and the validity of your statements.

And if your response to my post is "you guys are right, Bradford is da gawd, blah blah blah", then you're not doing much to bolster your original assertion. That's just using sarcasm to discredit all the work I did to debate you. That won't get you very far on any board. Never mind this one. And the fact that I made this one (board) has nothing to do with how I met your claims with arguments of my own. I don't even own it anymore, so now you have even less reason to call me out personally. Stick to the topic at hand and see if you can stay on point. You made some statements you regarded as truths, and I debunked them using your own standards of measure. You can take it from there, or not. It's really up to you.

I'm sorry, but as good as this post is I liked it when you had your Lebowski avatar better. Picturing the Dude saying all of this with a "beverage" in one hand is just that much more entertaining.

 

[Mister Sin]

I'm sorry, but as good as this post is I liked it when you had your Lebowski avatar better. Picturing the Dude saying all of this with a "beverage" in one hand is just that much more entertaining.

Hahaha i shit you not,
I was saying the same damn thing to myself. Paul....let's bring the dude back

 

[mr.stlouis]

It's not just other boards. Listen to ESPN101, Neil Rackers, Venturi, Cary Davis, all have given up on Bradford. And there are other guys on other stations saying dump Sam and draft a QB. It's not overwhelming in favor of Bradford.

Thank goodness, it all comes to a head this year.

My ONLY question mark on Sam is whether or not he'a durable. Other than the he's a dam good QB. That's why I've placed a high priority on drafting a developmental, QB who has all the tools, just in case Sam gets injured again.

 

[LesBaker]

As a point of refernce, this poll is being run on another board simultaniously.

Currently here is stands 43 to 2 Sam.

And there?

25/18 Sam.

It shows you the type of trolls and haters allowed to infest what was once a very good board.

Its ok to voice your opinion either way but when one "croonie" chimes in and you can close your eyes and see the next of his posse coming and spewing venom....it erodes and divides a board.

People that don't agree with your opinions on Bradford aren't all trolls and haters.

Many of them are smart football posters who aren't as high on Bradford as you have been since he was in college.

 

[Alan]

NJRamsFan rejoining the fray:
so how is bradford BETTER...? because he was close to cutler in an injury year for both? or because his 2 best years stack up with cutlers worst? And anyone claiming I'm saying cutler IS elite is reading what they want to read...over and over I've said he has shown he is capable of performing at an elite level when bradford hasn't

i was thrilled at the season bradford was having this year but irregardless he didn't finish it...he only threw 14 tds this year...he had like 1500 yds...was he on pace to put up good numbers? yes...but is this a good season...no...

Bradford might be better over time but that remains to be seen and none of us know for sure but to say he's better now...i just don't see it...the numbers are close...thats fine...the wins aren't and obviously that blame doesn't fall solely on bradford however it doesn't excuse him none the less..

I'm not speaking for X but the part I bolded is why I would rather have SB over Cutler. BTW, I don't actually remember X saying he was better. I only remember him refuting your statement that Cutler is obviously better and that it's not debatable. Everything is debatable and when you say it isn't you've got immediate problems with virtually everyone because you are no longer stating your opinion but claiming something as fact. But lets leave that aside and move on to why I prefer SB.

We've seen what Cutler is capable of and as you yourself mentioned, we haven't yet seen what SB is capable of. We got a small glimpse of it before he suffered an injury and that heartened all of us. Or at least most of us.

So X posted a bunch of stats that basically showed they were pretty even stat wise. That should have shown you two things. The question of who is better is obviously debatable and they are pretty evenly matched as of now.

Secondly Cutler's ceiling is known and Sam's isn't. If they are arguably pretty even right now then who has the most upside ? Who might turn out to be very good given the same advantages that Cutler has had in his career if given the chance?

On the other hand, Cutler has also played behind some really atrocious O-lines and has still performed well considering. The point here is that though I think Sam has much more upside than Cutler the subject is very, very debatable. If you approach this with that in mind then things will go swimmingly even if you don't in the end come to an agreement on the subject.

 

[-X-]

so how is bradford BETTER...?

How is he not?

See, that's subjective, isn't it? You used stats, and so did I. Now you want to say they don't matter because they were both injured this year. Do you honestly think they both landed in parallel universes where the situations around them were identical? If you want to know how Bradford is BETTER, you'll have to take an impartial poll of over a thousand people and compile the data. But even then, the reasons for one or the other will be entirely subjective.

For me, I think Bradford is far more accurate on every level, smarter with the football, and his arm is every bit as strong. Both Cutler and Bradford are pocket passers who rely on said pocket to perform at peak efficiency, so all they need are reliable targets. At some point Bradford might get receivers like Brandon Marshall or Eddie Royal, but he's been cycling through receivers for 4 years now and he's closing in on 40 (FORTY) different receivers with over 30 O-linemen over that span. Has Cutler had to do that?

Take a look at Bradford's QB Rating when he had Danario Alexander, Mark Clayton, Brandon Lloyd and Danny Amendola to throw to. It's markedly better than the times where he had none of those guys. And you need look no further than how Brady (as an individual) did with no targets. Or Eli. Or Luck without Wayne. Or any other QB who had all the tools, but no one on the other end of the field to complete the tandem.

And really, the whole idea that one or the other is better is moot. Cutler wouldn't have won very many more games for the Rams. In all likelihood, I'd be expending just as much energy defending Cutler from the undue criticism directed at him over these past few years if HE had been the QB of the Rams. Because, IMO, there's far more that contributes to a QB's success than how good a quarterback he is. Unless he's just not very good. And we know what not very good looks like. Clemens, Boller, Null, Feeley, Berlin, Martin, Banks, Martin, Walsh, etc.

I've seen every throw (multiple times) that Bradford ever made as a Ram, and I've documented it in video over the years. Others here have done the same (like Jrry). There are good throws, great throws, phenomenal throws, and bad throws. Very, very rarely do you see him making a horrible throw. If I did the same for Cutler, I might come away with the opinion that they're very comparable. But I doubt it. I've seen enough horrible throws during my cursory study of him to know that Bradford clearly has the better arm talent. If Bradford had Cutler's escapability, it wouldn't even be close who the better QB is.

Now. Can you prove me wrong?

 

[LesBaker]

X I didn't know you sold the board.

When and to whom?

 

[-X-]

X I didn't know you sold the board.

When and to whom?

About a month ago, I guess. See how my title no longer says "Administrator"? I'm just a regular Joe.
PhxRam holds the pink slip now.

 

[Alan]

He was bought out by Google. They made him an offer he couldn't refuse. I can't go into any more detail than that. eek:

He's putting out a cover story that involves PhxRam but we both know that's not true.

 

[Rams and Gators]

He was bought out by Google. They made him an offer he couldn't refuse. I can't go into any more detail than that. eek:

He's putting out a cover story that involves PhxRam but we both know that's not true.

Damn, so expect the site to be bombard with adverts any day now :shifty:.

 

[Tron]

He was bought out by Google. They made him an offer he couldn't refuse. I can't go into any more detail than that. eek:

I heard Google offered him Seahawks season tickets and a Russell Wilson jersey....eek:

 

[mr.stlouis]

How is he not?

See, that's subjective, isn't it? You used stats, and so did I. Now you want to say they don't matter because they were both injured this year. Do you honestly think they both landed in parallel universes where the situations around them were identical? If you want to know how Bradford is BETTER, you'll have to take an impartial poll of over a thousand people and compile the data. But even then, the reasons for one or the other will be entirely subjective.

For me, I think Bradford is far more accurate on every level, smarter with the football, and his arm is every bit as strong. Both Cutler and Bradford are pocket passers who rely on said pocket to perform at peak efficiency, so all they need are reliable targets. At some point Bradford might get receivers like Brandon Marshall or Eddie Royal, but he's been cycling through receivers for 4 years now and he's closing in on 40 (FORTY) different receivers with over 30 O-linemen over that span. Has Cutler had to do that?

Take a look at Bradford's QB Rating when he had Danario Alexander, Mark Clayton, Brandon Lloyd and Danny Amendola to throw to. It's markedly better than the times where he had none of those guys. And you need look no further than how Brady (as an individual) did with no targets. Or Eli. Or Luck without Wayne. Or any other QB who had all the tools, but no one on the other end of the field to complete the tandem.

And really, the whole idea that one or the other is better is moot. Cutler wouldn't have won very many more games for the Rams. In all likelihood, I'd be expending just as much energy defending Cutler from the undue criticism directed at him over these past few years if HE had been the QB of the Rams. Because, IMO, there's far more that contributes to a QB's success than how good a quarterback he is. Unless he's just not very good. And we know what not very good looks like. Clemens, Boller, Null, Feeley, Berlin, Martin, Banks, Martin, Walsh, etc.

I've seen every throw (multiple times) that Bradford ever made as a Ram, and I've documented it in video over the years. Others here have done the same (like Jrry). There are good throws, great throws, phenomenal throws, and bad throws. Very, very rarely do you see him making a horrible throw. If I did the same for Cutler, I might come away with the opinion that they're very comparable. But I doubt it. I've seen enough horrible throws during my cursory study of him to know that Bradford clearly has the better arm talent. If Bradford had Cutler's escapability, it wouldn't even be close who the better QB is.

Now. Can you prove me wrong?

Dang, X...

You just lit him up. Whoever cannot see you're right after that post is smoking the wrong stuff. I mean really... Lol

 

[RFIP]

People that don't agree with your opinions on Bradford aren't all trolls and haters.

Many of them are smart football posters who aren't as high on Bradford as you have been since he was in college.

SOME of them are smart posters, many of them are trolls and idiots. That's not my opinion, that is a fact.

 

[Alan]

It's even worse than you think guys. Have you taken a look at his new house. I'm not saying he sold out to big corporate interests but...well you be the judge. Just another Joe. Ha!

Google maps

 

[Rams and Gators]

 

[LesBaker]

SOME of them are smart posters, many of them are trolls and idiots. That's not my opinion, that is a fact.

It's your "opinion" that it's a "fact".

Not everyone likes Bradford the way you do and posters in a lot of cases expected more. That just clashes with your view.

 

[LesBaker]

About a month ago, I guess. See how my title no longer says "Administrator"? I'm just a regular Joe.
PhxRam holds the pink slip now.

Why didn't you go public.....I'd have purchased a share.

 

[-X-]

Why didn't you go public.....I'd have purchased a share.

I've never been in it for the money. You know that.