Ray Lewis explains why elite quarterbacks are less valuable than dominant defensive players

[CGI_Ram]

http://www.foxsports.com/nfl/galler...luable-than-dominant-defensive-players-062017

Ray Lewis explains why elite quarterbacks are less valuable than dominant defensive players

Pro Football Focus released their ranking of the top 50 players in the NFL heading into the 2017 season — and two defensive studs edged Patriots quarterback Tom Brady at the top of the list.

According to Pro Football Focus, Rams star Aaron Donald is the best player in the NFL, followed by J.J. Watt. Brady, a five-time champion, was listed third.

On Tuesday's episode of "Undisputed," Ray Lewis, Shannon Sharpe and Skip Bayless reacted to the ranking.

Ray Lewis: The most important player on the defensive side of the ball is the closest player to the quarterback

“Look, I can be a little biased because I’ve always argued that defensive players should be rated higher. When you think about … the most important player on the offensive side of the ball is obviously he quarterback, right?

The most important player on the defensive side of the ball is the closest player to the quarterback. Right? A lot of people don’t think about that.

I’ve watched this from a personal experience. What am I talking about? I played behind one of the most dominant D-tackles in all of football, which was Warren Sapp. I played behind him at the University of Miami, and I never saw dominance like that.

When I started to see what his dominance was, I started to understand that … wow, he actually makes my job easier. When he goes, it’s a whole other conversation.”

Ray Lewis: Aaron Donald is the type of player that wins you a championship

“I got into the league. Our first Super Bowl, the most dominant piece on our defense was Sam Adams. When Sam Adams was ready to play football, I don’t care who it was, he was unblockable.

So you watch Aaron Donald, you watch J.J. Watt. Now let me just be very up front: J.J. Watt [played] three games last year, coming back … I don’t know if I put him [there], you can not put that guy up there. But now we’re in a different world, because it’s a world of popularity now, a world of social media. That’s who is ‘crowning’ people now.

But you talk about Aaron Donald, his body of work since he came into the National Football League. When you talk about pure dominance, from a linebacker standpoint, what it looks like … this is why this piece is so crucial. The reason why I’m really excited that someone sat down and watched enough film to see what that dominance looks like is because that’s where most championships are really won — in the trenches.”

Ray Lewis: J.J. Watt needs to prove he's still the same player

“J.J. Watt, healthy, he’s one of the most unblockable people ever. Why?

If you watch J.J. Watt enough, you say ‘now how in the hell … ?’ You can’t block J.J. Watt. Why? Because J.J. Watt says, ‘Take the game out of it, I’m talking about a one-on-one battle that you have to deal with me.’

Most D-linemen are going to be quicker than the offensive linemen. Some of them are stronger than offensive linemen — and that’s where I think the gems are found. When you find an Aaron Donald, who has a motor like that, or you find a J.J. Watt.”

Troy Taormina Troy Taormina-USA TODAY Sports

 

[Barrison]

It's easier to destroy something, then it is to create.

 

[DaveFan'51]

I find absolutely nothing to argue about in what Ray Lewis has to say on this subject! When he's right, he's right! People like Aaron Donald don't come around very often!
The last time the Rams had such a dominant "DT" was " Merlin Olsen"!!

 

[Soul Surfer]

Man, I wish they would lock up Donald with a new contract.

The suspense is killing me.

 

[BonifayRam]

I agree with this article.

As a long time NFL fan watching & diving deep into most things NFL Its apparent to me that if I were a GM I would be drafting heavy early each draft primarily centering in on defensive players. Teams selecting highly drafted players in the first & 2nd days of the draft ...a defensive player can usually go to work day one & produce @ a much higher rate than most all offensive players with some rare exceptions like RB's. The D's earn their paychecks while the O's often than not just play like .

I will go back to some of our past Ram drafts here: 2012 draft where the Rams drafted 6 players 3 (O's)& 3 (D's)with their first 6 selection in rounds 1 thru 4. The D's Brockers/ JJ & Tru all pretty much started & were outstanding picks. The 3 (O's) Quick/ Pead & Givens:huh:.

Take a look @ 2013, 2 first round picks (O) TA who was a #8 overall pick & (O)Tree who was a very late #30 pick. Tree started day1 & has produced playing SSLB, then WSLB & then MLB the last four seasons. The (O) player has yet to play to the level of tree as they move into their 5th seasons. In addition look at the next 2 players selected (D) TJ McDonald & (O) Stedman Bailey. The D started day one & produced @ a high level for 4 seasons when healthy.

2014 (O) GRob vs (D) AD event both high first round picks same draft & look at the difference in production. Different as night & day the (D) dominant in early production of the defensive player. Going deeper into the 2nd day of the 2014 draft Rams drafted (O) Mason & 2 (D's) Joyner & Alexander. I'll let you figure out who has produced more & who has the brighter future going forward.

The 2015 Ram draft was pure offense thus ONLY 2 of the 9 picks are considered starters. Both are coming off bad sophomore slumps too. Snead still retain 6 of these O picks going into their 3rd season but the only D player of this draft Hager a 7th rd LB'er has been a ST ace & played in all of our goal line defense since his arrival. Hager also is the first off the bench reserve for Tree the last 2 season. Snead is still waiting on those O's to consistently produce.

Of the six 2016 draft selections all but 1 were O's. The 1 D, a 6th rd LB'er Josh Forrest came in as a rookie & claimed our starting SSLB'er post.Rotating with Nickle Joyner. Forrest produced nicely until his ACL tear injury. Josh IMO has a bright future here & could replace starter Mark Barron with his 10 million cap hit in 2018 when the Rams will be looking under couch cushions for coins to pay Aaron Donald & Alec Ogletree.Meanwhile the rest of those 2016 offensive picks languished in mediocrity @ best.

The fact that these young offensive players take so much time to produce particularly the OL'ers in our modern times due to the NFL Collective Bargaining Agreement (CBA). A ton of cap $$ put into non productive O players is close to a crime on use of the limited cap funds.

Rams have a full contingent of draft selections in 2018 based on the above I wound be very reluctant to select an Offensive left OT in the first half of the first round & repeat the above of the last 6 drafts listed above. I would lean the most dominating defensive corner or DL (in case the Aaron Donald matter goes sour) to fit Wade D to replace the 31 million $$ departing CB Trumaine Johnson or possibly AD. Once the first day has concluded I making a OLT my #1 find on day two.

 

[Merlin]

I am not a fan of Lewis, but that said I do like the way he sees the game. And I do agree the game is won in the trenches, there are plenty of examples of high flying offenses being grounded in the playoffs due to that equation.

I hope the Rams sign Donald because he's not only a great player, but a guy who isn't going to put his feet up when he gets his big check. And also because interior DL pass rushers are one of the rarest commodities in the game. But again there is a point where you have to look at the long term health of the organization, where if you go too far on his contract you can hurt the team. Just don't do that. And hopefully Aaron meets them somewhere that both sides are comfortable with.

 

[Rambitious1]

I like what Ray is saying but I disagree.....somewhat.
For a defensive player to be more valuable than an 'elite' QB - he would have to be an all time obviously best player by a wide margin. IMHO we have never seen that.

The QB handles the ball on every snap (outside of the wildcat) on offense. An elite QB has too much to do with the offense to be 'less' valuable than a 'dominant' defensive player that does not directly impact each and every defensive play. And while you do need a good defense to win a championship you must score points to win. And the vast majority of scoring is done with the offense.

Lastly, the 99 Rams did not have a 'dominant' defensive player, but they did have an elite QB. They had a bunch of really good ones, but no 'dominant' defensive player. I realize the 2000 Ravens won, but that was a great defense AND I argue the best teams in the NFC that year (Rams, Bucs) choked, so the Ravens got a not that great Giants team to play in the Super Bowl.

JMHO

 

[DaveFan'51]

I like what Ray is saying but I disagree.....somewhat.
For a defensive player to be more valuable than an 'elite' QB - he would have to be an all time obviously best player by a wide margin. IMHO we have never seen that.

The QB handles the ball on every snap (outside of the wildcat) on offense. An elite QB has too much to do with the offense to be 'less' valuable than a 'dominant' defensive player that does not directly impact each and every defensive play. And while you do need a good defense to win a championship you must score points to win. And the vast majority of scoring is done with the offense.

Lastly, the 99 Rams did not have a 'dominant' defensive player, but they did have an elite QB. They had a bunch of really good ones, but no 'dominant' defensive player. I realize the 2000 Ravens won, but that was a great defense AND I argue the best teams in the NFC that year (Rams, Bucs) choked, so the Ravens got a not that great Giants team to play in the Super Bowl.

JMHO

You are entitled to your opinion, and I respect that. But I disagree! How many QB's did Merlin Olsen survive in his career with the Rams!
And then you have Jackie Slater too! Football games are Won in the Trenches! SB's have been Won with Average QB's! But they Had Great men in the Trenches!

 

[BonifayRam]

I like what Ray is saying but I disagree.....somewhat.
For a defensive player to be more valuable than an 'elite' QB - he would have to be an all time obviously best player by a wide margin. IMHO we have never seen that.

The QB handles the ball on every snap (outside of the wildcat) on offense. An elite QB has too much to do with the offense to be 'less' valuable than a 'dominant' defensive player that does not directly impact each and every defensive play. And while you do need a good defense to win a championship you must score points to win. And the vast majority of scoring is done with the offense.

Lastly, the 99 Rams did not have a 'dominant' defensive player, but they did have an elite QB. They had a bunch of really good ones, but no 'dominant' defensive player. I realize the 2000 Ravens won, but that was a great defense AND I argue the best teams in the NFC that year (Rams, Bucs) choked, so the Ravens got a not that great Giants team to play in the Super Bowl.JMHO

Your post has good merit with an Hall Of Fame QB like Kurt & Marshall. I got to thinking how many SB's did we win with with an unbelievable stacked amount of dominant & pro bowl offensive players ?

I tend to get into the weeds a bit & say the Ram "D" back in those wining seasons did not have a dominating player like you said i.e. AD but they did have a very large cadre of good defensive starters who did get selected to Pro Bowls & named First-Team All-Pro's like Todd Lyght, London Fletcher, Kevin Carter & Leonard Little to name a few. When you add in other D players like Keith Lyle, D'Marco Farr , Ray Agnew, Grant Wistrom, Mike Jones & Dre Bly well It would be hard for me to say otherwise that the Defenses sure played a major role with our winning success during those seasons.

One last element into this discussion ....who secured the Rams only SB Championship with " The Tackle" ?:heh:

 

[Memphis Ram]

Is it just me or does the title to this piece seem a bit off?

Besides, Reggie White didn't get his ring until he got on a team with Brett Farve at QB.

 

[DaveFan'51]

You are entitled to your opinion, and I respect that. But I disagree! How many QB's did Merlin Olsen survive in his career with the Rams!
And then you have Jackie Slater too! Football games are Won in the Trenches! SB's have been Won with Average QB's! But they Had Great men in the Trenches!

Just as an after thought on this^ " Remember Trent Dilfer!" I rest my case!

 

[CGI_Ram]

I like what Ray is saying but I disagree.....somewhat.
For a defensive player to be more valuable than an 'elite' QB - he would have to be an all time obviously best player by a wide margin. IMHO we have never seen that.

The QB handles the ball on every snap (outside of the wildcat) on offense. An elite QB has too much to do with the offense to be 'less' valuable than a 'dominant' defensive player that does not directly impact each and every defensive play. And while you do need a good defense to win a championship you must score points to win. And the vast majority of scoring is done with the offense.

Lastly, the 99 Rams did not have a 'dominant' defensive player, but they did have an elite QB. They had a bunch of really good ones, but no 'dominant' defensive player. I realize the 2000 Ravens won, but that was a great defense AND I argue the best teams in the NFC that year (Rams, Bucs) choked, so the Ravens got a not that great Giants team to play in the Super Bowl.

JMHO

Yeah, I don't see how any position is considered more valuable than the QB.

Don't get me wrong, there can be dominant players at other positions that take over games... but not to the same degree or frequency as the QB.

 

[So Ram]

Bryant Young was a stud. When he was on his game , know one could stop them on defense.

Gilbert Brown was as underrated of a DT as I can remember. Just like The Fridge & Wilfork from NE. In fact he played so well this year that Houstons defense didn't miss JJ Watt as much.

 

[1maGoh]

I like how he brings up Donald as more valuable than an elite qb, but we didn't even have a winning season any of the last 3 years. The last time we had an elite qb we did. Haven't had one since he left (or we kicked him out, whatever).

 

[Soul Surfer]

Reggie White didn't get his ring until he got on a team with Brett Farve at QB.

Yeah. You are right.

NO WAY Fav-re gets that ring without Reggie White leading that D!

 

[OldSchool]

Just as an after thought on this^ " Remember Trent Dilfer!" I rest my case!

For every 1 Dilfer there are dozens of elite QB's that have won the SB with average defenses. I think to generalize a SB winning team to one player on either side of the ball is really doing an injustice to a great team sport.

 

[DaveFan'51]

For every 1 Dilfer there are dozens of elite QB's that have won the SB with average defenses. I think to generalize a SB winning team to one player on either side of the ball is really doing an injustice to a great team sport.

That sure wasn't my intent! I just wanted to point out, it happens!!

 

[Rambitious1]

Just as an after thought on this^ " Remember Trent Dilfer!" I rest my case!

Yep. I mentioned the Ravens in my post and the reasons why I think they won.

 

[So Ram]

Yeah. You are right.

NO WAY Fav-re gets that ring without Reggie White leading that D!

Randal was a heck of a QB . Jerome Brown was going to be one of the best ever. Thomas the LB from KC was one of the greats.

 

[tempests]

Is it just me or does the title to this piece seem a bit off?

It is. Ray does think D > O, but most of what he's saying here is that interior defensive lineman are what make good defenses tick.