2016-Rams trade up to #1 (old thread)

[Boston Ram]

So, let me get this straight...

You think the Redskins are a good team? They beat the Rams so the Rams stink.

That is amazing logic.

The Redskins have been to the playoffs twice since that trade and ended up cutting the guy. They got nothing. But if you think that makes them a winner the oooookaaaay.

The Rams beat Wash when RG3 was still the second coming and made him cry like a bitch.

I think the Rams have a lot more talent. And you must admit... even if you are being a bit obtuse, that head to head, any team can beat any team and it is not necessarily indicative of how good that team is overall. So you think that the RG3 trade didn't hurt the Redskins? Why are so many Redskins fans unhappy? Do you really think Cousins is a franchise QB?

You can disagree if you like. The Rams would have won that division. It was very weak.

And the Rams are not stupid.

Why would you say something like that?

You know that I was talking about personnel decisions by guys who either get lucky and make the right choice so they can be geniuses or they make the wrong choice and they are stupid and out of a job. (just a little sprinkle of sarcasm there, but I thought that was an accepted fact in the NFL?)

Yes I think Washington is good. Never once did I say the Rams stunk or were stupid, so please get the facts straight. If there is any confusion about this please refer to my original post because I still think tou may have misread it.

So let me be clear as you seem to want to twist my words. The Griffen trade did not cripple the franchise. Did it work out as planned? No. But they recovered and were a playoff team last year. The point is if the player the Rams select does not pan out it does not mean they are screwed for the next 5 years.

I do completely agree with your last paragraph! There was some sarcasm in my last post too lol. But yes one trade can make you a genius or moron, hope our guys look like genius' after this.

 

[Mackeyser]

Compensatory picks are not tradeable though.

They will be after this year.

 

[Ramatik]

Yes I think Washington is good. Never once did I say the Rams stunk or were stupid, so please get the facts straight. If there is any confusion about this please refer to my original post because I still think tou may have misread it.

So let me be clear as you seem to want to twist my words. The Griffen trade did not cripple the franchise. Did it work out as planned? No. But they recovered and were a playoff team last year. The point is if the player the Rams select does not pan out it does not mean they are screwed for the next 5 years.

I do completely agree with your last paragraph! There was some sarcasm in my last post too lol. But yes one trade can make you a genius or moron, hope our guys look like genius' after this.

Funny, because I feel like you are twisting my words.

Okay, bottom line is. Washington got hurt by the RG3 Trade. That is my opinion. They were a lame duck playoff team that really wasn't good enough to ever be there, but there were in the lousiest division in the league, so they got to step in there for a moment. Washington is extremely lucky they got themselves a decent qb in the fourth round. He's not franchise qb, but he's serviceable right now as they try to plug holes.

If this doesn't work out, the Rams will be back to starting all over again. Maybe that's the point of my whole bunch of posts. I HATE rebuilding. And if this doesn't work out, Fisher/Snead get fired, new guys come in, new philosophies, new personnel... you know, we've been there before.

BUT, I think what you are saying is what I need to do. In the context that this is a great move, things are going to be great and this was the right thing to do and we're getting a franchise quarterback for our punishing running game and our nasty defense.

I did say that the Rams were going to the playoffs this year.

I choose to still believe that.

 

[Mojo Ram]

I believe so, but if they don't, it lends credence to the theory that Snead is looking to screw the Browns for a pick to trade back to 2. I love a good conspiracy theory.

It also lends to keep a team like the Eagles or the Niners from dealing with the Browns right now for the #2 because no one besides the Rams knows which of the two QB's will be available there until the Browns are on the clock.

 

[12intheBox]

It also lends to keep a team like the Eagles or the Niners from dealing with the Browns right now for the #2 because no one besides the Rams knows which of the two QB's will be available there when the time comes.

I love the thought of dipping down to #2 and still getting our top guy but I think that's just wishful thinking.

The Rams pick at 1 - and all of the suspense is for the good of the league. Fisher is a team player like that.

 

[Juice]

The Redskins look better after their debacle because of a couple of things that worked in their favor. They had the foresight to draft Cousins, and their division pretty much sucks. We have serviceable QBs, so, in that respect, the two stories would be similar. Our division is tougher, and I mean a lot tougher. Making personnel mistakes, running out of draft picks, and drafting the wrong person will sting a little in our division.

 

[Mojo Ram]

The redskins made the playoffs and fielded a 10th ranked offense a 17th ranked defense last season.....
4 years after getting crippled by the RGIII trade.

Just the facts.

 

[Boston Ram]

Funny, because I feel like you are twisting my words.

Okay, bottom line is. Washington got hurt by the RG3 Trade. That is my opinion. They were a lame duck playoff team that really wasn't good enough to ever be there, but there were in the lousiest division in the league, so they got to step in there for a moment. Washington is extremely lucky they got themselves a decent qb in the fourth round. He's not franchise qb, but he's serviceable right now as they try to plug holes.

If this doesn't work out, the Rams will be back to starting all over again. Maybe that's the point of my whole bunch of posts. I HATE rebuilding. And if this doesn't work out, Fisher/Snead get fired, new guys come in, new philosophies, new personnel... you know, we've been there before.

BUT, I think what you are saying is what I need to do. In the context that this is a great move, things are going to be great and this was the right thing to do and we're getting a franchise quarterback for our punishing running game and our nasty defense.

I did say that the Rams were going to the playoffs this year.

I choose to still believe that.

Twisting your words? How?

I think we are kind of on the same page. I agree Washington got hurt by the trade but 2 down years is not exactly hitting rock bottom. Lucky with Cousins? Sure but they got him and he is a decent QB. Or maybe they just knew what they were doing? They took a chance at getting a franchise QB and it hurt them for 2 years. They werent going anywhere with Grossman, so IMO a needed roll of the dice.

Yes, I have already acknowledged if this does work out then we will be starting over again. I would ask you this though. Havent we been doing that for the last 15 years now? You are right we have been there and frankly we are still there, so lets address the missing piece if we can and they did. Im not convinced Goff or Wentz are franchise QB but if the FO does then go for it. At some point we have to go for it or keep our fingers crossed that Keenum or Mannion pan out. I have huge doubts either would develop into anything more than a quality back up.

Yes, its exactly what I am saying. At some point we have to take a gamble and I guess this is it. As I mentioned in my original message is I would of explored trading for Garoppolo of NE or Glennon in Tampa. They would of cost less assets and IMO both might actually be better.

I have been saying the Rams are a playoff team for the last 2 years lol. I still believe that.

I think we are kind of on the same page, trying to guess someones tone on a message board can be dangerous lol.

 

[Dagonet]

It's done man. Time to deal with it. Carrying bitterness is not good for the soul. Superbowl 36 the prime example.

.

In all respect kurtfaulk, I don't think it's bitterness, but football logic. I'm of the same ilk though.

• I think we gave up too much as we have other needs to be addressed.
• To me, neither of these QB's are worth giving up all those picks to move up.

I hope I'm wrong. Only time will tell.

 

[Dagonet]

The redskins made the playoffs and fielded a 10th ranked offense a 17th ranked defense last season.....
4 years after getting crippled by the RGIII trade.

Just the facts.

I wish we were in their division.

 

[Varg6]

This was something I brought up in another forum but Les Snead and Jeff Fisher, I'd like to think did this because they truly believe they'll be getting a franchise QB with whoever they decide to go with as opposed to this being a desperation attempt. If that's the case, I endorse it, and of course it'll be worth it to have "the" guy. Having said that, what bothers me about this is that of all years we'd do something drastic like this, I would've liked to think it'd be for a guy like an Andrew Luck/Manning-esque prospect. This particular year's QB draft class is the weakest we've seen in several years (I mean, correct me if I'm wrong). So, although I want this to work out positively for us (it's done now there's nothing we can do), for me I just wouldn't have wanted or expected it to be this year for us to do that for a QB.

 

[kurtfaulk]

In all respect kurtfaulk, I don't think it's bitterness, but football logic. I'm of the same ilk though.

• I think we gave up too much as we have other needs to be addressed.
• To me, neither of these QB's are worth giving up all those picks to move up.

I hope I'm wrong. Only time will tell.

I'm sorry but the biggest need by far is a qb. The Rams have said this by their actions. Also if there was a sure fire can't miss prospect the Rams would get nowhere near him. Imagine the price to trade up and get one of those.

The Rams don't need a hof qb. They just need one that can get the job done. And they must feel Wentz or goff is that qb.

.

 

[jrry32]

This was something I brought up in another forum but Les Snead and Jeff Fisher, I'd like to think did this because they truly believe they'll be getting a franchise QB with whoever they decide to go with as opposed to this being a desperation attempt. If that's the case, I endorse it, and of course it'll be worth it to have "the" guy. Having said that, what bothers me about this is that of all years we'd do something drastic like this, I would've liked to think it'd be for a guy like an Andrew Luck/Manning-esque prospect. This particular year's QB draft class is the weakest we've seen in several years (I mean, correct me if I'm wrong). So, although I want this to work out positively for us (it's done now there's nothing we can do), for me I just wouldn't have wanted or expected it to be this year for us to do that for a QB.

You're wrong.

And teams who have a shot at Manning/Luck-esque prospects don't trade them away. It's extremely rare for a team picking where the Rams were to even have a shot at a #1 overall QB.

Hell, the Rams turned down some huge offers for Bradford when they were picking #1 in 2010.

 

[Varg6]

You're wrong.

And teams who have a shot at Manning/Luck-esque prospects don't trade them away. It's extremely rare for a team picking where the Rams were to even have a shot at a #1 overall QB.

Hell, the Rams turned down some huge offers for Bradford when they were picking #1 in 2010.

That's a very good point. I'm not necessarily saying that these said prospects need to be on that high of a level, I'm more saying that because of how weak this draft class is for QBs, I would've thought/expected a move like this in a different year where the class is stronger (and maybe we would've had to give up more consequently, I don't know). To me, I personally didn't think there was a huge difference between Goff/Wentz and Lynch/Cook, but hey that's why I'm not a GM. They study this stuff and they clearly thought Goff/Wentz was indeed worth it. Only time will tell.

Regardless, I hope whoever we get is a perennial Pro Bowl QB and he brings out the best in what we've got.

 

[lordbannon]

This particular year's QB draft class is the weakest we've seen in several years (I mean, correct me if I'm wrong).

I disagree with this part. You don't have to look very far back to find what SEEMS at this point to be a markedly worse draft class. 2012 is the only year in the past 6 or 7 that looks to stand head and shoulders above. 2011 there was Newton and.....Last year Winston stood out as the premier prospect, and was essentially leader in the clubhouse for the entirety of 2014 before Mariota was propped up. 2010 there was Bradford and a bunch of hyped players who did nothing. 2013 was clearly not a good QB draft, and no matter how much press Geno Smith got, I think everyone knew that going in.

I think the only thing that this class is lacking in is the "savior" level QB who is hyped as a single can't miss prospect. There has been one of those just about every year (regardless of how they panned out). Leinart, Russell (super lol), Ryan, Stafford, Bradford, Newton, Luck/RGIII, (got nothing for 2013), Winston. Only a few drafts have produced more than even 1 serviceable QB over the duration.

I don't see Goff or Wentz having the type of flaws that lead to them completely busting. Becoming all time greats? Thats a different story, but one we will hopefully watch unfold over the next 15 years.

 

[Psycho_X]

I can't remember what I was watching but some media person brought up that next year's QB class was looking worse than this years. I have no idea if that's true and it's kinda hard to judge that now since a lot of draft picks get drafted based on the last year before they enter the draft as that tends to be their best. But still it's possible Snisher is looking ahead also. They saw no one that has impressed them more than Goff or Wentz and they can't wait two more years to try and get a QB. Really they had their backs against the wall with this. They failed to get one in the past and they were forced to get what they could now. Lets just hope whichever one they pick is at least above average.

 

[OldSchool]

I can't remember what I was watching but some media person brought up that next year's QB class was looking worse than this years. I have no idea if that's true and it's kinda hard to judge that now since a lot of draft picks get drafted based on the last year before they enter the draft as that tends to be their best. But still it's possible Snisher is looking ahead also. They saw no one that has impressed them more than Goff or Wentz and they can't wait two more years to try and get a QB. Really they had their backs against the wall with this. They failed to get one in the past and they were forced to get what they could now. Lets just hope whichever one they pick is at least above average.

Next years class greatly depends on three underclassmen declaring. The seniors look really bad.

 

[jrry32]

That's a very good point. I'm not necessarily saying that these said prospects need to be on that high of a level, I'm more saying that because of how weak this draft class is for QBs, I would've thought/expected a move like this in a different year where the class is stronger (and maybe we would've had to give up more consequently, I don't know). To me, I personally didn't think there was a huge difference between Goff/Wentz and Lynch/Cook, but hey that's why I'm not a GM. They study this stuff and they clearly thought Goff/Wentz was indeed worth it. Only time will tell.

Regardless, I hope whoever we get is a perennial Pro Bowl QB and he brings out the best in what we've got.

This QB class isn't weak, though. It's a strong class. It's deep at the top and Goff is a legitimate #1 overall level QB. Wentz is a legitimate top 5-10 pick. We were very fortunate that this was the year a #1 overall team was willing to trade down to the mid-first.

 

[lordbannon]

Next years class greatly depends on three underclassmen declaring. The seniors look really bad.

I hate banking on "next year's class". It is dependent on so many factors - regression, injuries, underclassmen, etc. And I always like to think we won't be in a position to get a great QB "next year"

 

[OldSchool]

Ex

I hate banking on "next year's class". It is dependent on so many factors - regression, injuries, underclassmen, etc. And I always like to think we won't be in a position to get a great QB "next year"

actly, I'm very much against kicking the can down the road.