Rams may again find trading partner for No. 2 pick in draft/Stellino

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RamBill

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Rams may again find trading partner for No. 2 pick in draft
By Vito Stellino

http://jacksonville.com/sports/foot...again-find-trading-partner-no-2#ixzz2yk2lSI6L

In the new movie “Draft Day,’’ Cleveland general manager played by Kevin Costner gives up three first-round picks for the first overall selection to select a quarterback.
That was art imitating life because in 2012, the Washington Redskins gave the St. Louis Rams three first-round picks and a second-rounder to move up to the second spot to take quarterback Robert Griffin III.

The jury is still out on that move. Griffin is overcoming a torn knee ligament, the Redskins collapsed to 3-13 last year and coach Mike Shanahan was fired.
The Rams know they won’t get three ones for the No. 2 pick this year because there isn’t supposed to be a franchise quarterback available. But they again seem willing to trade down because it’s a deep draft.
“Because this draft is really good, it’s a good chance for us to take some shots with picks to improve the team,’’ general manager Les Snead told SI.com.
The question is who the Rams’ trading partner will be.
Atlanta with the sixth spot was the only team to publicly show interest in moving up.
That was until the Detroit Free Press reported that the Lions in the 10th spot may want to move up to pick wide receiver Sammy Watkins.
The Lions, looking for a complement to Calvin Johnson, have been lavish in their praise of Watkins and don’t seem concerned about his 2012 pot arrest that caused him to be suspended for the first two games by Clemson that year.
New coach Jim Caldwell called Watkins “a quality person’’ and said, “There’s not much to dislike about this young man.’’
If the Lions don’t make a deal with the Rams and Watkins is still on the board when the Jaguars pick at No. 3, the two teams could pull off a trade.
The Jaguars have 11 picks and general manager Dave Caldwell has indicated he wants to accumulate more.
“We’ve had some conversations with multiple teams,’’ Snead said. “They’re more flirtatious calls than anything. We have Nos. 2 and 13, but Houston has No. 1. Nobody can really seriously chat with us until they are happy with at least two players.’’
 

CGI_Ram

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If we were to trade down to #10 with Detroit.

What would it take? Two 2nd rounders (2014/2015), plus 2014 third?

This might have been posted already, the draft articles are a blur to me:

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on...k-draft-lions-land-sammy-watkins-in-big-trade

More NFL offseason: Mock Drafts | Prospect Rankings | Pro days | Top free agents

The rumor du jour these days involves the Lions and their interest in Clemson wide receiver Sammy Watkins. It's hard to blame them. Watkins is the total package at wideout. Pairing him with Calvin Johnson and Golden Taint is flat-out terrifying.

One problem for Detroit. He won't make it to No. 10. So Martin Mayhew will have to make a substantial move up the draft board if he wants to land Watkins. He may need to make a move if he wants either Watkins or Texas A&M's Mike Evans; seeing Evans off the board before 10 would hardly be surprising.

In the mock below, I'm gonna let Detroit pull the move off in a deal with the Rams. We know St. Louis is always willing to move around, so it's plausible. And getting to No. 2 is the only way to guarantee you get Watkins (Jacksonville, Cleveland and Oakland could all take him). The price for this move won't -- or shouldn't -- be has prohibitive as the Redskins leap up to grab Robert Griffin III in 2012.

The second overall pick is worth 2,600 points on the traditional trade value chart, while 10th overall is worth 1,300. It's nearly impossible to make things work based on those old-school values — the Lions' top three picks don't equate to the value of No. 2, although I suspect Les Snead would jump all over that deal if it was offered — so instead let's use Chase Stuart's updated Draft Pick Value Calculator to figure this out.

I gave Detroit No. 2 overall and gave St. Louis No. 10 and No. 45 overall and the result is surprisingly even:

nZ5O8Da.png


There's actually an interesting precedent for this too. In the 2012 NFL Draft, the Rams moved down to No. 6 after the RG3 trade and then moved down again to No. 14 when the Cowboys wanted to make a deal, move up and grab Morris Claiborne. For the trouble of moving down eight spots, the Rams picked up the No. 45 overall pick.

Sounds familiar.

I don't think the Rams do this deal if Clowney falls to No. 2 because they can then a) attempt to auction the pick off or b) draft the best player in the pool.

My preference would be St. Louis nabbing Watkins; I think he's the second-best player in the draft and an absolute game-changer at wide receiver.

But picking up the No. 45 overall pick and giving yourself two 1's and two 2's is worth the risk of dropping back eight spots. That's four impact players in an extremely deep draft.

It's a win-win scenario and maybe more realistic than we think.

1. Houston Texans -- Jadeveon Clowney, DE, South Carolina -- None of the above affects the Texans' plans for the top spot and Clowney is still the guy. He's a freakshow talent and the best player in this draft. Houston can't — and won't — look past that.

2. Detroit Lions (VIA MOCK TRADE WITH St. Louis Rams, via Washington Redskins) -- Sammy Watkins, WR, Clemson — Personally I don't agree with Detroit's fake strategy here. I'd rather stand pat at 10 in a deep draft and grab a cornerback. There are wideouts to be had later. But I also think Watkins is the second-best player in the entire draft so I can't entirely blame the Lions brass for being bold.

3. Jacksonville Jaguars -- Khalil Mack, OLB, Buffalo — He's got power and speed as a pass rusher and will produce the sort of impact out of the box that will allow Jaguars fans to forget the team didn't draft a quarterback here during 2014.

4. Cleveland Browns -- Blake Bortles, QB, UCF — With Watkins off the board and the Texans letting Bortles off the top spot, Cleveland strikes early to solve their quarterback problem. Having Brian Hoyer as a potential bridge if Bortles isn't ready to go immediately is a big plus.

5. Oakland Raiders -- Johnny Manziel, QB, Texas A&M — Couldn't you see Mark Davis falling in love with Manziel the way his father would have and gently nudging Reggie McKenzie into taking him here? Manziel would inject livelihood into this franchise.

6. Atlanta Falcons -- Greg Robinson, OT, Auburn — A giddy Thomas Dimitroff happily adds Robinson, a dominant road grader in the run, who he can plug in on the right side of his line to pave the way for Steven Jackson and protect Matt Ryan.

7. Tampa Bay Buccaneers -- Mike Evans, WR, Texas A&M — Combining Evans andVincent Jackson (the Bucs have a hole with the recently traded Mike Williams in Buffalo) will give Josh McCown a pair of targets that will look quite similar to Brandon Marshall andAlshon Jeffery. That worked out OK.

8. Minnesota Vikings -- Teddy Bridgewater, QB, Louisville — A lot of people might have Derek Carr going here. Perhaps it happens. Perhaps the Vikings really like Carr. But as of right now I can't talk myself into plugging him above Bridgewater. It already makes little sense that Teddy fell to eight.

9. Buffalo Bills -- Eric Ebron, TE, UNC — Another draft, another weapon for EJ Manuel. Doug Marrone's essentially all in on his first-round pick from last year, so why not get him weapons?

10. St. Louis Rams (MOCK TRADE WITH Detroit Lions) -- Jake Matthews, OT, Texas A&M — Everything's coming up Snead! Not only did the Rams pick up an extra second-round pick, but they managed to get a player they covet. Jeff Fisher coached Matthews HOF dad and he gets to make his first-ever, first-round offensive lineman pick. No better time than the present.

11. Tennessee Titans — Anthony Barr, OLB, UCLA — Plugging this in from now until it's pointed out that I was wrong. Barr has flop potential for sure but he's a very nice fit for Ray Horton's new 3-4 scheme and devastates quarterbacks, something every defense wants.

12. New York Giants -- Aaron Donald, DT, Pittsburgh — The Giants need to rebuild the interior of their defensive line. Donald is undersized but he's a highly productive player out of college and will help replace Linval Joseph while boosting the Giants' pass rush from the interior.

13. St. Louis Rams -- Hasean Clinton Dix, S, Alabama — Maybe the Rams are just fine with Tavon Austin, Stedman Bailey, Brian Quick, Austin Pettis and Kenny Britt. They can't be fine with the safety combo of TJ McDonald and Rodney McLeod though. Dix is a day one starter who will impact an already impressive secondary.

14. Chicago Bears -- Ra'shede Hageman, DT, Minnesota — The Bears already addedWillie Young and Lamarr Houston as end pass rushers. Now they can use the draft to bulk up the center of their defensive line. Acquiring the 6'6, 310 Hageman, a massive presence in the middle, does just that.

15. Pittsburgh Steelers -- Justin Gilbert, CB, Oklahoma State — Kevin Colbert probably didn't think he'd get his pick of all the cornerbacks in this draft. But here we are and Pittsburgh now has the top corner on their roster.

16. Dallas Cowboys -- Louis Nix III, DT, Notre Dame — If you were creating a flowchart for the Cowboys draft it would basically ask “Is he a defensive tackle?” and if you answer “Yes” then “Draft for Cowboys.” Or something. Nix might not be their top choice, but he's a big body that can plug in the middle of Rob Marinelli's line and hopefully make up for massive personnel departures on the line. (Watch: Louis Nix is on an insane diet)

17. Baltimore Ravens -- Taylor Lewan, OT, Michigan — Surprising fall here for Lewan but Ozzie Newsome won't mind. They need some physicality on the line and Lewan can provide that. He's slot into the right tackle spot right out of the gates.

18. New York Jets -- Darqueze Dennard, CB, Michigan State — Giving Rex Ryan a pair of young cornerbacks to work with could equate to good things. And Dennard's speciality is press man, which is exactly what Rex likes out of his cornerbacks.

19. Miami Dolphins -- Zack Martin, OT, Notre Dame — Miami's got plenty of needs but offensive line remains an important part of the equation, especially if the Dolphins expectRyan Tannehill to progress. Or, you know, survive. Martin's got the flexibility that Miami needs on this offensive line.

20. Arizona Cardinals -- Kony Ealy, DE, Missouri — A phenomenal athlete who hasn't gotten a ton of press, Ealy's a future start in the making and can help replace John Abraham in Arizona.

21. Green Bay Packers -- Jimmie Ward, S, NIU — For as dangerous as the Packers are, they've got plenty of needs. (Not that Ted Thompson drafts for need; there are plenty of high-end talents.) One of those is shoring up the back end of the secondary. Ward's got the necessary skills to be a versatile piece in the Green Bay defensive backfield.

22. Philadelphia Eagles -- Odell Beckham, WR, LSU — The Eagles need help in the secondary too but with their decision to move away from DeSean Jackson, wideout is a more pressing issue. And Beckham falling into their laps here will make Chip Kelly feel just fine about his decision on D-Jax. Beckham's a complete wideout and can do damage from all over the place. He's an impressive kick returner with outstanding field vision and plenty of burst.

23. Kansas City Chiefs -- Brandin Cooks, WR, OSU — The Chiefs could be a candidate to trade up and grab a wideout, especially if they have their sights set on Beckham (although Marqise Lee might fit the bill here). Instead they sit back and land Cooks, the uber-speedy wide receiver who can do damage from the slot and be an explosive threat and can be Andy Reid's new DeSean Jackson.

24. Cincinnati Bengals -- Dee Ford, DE, Auburn — The Bengals seem like a good bet to go cornerback or defensive end here. There's a slew of cornerbacks on the board at this point but Ford could be a good value here and could quickly replace the departed Michael Johnson on the other side of Carlos Dunlap.

25. San Diego Chargers -- Jason Verrett, CB, TCU — Verrett is a physical corner with excellent closing speed and a willing and able tackler who can also blitz from the corner spot effectively. The Chargers need, well, cornerbacks. They should be thrilled landing Verrett here.

26. Cleveland Browns (from Indianapolis Colts) -- Bradley Roby, CB, Ohio State —This might no be high enough for Roby when all is said and done. He's crazy talented but has some red flags to overcome. For the Browns, they got their quarterback and now have a guy to pair across from Joe Haden. It doesn't hurt that he's a local product either. Goodwill for the fans and whatnot.

27. New Orleans Saints -- Kyle Fuller, CB, Virginia Tech — He didn't have to face off against a bunch of world-beating quarterbacks in the ACC, but Fuller showed plenty of talent during his run with Frank Beamer, including an innate sense of ball location, impressive technique breaking up passes in difficult locations and a willingness to tackle. He helps round out a completely reworked Saints secondary with Jairus Byrd, Kenny Vaccaro and Keenan Lewis. The Champ Bailey signing doesn't prevent New Orleans from drafting someone else.

28. Carolina Panthers -- Cyrus Kouandjio, OT, Alabama — Sticking with this pick for now. Yes the Panthers need a wide receiver or a tight end. But they need an offensive lineman more than anything. Dave Gettleman stole Star Lotulelei last year when he fell because of unnecessary health concerns. Why not the same thing with Kouandjio?

29. New England Patriots -- Jace Amaro, TE, Texas Tech — Grabbing a tight end in the first round of the draft doesn't seem very Belichickian in that it lacks value. But Amaro is a dynamic pass catcher and willing enough to block. They simply have to get more weapons around Tom Brady.

30. San Francisco 49ers -- Marqise Lee, WR, USC — With cornerback-needy teams just above them, it wouldn't shock if San Francisco made a jump up to grab one of the top-tier guys in this draft. But they'll live with Lee dropping all the way to 30 and then snagging the USC wide receiver to give Colin Kaepernick another weapon.

31. Denver Broncos — Xavier Su'a-Filo, OG, UCLA — Plenty of other concerns for the Broncos, including a wideout and a cornerback, but they learned first hand during theSuper Bowl how important protecting Peyton Manning up the middle truly is. Filo will replace the departed Zane Beadles.

32. Seattle Seahawks -- Ryan Shazier, OLB, Ohio State — Just because the Seahawks have tons of pass rushers doesn't mean they have enough. Adding another versatile, impact linebacker to an already impressive corps means the rich get richer in this mock draft.
 

Ramrocket

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There is no way i do this trade if Im only getting a second rd pick out of it. I make the pick at 2 in that scenario.
 

CGI_Ram

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There is no way i do this trade if Im only getting a second rd pick out of it. I make the pick at 2 in that scenario.

Me either.

1st, 2nd, and 3rd... maybe.

1st, 2nd 2014, something else 2014, and 2nd 2015, deal
 
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If we were to trade down to #10 with Detroit.

What would it take? Two 2nd rounders (2014/2015), plus 2014 third?

Minimum for me to consider it:

2014 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 2015 1st

And even then it depends how much I love Watkins/Robinson/Matthews.
 

max

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It's the silly season. That's when guys who have no idea what they're talking about talk the most.
 

Memphis Ram

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Sorry guys, but I don't believe that the Lions GM Martin Mayhew is that stupid. Or that Les Snead would move down to #10 for peanuts. Or at all minus a double trade down.

If the Lions do trade up in an attempt to get Watkins, it won't be all the way up to #2. It would more likely to be a situation where Watkins were still available within 3 to perhaps even 5 spots from their original choice. And that's if they are really so enamored with him in the first place.
 
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LesBaker

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There is no way i do this trade if Im only getting a second rd pick out of it. I make the pick at 2 in that scenario.

I can't see Snead making that deal, it's not that good and the Lions don't seem to be a strong trade partner anyway.

I think it's going to be MN or TB that make the move.
 

CGI_Ram

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Sorry guys, but I don't believe that the Lions GM Martin Mayhew is that stupid. Or that Les Snead would move down to #10 for peanuts. Or at all minus a double trade down.

If the Lions do trade up in an attempt to get Watkins, it won't be all the way up to #2. It would more likely to be a situation where Watkins were still available within 3 to perhaps even 5 spots from their original choice. And that's if they are really so enamored with him in the first place.

(n)

So...

The article suggests to ensure they get Watkins they'd need to be in front of Jax. That would be #2.

You are saying it's stupid to value Watkins at 2?

And... If they want Watkins, they're better off waiting to see if he makes it 3-5 spots from 10?

Do they want Watkins or not?

Your scenario suggests they don't, which kinda goes against the purpose of the writers story.
 

kurtfaulk

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Sorry guys, but I don't believe that the Lions GM Martin Mayhew is that stupid. Or that Les Snead would move down to #10 for peanuts. Or at all minus a double trade down.

If the Lions do trade up in an attempt to get Watkins, it won't be all the way up to #2. It would more likely to be a situation where Watkins were still available within 3 to perhaps even 5 spots from their original choice. And that's if they are really so enamored with him in the first place.

i agree with everything you've said but the raiders traded their #3 pick last season with the dolphins at #12 and all they got was a 3rd rounder. they are the raiders so that explains how awful that trade was but still, that trade was last season so maybe gms think the rams might not ask for much more than that this season. wishful thinking on their part i would assume.

.
 

Simba

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I think our best draft-partner would be ATL.They could give back us a good and "sure" first round pick (with the 6th, we could chose Robinson or Matthews, with the 10th I'am not sure we would able to find the first one or the other) and a good second round (the 5th. tot.37th.).I don't think we can ask more, but the hopes never die ...
However with our first 4 picks (top ten), we could fill our holes and to bet /risk with the other calls.
 

Thordaddy

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It's the silly season. That's when guys who have no idea what they're talking about talk the most.


And this line proves it: "The jury is still out on that move."

Must be the "OJ Jury" cuz anyone else knows we got the best of it
 

RaminExile

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There is no way i do this trade if Im only getting a second rd pick out of it. I make the pick at 2 in that scenario.

Yeah. I need a first rounder or Im not biting. At 2 we have our choice of Clowney, Mack, Watkins, Matthews or Robinson!

On the other hand - this draft is really deep. I don't remember offhand seeing so many good prospects even at the end of the first round. I mean look at this mocks 25-32 - Verrett, Roby, Fuller, Amaro, Khoujando, Lee, Sua Filo and Shazier!
 

Memphis Ram

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i agree with everything you've said but the raiders traded their #3 pick last season with the dolphins at #12 and all they got was a 3rd rounder. they are the raiders so that explains how awful that trade was but still, that trade was last season so maybe gms think the rams might not ask for much more than that this season. wishful thinking on their part i would assume.

Can't confuse the player value of different draft classes. It's the same reason the Rams won't be able to pull off an RGIII type trade in this draft class.

The Raiders desperately tried to re-coup a 2nd rounder they lost (Carson Palmer trade) and last year's draft class didn't have nearly the value at the top of it. In fact, from what I've read most personnel people seem to believe that the usual top 3 names at OT in this draft class are better than the guys who went #1,#2, and #4 last year.
 
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Memphis Ram

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(n)

So...

The article suggests to ensure they get Watkins they'd need to be in front of Jax. That would be #2.

You are saying it's stupid to value Watkins at 2?

And... If they want Watkins, they're better off waiting to see if he makes it 3-5 spots from 10?

Do they want Watkins or not?

Your scenario suggests they don't, which kinda goes against the purpose of the writers story.


Same article says that it's the "the rumor du jour these days."

Either way, wanting a player and giving up what it would take to get that player are two different things altogether.

On a side note, yes, I do believe that it's stupid to value Watkins at #2 in this draft class. And I don't believe the organization gave Golden Taint a 5 year $31 million contract ($13.25 million guaranteed) and plan to follow that up by bundling the picks needed to move up to #2 to select Sammy Watkins. Especially not with the other holes on that team and potential talent available to fill them at their draft slots.
 

iced

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Sorry guys, but I don't believe that the Lions GM Martin Mayhew is that stupid. Or that Les Snead would move down to #10 for peanuts. Or at all minus a double trade down.

If the Lions do trade up in an attempt to get Watkins, it won't be all the way up to #2. It would more likely to be a situation where Watkins were still available within 3 to perhaps even 5 spots from their original choice. And that's if they are really so enamored with him in the first place.
unless they believe the Jags really want Watkins..

other than that,agreed.
 

CGI_Ram

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I don't believe the organization gave Golden Taint a 5 year $31 million contract ($13.25 million guaranteed) and plan to follow that up by bundling the picks needed to move up to #2 to select Sammy Watkins. Especially not with the other holes on that team and potential talent available to fill them at their draft slots.

This makes total sense.