Raiders, C Stefen Wisniewski disagree on his value

[jrry32]

National Football League[edit]
The new Collective Bargaining Agreement (CBA) formulated in 2011 had an initial salary cap of $120 million. While the previous CBA had a salary floor, the new CBA did not have one until 2013. Starting with that season, each team is required to spend a minimum of 88.8% of the cap in cash on player compensation,[9] and 90% in future years. However, the floor is based on total cash spent over each of two four-year periods, the first running from 2013–2016 and the second from 2017–2020. A team can be under the floor in one or more seasons in a cycle without violating the CBA, as long as its total spending during the four-year period reaches the required percentage of the cap.[9]

The NFL's cap is a hard cap that the teams have to stay under at all times, and the salary floor is also a hard floor; penalties for violating or circumventing the cap and floor regulations include fines of up to $5 million for each violation, cancellation of contracts and/or loss of draft picks

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salary_cap

Section 9. Minimum Team Cash Spending:
(a) For each of the following four-League Year periods, 2013–2016 and
2017–2020, there shall be a guaranteed Minimum Team Cash Spending of 89% of the
Salary Caps for such periods (e.g., if the Salary Caps for the 2013–16 and 2017–2020 are
$100, 120, 130, and 150 million, respectively, each Club shall have a Minimum Team
Cash Spending for that period of $445 million (89% of $500 million))
(b) Any shortfall in the Minimum Team Cash Spending at the end of a
League Year in which it is applicable (i.e., the 2016 and 2020 League Years) shall be paid,
on or before the next September 15, by the Team having such shortfall, directly to the
players who were on such a Team’s roster at any time during the applicable seasons,
pursuant to the reasonable allocation instructions of the NFLPA.

That's from the CBA. I take that to mean if the team doesn't reach the floor in 2015, they have to make up the difference which is paid to the players on the roster that year.

 

[Fatbot]

The Raiders with all the cap room in the league and they decide to get cheap at a tough position to fill.

Yeah pretty weird situation, but there's also rumored to be bad blood there. Wisniewski's uncle (Steve) was coaching there when Stefan was drafted but then "resigned for personal reasons" during one of the several head coaching regime changes. So it could be Wisniewski, like his uncle, simply does not want to be a Raider, the team knows he's not coming back, and the offer is just a lowball for P.R.'s sake. Or they are just trusting his Pro Football Focus grade that says he sucks now.

 

[Thordaddy]

Section 9. Minimum Team Cash Spending:
(a) For each of the following four-League Year periods, 2013–2016 and
2017–2020, there shall be a guaranteed Minimum Team Cash Spending of 89% of the
Salary Caps for such periods (e.g., if the Salary Caps for the 2013–16 and 2017–2020 are
$100, 120, 130, and 150 million, respectively, each Club shall have a Minimum Team
Cash Spending for that period of $445 million (89% of $500 million))
(b) Any shortfall in the Minimum Team Cash Spending at the end of a
League Year in which it is applicable (i.e., the 2016 and 2020 League Years) shall be paid,
on or before the next September 15, by the Team having such shortfall, directly to the
players who were on such a Team’s roster at any time during the applicable seasons,
pursuant to the reasonable allocation instructions of the NFLPA.

That's from the CBA. I take that to mean if the team doesn't reach the floor in 2015, they have to make up the difference which is paid to the players on the roster that year.

And IF they don't

 

[jrry32]

And IF they don't

Matt Millen is appointed as their new GM.

 

[Thordaddy]

Matt Millen is appointed as their new GM.

Yeah the point is, no violation no problem but if there is they don't seize your account rather levie a fine / punishment

 

[jrry32]

Yeah the point is, no violation no problem but if there is they don't seize your account rather levie a fine / punishment

Being serious, if the owner refuses to pay, the NFL pays it out(it's a provision in Section 9)...and then I'm sure the Owner faces some pretty major problems...like potentially losing his team.

 

[Mackeyser]

I like Wisniewski.

At the same time, I ALSO like what I saw on tape with Barrett Jones and Turner. If Jones is finally squared away, I think he's ready to go. In college, he had his best success against bigger NT types due to technique (and he wasn't near as strong as he is now) and he's probably one of the smartest players on the roster.

I dunno if he's big enough or strong enough for LG, but maybe. If they went Wisniewski at C and Jones/Turner at LG, that may just work. Then have the other back up Saffold as well.

Frankly, I think our better OL were on the bench this year. No idea why that was, but no one's going to tell me that Chris Long couldn't have played C better than Wells... that's how poorly Wells played (and how good of an athlete Long is)

 

[Blue and Gold]

I like Wisniewski.

At the same time, I ALSO like what I saw on tape with Barrett Jones and Turner. If Jones is finally squared away, I think he's ready to go. In college, he had his best success against bigger NT types due to technique (and he wasn't near as strong as he is now) and he's probably one of the smartest players on the roster.

I dunno if he's big enough or strong enough for LG, but maybe. If they went Wisniewski at C and Jones/Turner at LG, that may just work. Then have the other back up Saffold as well.

Frankly, I think our better OL were on the bench this year. No idea why that was, but no one's going to tell me that Chris Long couldn't have played C better than Wells... that's how poorly Wells played (and how good of an athlete Long is)

Turner? Rob Turner? He's out of football, was with Titans in 2013, didn't play in 2014 . . .you mean him?

 

[Mackeyser]

Dangit. I meant Tim Barnes. I've been saying Turner all along and I've meant Tim Barnes. My Apologies and good catch.

 

[Blue and Gold]

Dangit. I meant Tim Barnes. I've been saying Turner all along and I've meant Tim Barnes. My Apologies and good catch.

got it . . .just thought I was in a time machine for a moment.

 

[FrankenRam]

...
The coaching situation being up in the air is another issue, as you mentioned. .....

Do people really believe the coaching situation is up in the air? I'm VERY skeptical that's the case. As far as the fan base is concerned, I'm sure it's true. I just have my doubts it's the case in Kroenke's eye. I'm guessing Fisher is in no trouble at all unless the Rams win < 6(?), maybe even less than 4 game next yr. I'd be surprised if Kroenke would be changing coaches AND moving the team after next season.

And unless I'm mistaken, I don't think any of Stan's sports teams have had any great tradition of winning much of anything, and no coaching carousels there...to my knowledge anyway...admittedly I know precious little about his soccer team. I'm just not all that convinced SK is overly caring about winning as long as the team is profitable.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Do people really believe the coaching situation is up in the air? I'm VERY skeptical that's the case. As far as the fan base is concerned, I'm sure it's true. I just have my doubts it's the case in Kroenke's eye. I'm guessing Fisher is in no trouble at all unless the Rams win < 6(?), maybe even less than 4 game next yr. I'd be surprised if Kroenke would be changing coaches AND moving the team after next season.

And unless I'm mistaken, I don't think any of Stan's sports teams have had any great tradition of winning much of anything, and no coaching carousels there...to my knowledge anyway...admittedly I know precious little about his soccer team. I'm just not all that convinced SK is overly caring about winning as long as the team is profitable.

I don't think the coaching situation is up in he air at all. Fisher took possibly he worst roster in the last 30 years and had a long rebuild. Kroenke knows that and wants stability. Fishers roster is finally shaping up and nearing a good 3-5 year run. Stan won't hold Bradford's injury against Fisher. Fishr is safe by a country mile.

 

[BonifayRam]

I like Wisniewski.

At the same time, I ALSO like what I saw on tape with Barrett Jones and Turner. If Jones is finally squared away, I think he's ready to go. In college, he had his best success against bigger NT types due to technique (and he wasn't near as strong as he is now) and he's probably one of the smartest players on the roster.

I dunno if he's big enough or strong enough for LG, but maybe. If they went Wisniewski at C and Jones/Turner at LG, that may just work. Then have the other back up Saffold as well.

Frankly, I think our better OL were on the bench this year. No idea why that was, but no one's going to tell me that Chris Long couldn't have played C better than Wells... that's how poorly Wells played (and how good of an athlete Long is)

I sure had issues with the way Boudreau stayed with center Wells as he sat on Tim Barnes & Barrett Jones. I guess I should bring up that early on Tim Barnes hurt his shoulder working on ST's. Causing him to miss 2 games during this time period when Barnes was injured & unable to play Wells suffered that Elbow dislocation. Thus thats why we saw Barrett Jones for the first time line up in a regular season game. Barrett Jones looked very comfortable @ center to me in the first string lineup.

Wisniewski is a pure center so are centers Tim Barnes & Demetrius Rhaney. Barrett Jones & also (the easy resigning of UFA) Mike Person are much different. The signing of a Wisniewski would cause the Rams to be forced to use what depth they have in positions that are not necessarily their best spots. Not a positive!

So in truth the Rams reserve depth @ center is much better than @ OG or OT by a far margin. So in comparison the need is much more critical @ OG & OT than signing a big $$$ center. I am solid in Barrett's corner as far as what he can do if healthy. Barrett has most of his college starts @ OG than @ OC or OT. I do think he could be a more balanced ORT than Barksdale. Not sure Barrett would fair as well @ ORG or OLG where you will want a much bigger push. Barrett could be tried @ OLG teamed with the large big Greg Robinson, is better than @ ORG IMO. Boudreau uses the OLG often to provide assistance to the center. I think thats one of the reasons we saw Saffold playing mostly @ OLG.

Bottom Line if there was a Ram OL position that is in better shape than all the rest of the Ram OL positions its at CENTER.

 

[Mackeyser]

I sure had issues with the way Boudreau stayed with center Wells as he sat on Tim Barnes & Barrett Jones. I guess I should bring up that early on Tim Barnes hurt his shoulder working on ST's. Causing him to miss 2 games during this time period when Barnes was injured & unable to play Wells suffered that Elbow dislocation. Thus thats why we saw Barrett Jones for the first time line up in a regular season game. Barrett Jones looked very comfortable @ center to me in the first string lineup.

Wisniewski is a pure center so are centers Tim Barnes & Demetrius Rhaney. Barrett Jones & also (the easy resigning of UFA) Mike Person are much different. The signing of a Wisniewski would cause the Rams to be forced to use what depth they have in positions that are not necessarily their best spots. Not a positive!

So in truth the Rams reserve depth @ center is much better than @ OG or OT by a far margin. So in comparison the need is much more critical @ OG & OT than signing a big $$$ center. I am solid in Barrett's corner as far as what he can do if healthy. Barrett has most of his college starts @ OG than @ OC or OT. I do think he could be a more balanced ORT than Barksdale. Not sure Barrett would fair as well @ ORG or OLG where you will want a much bigger push. Barrett could be tried @ OLG teamed with the large big Greg Robinson, is better than @ ORG IMO. Boudreau uses the OLG often to provide assistance to the center. I think thats one of the reasons we saw Saffold playing mostly @ OLG.

Bottom Line if there was a Ram OL position that is in better shape than all the rest of the Ram OL positions its at CENTER.

I totally agree.

Been saying all along that Jones should be the guy. If the Rams are going to do anything big, be it in the draft or FA or BOTH, I think they should look at LG.

Now... Fisher has already crapped all over this draft with the Barron trade. He inferred as much and others took it to be more than that. Do they go hard for a FA LG, sign as many of our own FAs as we can (like Langford who would be a massive mistake to let go), and just go for the BPAs including QB?

I dunno, but I think pursuing a Center when we have potentially 3 good ones is a mistake when we really need a stud LG and we don't have any of those.... Barnes and Rhaney are Centers and Jones looked better to me at Center than OG.

 

[BonifayRam]

I totally agree.

Been saying all along that Jones should be the guy. If the Rams are going to do anything big, be it in the draft or FA or BOTH, I think they should look at LG.

Now... Fisher has already crapped all over this draft with the Barron trade. He inferred as much and others took it to be more than that. Do they go hard for a FA LG, sign as many of our own FAs as we can (like Langford who would be a massive mistake to let go), and just go for the BPAs including QB?

I dunno, but I think pursuing a Center when we have potentially 3 good ones is a mistake when we really need a stud LG and we don't have any of those.... Barnes and Rhaney are Centers and Jones looked better to me at Center than OG.

There are some very good OLG's in this draft. I happen to like John Miller & AJ Cann a lot but they are strickly OG's. I think that Cann can be had in the 2nd rd & Miller in the 3rd now your set if Saffold is forced to take up the ORT post.

 

[Mackeyser]

All the more reason to trade down in the 1st for another 2nd or 3rd depending on how far down we trade.

Of course, depends on who slides down. I suppose a few players could convince me to stay put. Kevin White among them. The way that young man hand catches reminds me of a Michael Irvin. I would NOT do stay put for Amari Cooper as he lets way too many balls get into his body and only hand catches when he has to. At the NFL level, that gives DBs too many opportunities to make a play on the ball and we've seen lots of super productive college WRs struggle in the Pros because they were body/basket catchers versus hand catchers. Kevin White allows us to move on from Givens AND we know that rookie WRs don't usually set the world on fire, so we don't have to rely on him.

Presuming he fell to #10, which would be highly, highly unlikely.

 

[rhinobean]

I like Wisniewski.

At the same time, I ALSO like what I saw on tape with Barrett Jones and Turner. If Jones is finally squared away, I think he's ready to go. In college, he had his best success against bigger NT types due to technique (and he wasn't near as strong as he is now) and he's probably one of the smartest players on the roster.

I dunno if he's big enough or strong enough for LG, but maybe. If they went Wisniewski at C and Jones/Turner at LG, that may just work. Then have the other back up Saffold as well.

Frankly, I think our better OL were on the bench this year. No idea why that was, but no one's going to tell me that Chris Long couldn't have played C better than Wells... that's how poorly Wells played (and how good of an athlete Long is)

My theory is that Fish was getting his money's worth, damn the results! Seems dumb but maybe!?

 

[Mackeyser]

My theory is that Fish was getting his money's worth, damn the results! Seems dumb but maybe!?

That's fine with brown bananas, but c'mon... we need to win some football games!

 

[rhinobean]

That's fine with brown bananas, but c'mon... we need to win some football games!

Then why in blue blazes do they not play the back ups instead? Wells and Joseph sucked!

 

[Dodgersrf]

I sure had issues with the way Boudreau stayed with center Wells as he sat on Tim Barnes & Barrett Jones. I guess I should bring up that early on Tim Barnes hurt his shoulder working on ST's. Causing him to miss 2 games during this time period when Barnes was injured & unable to play Wells suffered that Elbow dislocation. Thus thats why we saw Barrett Jones for the first time line up in a regular season game. Barrett Jones looked very comfortable @ center to me in the first string lineup.

Wisniewski is a pure center so are centers Tim Barnes & Demetrius Rhaney. Barrett Jones & also (the easy resigning of UFA) Mike Person are much different. The signing of a Wisniewski would cause the Rams to be forced to use what depth they have in positions that are not necessarily their best spots. Not a positive!

So in truth the Rams reserve depth @ center is much better than @ OG or OT by a far margin. So in comparison the need is much more critical @ OG & OT than signing a big $$$ center. I am solid in Barrett's corner as far as what he can do if healthy. Barrett has most of his college starts @ OG than @ OC or OT. I do think he could be a more balanced ORT than Barksdale. Not sure Barrett would fair as well @ ORG or OLG where you will want a much bigger push. Barrett could be tried @ OLG teamed with the large big Greg Robinson, is better than @ ORG IMO. Boudreau uses the OLG often to provide assistance to the center. I think thats one of the reasons we saw Saffold playing mostly @ OLG.

Bottom Line if there was a Ram OL position that is in better shape than all the rest of the Ram OL positions its at CENTER.

I think we're safer at T.
I'm not sold on our young centers. It concerns me that they couldn't crack a line up to beat out Wells playing with one good arm. Not to say one of them won't be ready next year. It just really concerns me. I don't want to go into another season hoping one of them can stay healthy and play solid football.
Our line must be priority #1. (Assuming we have a healthy QB). Our late draft picks on the oline haven't produced in years. Our FA signings at the position haven't been anything to write home about either.

With that said. I would be ecstatic, if Jones or Rhaney played well enough this offseason to earn a starting role.