Our WR'ing Core is Desperately Lacking and Number 1

[mr.stlouis]

(Take this with a grain of salt, I'm not stamping it just yet. I am making what I beleive is a solid case for the route of our problems without assuming the youn guys will get that much better at this point...)

Lots of slot receivers, no real outside WR.

Givens is not a very good outside WR. Yes he's a good deep threat because he's fast. However, his hands aren't that great and you can almost forget about a catch in traffic. I'm not sold he's the answer.

Pettis isn't really much running routes past 8 yards. His length and hands make him a good short yardage guy.

Quick! He was an X-Factor coming into this year. What I mean by that is his performance was crucial because we have no one else with his skill set. He's not got it done. He should be an every down player by now and he doesn't look like he's improved much from the beginning of this year. I'm not willing to give up on him just yet, but we need a guy that at least has reliable hands out there...

I know many just want to trade down but I'm thinking it wont do us that much good. This team doesn't have a ton of needs anymore. Even WR isn't a big need because we have 5 solid ones, just not one dynamite outside WR. We have not had a true number since Holt. I just want to at least solve this problem in the offseason...

At this point I'm a Watkins fan or trade down then get Evans scenario. I'm not crazy about Evans at this point either...

 

[lockdnram21]

Start Quick and Bailey the rest of the year if no progress or not enough draft wakins

 

[DR RAM]

Duh, but not all think so. I am with you. A JOSH GORDON, would make a difference. Argue that, anyone.

FWIW, I opined NOT to pick him in the supplemental, but did say to go after him on the trading block before he totally blew up. My offer, a #2, at the time. I would probably offer a #1 now.

 

[duckhunter]

I still say if a guy drops one or two, sit him for a while.

Hands should be top thing in selecting a receiver. It can be taught but a plucker usually has naturally gifted ball skills.

Obviously I don't know what the coaches are currently saying or doing but it doesn't seem to be sticking with some of these guys for whatever reason.

 

[V3]

Duh, but not all think so. I am with you. A JOSH GORDON, would make a difference. Argue that, anyone.

FWIW, I opined NOT to pick him in the supplemental, but did say to go after him on the trading block before he totally blew up. My offer, a #2, at the time. I would probably offer a #1 now.

I'm with you and the OP. Rams and Gators brought up the trade for Gordon and I'm on that wagon now, I think. I'm starting to think Cleveland won't give him up now though.

 

[jap]

People have been talking about the need for a true #1 ever since Torry left: this isn't anything new.

 

[mr.stlouis]

Duh, but not all think so. I am with you. A JOSH GORDON, would make a difference. Argue that, anyone.

FWIW, I opined NOT to pick him in the supplemental, but did say to go after him on the trading block before he totally blew up. My offer, a #2, at the time. I would probably offer a #1 now.

How the heck do you say "DUH" and add "but not all think so" at the end of it? Obviously that's not something you reply "DUH" to. In fact this isn't a recent development and not a done deal. We all hoped Quick would develope into V-Jack this year but it's obvious he's no where near that calibre of talent over a year and a half into his career. It's never been this telling.

Bottom line is we left some key opportunities on the field. If we insert a legit number one the the place of Givens, or anyone on the outside, then this could be a much different game. It's a problem that continues to resurface.

 

[V3]

People have been talking about the need for a true #1 ever since Torry left: this isn't anything new.

Yes but some seem to think we're fine at the position.

 

[jap]

Yes but some seem to think we're fine at the position.

When we have a receiver who can consistently come up with catches, especially key catches, difficult or not, then we will have a true #1, and we will be officially OK there.

 

[CGI_Ram]

Yes but some seem to think we're fine at the position.

Put me in the category that believes the WR unit is fine.

A game like today, makes the unit look bad and catches heat.

That said; if Quick isn't going to develop (and the coaches seem to refuse to start him) I'm on board drafting Watkins... Not sure about Evans.

And... The drops have me pissed right now.

 

[V3]

When we have a receiver who can consistently come up with catches, especially key catches, difficult or not, then we will have a true #1, and we will be officially OK there.

Tell that to the others that say don't bother drafting a WR.

 

[V3]

Put me in the category that believes the WR unit is fine.

A game like today, makes the unit look bad and catches heat.

That said; if Quick isn't going to develop (and the coaches seem to refuse to start him) I'm on board drafting Watkins... Not sure about Evans.

And... The drops have me pissed right now.

What game has the unit ever looked good? They haven't all been bad but the unit hasn't had many games, if any, where I thought they were really good, either.

 

[jap]

Tell that to the others that say don't bother drafting a WR.

We have four games left, and some young wide-outs that could use a serious look-see. We have seen flashes of good play from some of these guys from time to time. Remember that Kellen is throwing the rock now, and Sam does throw a far more catchable ball than Kellen. Nevertheless, some of these guys were dropping balls when Sam was at the helm.

Maybe one or more of these guys starts separating themselves over the last few weeks. This business of getting better doesn't happen automatically---these guys have to put in the work. TA becomes a lot more dangerous when there is/are a consistent receiver(s) drawing attention from the secondary. It may take Sted a while to get fully going. These are NFL defenders now---not collegiate bodies---and he has to become even more efficient. He may have gotten away with the offensive pass interference penalty if he was less obvious. Boldin runs good routes, but he gets away with crap like that often.

I don't know what they have in store for Pead, but I would prefer to see him playing in obvious passing situations on 3rd downs. He still appears to be the back with the best hands on the team, plus he sports speed and elusiveness too. I don't see why they target Givens in traffic; he's doesn't fight for the ball hard enough. He's not very big, and he seems to shy away from excessive contact to me. They need to find the TE's and Quick in traffic.

Whether they actually need to draft a receiver or grab a vet will become more obvious later on.

 

[CGI_Ram]

We have four games left, and some young wide-outs that could use a serious look-see. We have seen flashes of good play from some of these guys from time to time. Remember that Kellen is throwing the rock now, and Sam does throw a far more catchable ball than Kellen. Nevertheless, some of these guys were dropping balls when Sam was at the helm.

Maybe one or more of these guys starts separating themselves over the last few weeks. This business of getting better doesn't happen automatically---these guys have to put in the work. TA becomes a lot more dangerous when there is/are a consistent receiver(s) drawing attention from the secondary. It may take Sted a while to get fully going. These are NFL defenders now---not collegiate bodies---and he has to become even more efficient. He may have gotten away with the offensive pass interference penalty if he was less obvious. Boldin runs good routes, but he gets away with crap like that often.

I don't know what they have in store for Pead, but I would prefer to see him playing in obvious passing situations on 3rd downs. He still appears to be the back with the best hands on the team, plus he sports speed and elusiveness too. I don't see why they target Givens in traffic; he's doesn't fight for the ball hard enough. He's not very big, and he seems to shy away from excessive contact to me. They need to find the TE's and Quick in traffic.

Whether they actually need to draft a receiver or grab a vet will become more obvious later on.

I'm with you jap.

I might be open to a WR if he's BPA... But...

Austin < 1 season
Bailey < 1 season
Quick < 2 seasons
Givens < 2 seasons

I'm pissed too. Just saying, we need some perspective. These guys lack seasoning! And... Rarely do young WR have impact.

 

[jap]

I'm with you jap.

I might be open to a WR if he's BPA... But...

Austin < 1 season
Bailey < 1 season
Quick < 2 seasons
Givens < 2 seasons

I'm pissed too. Just saying, we need some perspective. These guys lack seasoning! And... Rarely do young WR have impact.

Well, the thing is they were going against one of the better defensive teams in a prime time game. All these young's guys are showing is that they have yet to develop the consistency of true top receivers. I don't know what's wrong with Chris Givens; he's been looking gimpy all season like he has a bad wheel or two. We rarely have seen the explosiveness we saw last season. Even so, good receivers have to play through pain, and I don't see him close to that level yet.

Kellen passes are not nearly as catchable as Sam's are, and Kellen was often under duress in this game, which made his passes even worst at times. If Kellen could execute a simple touch pass cleanly over a rushing DE to his RB's in the flat, he could make life much easier for himself and the team. Can you imagine someone with Pead's speed, quickness, elusiveness, and hands getting the rock in the open field with only the 2nd and 3rd level defenders to worry about? If Pead or someone else can establish themselves as a threat in the flats, defenses will have to account for them and Tavon and the other receivers will have even more room to operate.

I thought we would see more post plays with the TE's, but I suppose the SF pass rush forced them to stay in to block or at least chip defenders before they went into their routes. Besides, they almost surely have had to simplify the offense some because Kellen isn't accurate enough to execute some plays in tight coverage.

We have the Cards, the Saints, the Bucs, and the 'Hawks left to play. The Saints should be a great study for our receivers because they should represent a standard of performance for them to aim at. TJ could use another thumper besides him in the secondary despite McLeod's decent coverage and hustle. It would be nice to have a faster LB covering Jo-lonn's surest spot so we can't be taken advantage of on non-obvious passing plays.

Hopefully, this receiving crew comes more together in these last few games. The best they can hope for now is 9-7, but even 8-8 would represent an improvement over last season---even without Sam on the field.

 

[lasvegasrams]

i think we're fine at WR, just need development (it would be nice is holt or bruce got into coaching!!!)

 

[Angry Ram]

I'm with you jap.

I might be open to a WR if he's BPA... But...

Austin < 1 season
Bailey < 1 season
Quick < 2 seasons
Givens < 2 seasons

I'm pissed too. Just saying, we need some perspective. These guys lack seasoning! And... Rarely do young WR have impact.

IDK man if you throw in a Mike Evans in there....

 

[jap]

IDK man if you throw in a Mike Evans in there....

The talk about the collegiate guys is interesting, but if the Fisher King is to be believed, the coaching brass isn't even looking in that direction now. They will finish the season first, trying to get these young guys up to pro levels as much as they can in the remaining games. After the season comes the exhausting business of assessing team needs, considering available FA options, and studying tons of collegiate videos.

Some of the fans may be in panic mode and ready to cut ties with some players now, but the staff knows more intimately where these guys are and will make their assessments with each player's individual issues in mind.

 

[Angry Ram]

The talk about the collegiate guys is interesting, but if the Fisher King is to be believed, the coaching brass isn't even looking in that direction now. They will finish the season first, trying to get these young guys up to pro levels as much as they can in the remaining games. After the season comes the exhausting business of assessing team needs, considering available FA options, and studying tons of collegiate videos.

Some of the fans may be in panic mode and ready to cut ties with some players now, but the staff knows more intimately where these guys are and will make their assessments with each player's individual issues in mind.

Of course the coaches don't give a shit about the draft at this point. And I'm not in panic mode. Just pointing out potential upgrades.

 

[V3]

I'm with you jap.

I might be open to a WR if he's BPA... But...

Austin < 1 season
Bailey < 1 season
Quick < 2 seasons
Givens < 2 seasons

I'm pissed too. Just saying, we need some perspective. These guys lack seasoning! And... Rarely do young WR have impact.

In most cases it doesn't take 3 years to know what a WR is going to be. I'm not saying get rid of the rookies. But a WR like Quick that hasn't show much progress should not be immune to criticism. He was the first pick in the 2nd round and he still can't produce. That's not acceptable in my book. He can't grasp NFL concepts, he looks lost, he can't catch with hands in his face, and he plays smaller than his size. With Givens, he's shown he's just a speed guy and that's about it.

Do you want to bet the future of this team on that group? If they don't pan out, you're back to square one. They have to keep searching until they hit. Also, competition should push the others to play better. Even if they all happened to pan out, there's nothing wrong with that. That would only mean a more potent offense.