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Rmfnlt

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BEcause he kept pushing the "CVC hopes the NFL will do what they couldn't." referring to making the Rams stay, even after I told him that's not the case. It was 100% facepalm worthy. But now that I've explained myself, I'll drop it.
I think if you say the same thing enough times, it becomes accepted? (y)
 

ChrisW

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NFL training camps began opening across the country last week, a sign that the football season is almost upon us.

Thinking about buying season tickets to your favorite team? The investment might only be worth it if you have the faith. Rams, Jaguars and Redskins fans, watch your wallets.

While most NFL teams choose to try to fill seats in advance (and possibly reward loyal fans) by offering discounts for package deals and season tickets, 10 teams overvalue season tickets on at least one tier, according to data from SeatGeek, an online ticket marketplace. So it's entirely possible that you could save money just by waiting and buying tickets on the secondary market.

"Buying season tickets is an investment in how you think your team is going to do that season," said Clint Cutchins, an analyst at SeatGeek. Buy season tickets if you're feeling bullish. "If you think you're in for a down year, it's probably better to hold off and buy tickets on the secondary market."

season%20ticket%202-01.png

The figures are calculated by running average secondary-market ticket prices for all of a team's home games from last year and comparing to the 2015 season ticket price for that tier of seating. The four areas studied are lower level midfield and end zone; upper level midfield and end zone.

The best investment for football fans would be the lower level in midfield for the Dallas Cowboys. Fans could save $3,804 by buying season tickets for $3,400 rather than wait and pay $7,200 on the secondary market.

Read MoreHow the bettors' markets predict MLB's second half

The Seattle Seahawks—whose run at a second Super Bowl title last year was thwarted by Tom Brady's Patriots—had the most undervalued season tickets overall. Fans of the 'Hawks could save an average of $2,000 by buying in advance.

At the other end of the spectrum, a total of 10 teams sold season packages that would be bad investments, compared to the price you'd pay on the secondary market. The St. Louis Rams was the only team to overprice their season tickets at all four tiers, by an average of $160 overall. The Dolphins, Redskins and Vikings—all of whom finished their 2014 seasons in the bottom half of the league—overpriced their tickets at three tier levels.

Of course, a team with a winning record will bring fair-weather fans out of the woodwork (Seahawks' 12th man, anyone?), which will drive up the average price of tickets on the secondary market.

"We ended up finding that for the teams that did better last year looked like they had better deals on season tickets," Cutchins said.

Buy season tickets if your team's a contender this year. If your football faith is waning, it's probably best to sit tight and scoop up seats from disillusioned ticket holders when the team is 0-6.

Read MorePlayers in this sport earn more than the others

Of course, SeatGeek's figures don't take into account additional benefits that season ticket holders are sometimes afforded, such as parking discounts and meet-and-greets with players. Also, many NFL stadiums have long waiting lists for season tickets or require Personal Seat Licenses (PSLs) in order to purchase season tickets.

http://www.cnbc.com/2015/07/31/the-economics-of-buying-nfl-season-tickets.html
 

Rmfnlt

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As for the permits they started the processing/filing for permits back in February and will have them finalized by December.
You can start construction without having all the permits in place?

I did not know that.
 

RamzFanz

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No one can answer your first premise. I will say however that I am trying to be as neutral as possible being a former LA Rams fan and now living about as far away from each and also not wanting my Rams to move yet again as well as having formed some friendships with several St Louis Rams fans. I won't get any more opportunity to watch them play in LA than I do in St Louis. The times I have watched them play since they left LA have been as visitors.

I watch this thread and see how both sides glom onto anything that leans their way. Again, that is not to discredit anyone here. If I lived in LA or St Louis or had a real stake in this, I'd likely do the same. I have gone after posters from both sides for going too much toward the attacking angle.

It seems to me that fans from St Louis view the LA fans as someone relishing in the stealing of the Rams when I see them merely wanting their Rams back. It doesn't make the LA fans right or the St Louis fans wrong or vice verse. Frankly, I'd be much more pissed at fans that have the attitude of "fine - don't let the door hit your ass on the way out" - which I saw plenty of when the Rams left LA and to a lesser extent with fans in the Lou.

Most of what I have seen from the LA fans has actually been quite complimentary of the St Louis fan base. The CVC? Not so much. But from my perspective, the CVC is quite deserving of a lack of respect. I don't say that as a LA fan. I say that as someone who would rather this issue wasn't in front of us right now - someone who would like to be talking right now about the 2015 season for our Rams. I firmly believe that the CVC and its directors screwed the pooch for years and I didn't just come to that conclusion when Stan bought the Inglewood property. I have been pretty consistent on that for years.

I am not sure how anyone can really look at what has been posted here for all these pages and think that both sides haven't brought back up the same arguments only to rehash them to death. It's just the ebb and flow of this thread and why we didn't even want to allow it on ROD to begin with.

Sorry man and I know you have minded your Ps and Qs in all of this. I am honestly amazed at how most everyone else has as well. I thought this thread would last about 5 pages before it blew itself up.

I would only like to remind everyone that being a fan is almost purely emotional. It is extremely difficult to check your emotions at the door when you are - in the hearts of St Louis fans, about to rip their team from their city or in the hearts of LA fans, talking about righting what they view as a huge wrong.

If your girlfriend leaves you, you are not going to put much stock in the idea that she hated that you didn't squeeze the toothpaste tube from the bottom or that you left the toilet seat up. But her girlfriends will all say, " I can't believe you put up with that." Bitches.

Cheers man. I will be away for the most part through this weekend doing a Bones and Brew event. Yawlz treat each other like you'd want to be treated.

So you're saying you want me to start trouble?




That's what I got out of it. :sneaky:
 

OldSchool

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You can start construction without having all the permits in place?

I did not know that.

Not sure where you're going with this to be honest. I read that and expect blue font otherwise it comes off as just snarky or maybe a deliberate attack at something I said.
 

Rmfnlt

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Not sure where you're going with this to be honest. I read that and expect blue font otherwise it comes off as just snarky or maybe a deliberate attack at something I said.
Not at all... let me recap:

1] The discussion started with the report that Roggins said "Sewers and all the stuff thats below the ground are being installed for the stadium...".
2] I questioned the validity of this information (as many question the validity of anything that comes out of STL reporters/columnists, etc. mouths).
3] Then another poster suggested adequate proof would be permits, as they are public and all (which made sense to me)
4] You said: "As for the permits they started the processing/filing for permits back in February and will have them finalized by December."
5] So, I asked if you can do all that construction on a stadium without all the permits approved.
6] Now, you're taking offense to that... not sure why... seems logical to me.

Here's a chance to actually back-up what some reporter/columnist/whatever is spewing. no?
 
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OldSchool

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Not at all... let me recap:

1] The discussion started with the report that Roggins said "Sewers and all the stuff thats below the ground are being installed for the stadium...".
2] I questioned the validity of this information (as many question the validity of anything that comes out of STL reporters/columnists, etc. mouths).
3] Ten another poster suggested adequate proof would be permits, as they are public and all (which made sense to me)
4] You said: "As for the permits they started the processing/filing for permits back in February and will have them finalized by December."
5] So, I asked if you can do all that construction on a stadium without all the permits approved.
6] Now, you're taking offense to that... not sure why... seems logical to me.

Here's a chance to actually back-up what some reporter/columnist/whatever is spewing. no?

Just for reference it's not an all encompassing construction permit. The rest of the development besides the stadium had permits before the stadium was even proposed. Not sure where you got the report of the stuff for the stadium being installed but I'm fairly sure I never made that claim. They first obtain permits to level/tear down/destroy existing structures. In fact here's an article from 2013 discussing the planned demolition of the old Hollywood Park. The site the stadium is proposed to occupy.

http://la.curbed.com/archives/2013/05/massive_hollywood_park_redevelopment_finally_beginning.php

I stopped searching backwards after 10 pages for this article that I supposedly endorsed Roggin on. I'm fairly certain I never did that off the top of my head that last 2 things I've said about Roggin were this:

1) He's on equal footing with JT and Bernie. They're both biased local hacks for their region and teams.

2) So far as I know he hasn't said the Rams are going to Inglewood but he's said he believes Inglewood will be built and not Carson.

Not sure why you're including me in this permit discussion when I never said anything about them building the infrastructure for the stadium. I simply said, as has been quoted from many many articles, that the stadium has started the permit process and expects them to be all done and be able to start construction in December and be done with that within two years. I'm taking offense because you're throwing me into a discussion I was not a part of and putting words in my mouth. I am unfamiliar with this infrastructure article. I'm pretty certain I never endorsed it or Roggin in any way.
 

Rmfnlt

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Just for reference it's not an all encompassing construction permit. The rest of the development besides the stadium had permits before the stadium was even proposed. Not sure where you got the report of the stuff for the stadium being installed but I'm fairly sure I never made that claim. They first obtain permits to level/tear down/destroy existing structures. In fact here's an article from 2013 discussing the planned demolition of the old Hollywood Park. The site the stadium is proposed to occupy.

http://la.curbed.com/archives/2013/05/massive_hollywood_park_redevelopment_finally_beginning.php

I stopped searching backwards after 10 pages for this article that I supposedly endorsed Roggin on. I'm fairly certain I never did that off the top of my head that last 2 things I've said about Roggin were this:

1) He's on equal footing with JT and Bernie. They're both biased local hacks for their region and teams.

2) So far as I know he hasn't said the Rams are going to Inglewood but he's said he believes Inglewood will be built and not Carson.

Not sure why you're including me in this permit discussion when I never said anything about them building the infrastructure for the stadium. I simply said, as has been quoted from many many articles, that the stadium has started the permit process and expects them to be all done and be able to start construction in December and be done with that within two years. I'm taking offense because you're throwing me into a discussion I was not a part of and putting words in my mouth. I am unfamiliar with this infrastructure article. I'm pretty certain I never endorsed it or Roggin in any way.
I'm sorry... but your explanation is a cop-out. The conversations here are not in a vacuum... they're dynamic... members adding onto what others say... that's exactly what you did.

I made it perfectly clear the series of events (posts). See above. Go back and check it out... if I have something wrong, please let me know.

YOU inserted yourself into the Roggins discussion when you said the permits (and I quote)"[were]... started the processing/filing for permits back in February and will have them finalized by December."

I asked for some proof and you're getting all indignant. NM.
 

OldSchool

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I'm sorry... but your explanation is a cop-out. The conversations here are not in a vacuum... they're dynamic... members adding onto what others say... that's exactly what you did.

I made it perfectly clear the series of events (posts). See above. Go back and check it out... if I have something wrong, please let me know.

YOU inserted yourself into the Roggins discussion when you said the permits (and I quote)"[were]... started the processing/filing for permits back in February and will have them finalized by December."

I asked for some proof and you're getting all indignant. NM.

Nah I'm good, you included me in a group supporting Roggin when all I did was cite correctly that permits are a work in progress. I've made it perfectly clear where I stand on Roggin and you're trying to flip it. You're asking me for proof on a stance I don't support. It's very well known, as long as you've bothered to pay attention, that there are different phases of the Inglewood project. The non stadium portion has been approved and they're starting construction. I have never ever claimed that the stadium portion is starting construction now. They can level the old structures there, as they've had the permit to do that for years, but they aren't starting construction on it because as I cited the permits aren't expected to be finalized until December.

Again, I said permits were in the works and would be finalized by December. You take that to mean I support Roggin and say the that they're already working on infrastructure for the stadium? Sorry no matter what color of sunglasses or how big your blinders are but I don't see how you can claim that's what I said.
 

OldSchool

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@ChrisW

Interesting article, the way I read it they're implying the PSL's cost so much that you're better off buying per game tickets than buying a psl?
 

bluecoconuts

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Not at all... let me recap:

1] The discussion started with the report that Roggins said "Sewers and all the stuff thats below the ground are being installed for the stadium...".
2] I questioned the validity of this information (as many question the validity of anything that comes out of STL reporters/columnists, etc. mouths).
3] Then another poster suggested adequate proof would be permits, as they are public and all (which made sense to me)
4] You said: "As for the permits they started the processing/filing for permits back in February and will have them finalized by December."
5] So, I asked if you can do all that construction on a stadium without all the permits approved.
6] Now, you're taking offense to that... not sure why... seems logical to me.

Here's a chance to actually back-up what some reporter/columnist/whatever is spewing. no?

They already have those permits. There are different permits they need, they have been moving dirt on park for a long time, and have had those permits for a long time as well.

The sewage and stuff below ground has been cleared to be built for a while, they have been doing that for a while. Sewage, water, electricity, sidewalks all the infrastructure stuff have to be put in regardless of what they put on that area. Frankly all this stuff was covered back in February when it was reported that dirt was moving. In fact that was a hot topic because Inglewood is paying back Stockbridge/Kroenke for this work done with profits that they see from the project. Some tried saying that it was tax dollars, others pointed out that it's not really, and it's typically costs that the city just has to pay for themselves because it's infrastructure stuff and they become responsible for it.

So while it is true that the sewers and stuff being built below the ground is for the stadium, it is also true that it will be for any other building they put in there if they don't go with the stadium. The permits for them are already in place. The remainder of the permits that allow for the actual building part will be finalized

Now if the question is "Well are they actually doing it?" is Roggin correct that they are actually doing it on the area that the stadium sits? Well I can just go ahead and tell you yes they are. How do I know? Because I was in the area yesterday picking a friend up from LAX and he was curious about what they're doing there. Sho nuff they were doing something. What, I don't know, but something.

Again though, it's stuff that they have to do regardless of what they stick on that plot of land, and it's stuff they've been cleared to do for quite a while now.

Just think of it as Schrödinger's construction, it's both for the stadium and not for the stadium. Until we open the box (get the the final say from the NFL) it can be considered as both.
 

Spike14

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Kroenke has already started building in Inglewood:

per Fred Roggin, right now......He said he found out last night..Sewers and all the stuff thats below the ground are being installed for the stadium..This is from Inglewood Project builders....So the whole lets have a meeting before December before Kroenke starts building the thing, is moot.
Please!!!! Surveying, utility installation/modification, land grading, landscaping, etc., have been an ongoing activity at the HPP site since BEFORE Kroenke got involved. That is NOT clear evidence that a new stadium will arise anytime soon. Let me know when they start digging that "Meteor Crater" sized pit over there. Send pictures, too! Sorry to be a tad snarky, but I've read this "moving dirt" is proof claim a few too many times.
 
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Loyal

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Please!!!! Surveying, utility installation/modification, land grading, landscaping, etc., have been an ongoing activity at the HPP site since BEFORE Kroenke got involved. That is NOT clear evidence that a new stadium will arise anytime soon. Let me know when they start digging that "Meteor Crater" sized pit over there. Send pictures, too!
When Kroenke got involved, they had not even torn down the race track, so no..Believe what narrative that makes you feel better...
 

Spike14

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Having been absent from this site for 10 days, I decided to abuse myself and read through pages of what I would deem are mostly intelligent posts.

The debate regarding the lease agreement between the CVC and the Rams was pretty protracted. A few of the LA folks seem to favor portraying the end of the agreement as a "breach" by the CVC. To them, the Rams can stand firm that they negotiated in good faith. However, there was no breach of contract involved. The arbitration, non binding in this case, was PART of the lease agreement. The results of the arbitration panel simply allowed both parties to walk away and terminate the original lease.

Did any of you ever see the film "Super Troopers"? When Officer O'Hagen states "I swear to God, I'll pistol whip the next guy that says 'shenanigans!'"? That's kind of how I feel about the word "breach" as it relates to the terminated lease.:palm:
 

Spike14

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When Kroenke got involved, they had not even torn down the race track, so no..Believe what narrative that makes you feel better...
True......but a ton of other infrastructure work, including utilities, were already under way before ESK was ever involved. Even the demolition of the old pony track which happened recently, was planned long ago. Just because a 75 year old dilapidated grandstand was razed, doesn't mean that a shiny new stadium is going up on it's heels. Just because sewers are being installed is not evidence either. I'm only trying to emphasize that a stadium is NOT the only potential scenario there. That land is being prepped for a major project, that much is clear. Exactly what it will be, remains a bit hazy still.
 

The Ripper

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Having been absent from this site for 10 days, I decided to abuse myself and read through pages of what I would deem are mostly intelligent posts.

The debate regarding the lease agreement between the CVC and the Rams was pretty protracted. A few of the LA folks seem to favor portraying the end of the agreement as a "breach" by the CVC. To them, the Rams can stand firm that they negotiated in good faith. However, there was no breach of contract involved. The arbitration, non binding in this case, was PART of the lease agreement. The results of the arbitration panel simply allowed both parties to walk away and terminate the original lease.

Did any of you ever see the film "Super Troopers"? When Officer O'Hagen states "I swear to God, I'll pistol whip the next guy that says 'shenanigans!'"? That's kind of how I feel about the word "breach" as it relates to the terminated lease.:palm:

The problem with your argument is that arbitration was put in place to avoid having to go to court to determine if there was a breach. In 2007 they agreed to waive the top tier requirement in exchange for the amended lease but refused to sign a waiver of breach. Arbitration was non binding because complying wasn't required by the lease but having the dome top tier on March 1, 2015 was required in the lease from the beginning whereas the arbitration process was added in 2007.
 
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blue4

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Enough with the @$#+#@? arbitration/CVC/breach or no breach. I think we've all established that there will be no agreement.
 

bluecoconuts

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Did any of you ever see the film "Super Troopers"? When Officer O'Hagen states "I swear to God, I'll pistol whip the next guy that says 'shenanigans!'"? That's kind of how I feel about the word "breach" as it relates to the terminated lease.:palm:

Enough with the @$#+#@? arbitration/CVC/breach or no breach. I think we've all established that there will be no agreement.


Ohhhhhhhhh

shenanigans.png
 
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