Jeff Fisher is our Mike Singletary

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Boffo97

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I see a lot of talking back and forth as to wether Fischer gets his 5th year....just curious:

A. for those that say he doesn't get his 5th unless he does well -what does the record have to be for him to get his 5th year (or extentsion)?

B. for those that say he generally will get his 5th year - what does the record have to be for him to get canned?

Just wondering if the line for both groups is that far apart....
I'd say less than 9-7 next year has us looking elsewhere. I would say "barring circumstances outside his control", but the record doesn't show that to be a factor.
 

LesBaker

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Well that's a Kroenke problem. Fisher doesn't count against the cap, so he could really only negotiate with Kroenke about a raise if he were in the position to earn it (like that great last year you hypothesized). I seriously doubt that Fisher would look to go start this whole process over again if he were successful in his last year, so the negotiations would probably go kind of smoothly. Or, he might pull a Vermeil and leave us all hanging.

Nooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Don't put that kinda shit out in the atmosphere!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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Prime Time

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I see a lot of talking back and forth as to wether Fischer gets his 5th year....just curious:

A. for those that say he doesn't get his 5th unless he does well -what does the record have to be for him to get his 5th year (or extentsion)?

B. for those that say he generally will get his 5th year - what does the record have to be for him to get canned?

Just wondering if the line for both groups is that far apart....

I won't come up with a record for getting a contract extension or for getting fired but I will say it's about the team moving forward in the years he's been here. There is also the factor of extenuating circumstances such as key players getting injured that would hopefully come into play by those making a decision.

Marty Schottenheimer was fired after a 14-2 season. Although that's an oddity in the NFL, anything can happen when the HC either doesn't play nice with others(see Mike Martz and Jim Harbaugh) or doesn't meet the expectations of ownership. Here's an article about 10 worst HC firings. Jeff Fisher is mentioned near the bottom of the article.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer...nfl-head-coach-firings-are-worst-of-the-worst

These 10 NFL head coach firings are worst of the worst
June 2, 2013

img22343033.jpg

Marv Levy went to four straight Super Bowls with the Bills, losing twice to Jimmy Johnson's Cowboys. (USATSI)

NFL owners fire an awful lot of head coaches in hopes of changing the fortunes of their clubs. Head coaches average about three seasons to establish themselves or they are gone.

More franchises should follow the Pittsburgh Steelers when it comes to a philosophy about head coaches. The Rooney family has had only had three head coaches in 44 years. All three have won Super Bowls and the Steelers have been to the playoffs in 26 of those 44 seasons. The Steelers organization doesn't make knee-jerk decisions when it comes to the head coach. Chuck Noll went 12-30 in his first three years and went on to be a Hall of Fame coach. No talk of firing him after a rough start. In 1998-99, Bill Cowher went 13-19 and he got a contract extension. Mike Tomlin went 8-8 last season, and there's not even a whisper of an issue.

I decided to go back and look at all the head coaches who were fired and come up with my all-time 10 worst firings -- teams and owners that lived to regret the decision to let a coach go. Six of them took another team to a Super Bowl win and five of them are in the HOF. I wonder what would have happened if the owners thought like the Rooneys?

1. Marv Levy, Kansas City Chiefs: Levy was the head coach of the Kansas City Chiefs from 1978-82. He got fired at the end of a strike-shortened season. In his first four years, before the strike, the Chiefs improved every year -- four wins to seven, eight and nine. Levy went on to have a 112-70 record with the Bills with four straight Super Bowl appearances and is in the Hall of Fame.

2. Weeb Ewbank, Baltimore Colts: Ewbank is best known for leading the New York Jets to the 1969 Super Bowl win over the Baltimore Colts. He was the head coach of the Colts from 1954-62. In that time period he won two NFL championships (1958 and '59) and was head coach in what is considered the greatest NFL game ever played when his Colts beat the Giants in overtime.

3. Paul Brown, Cleveland Browns: Brown was coach of the Cleveland Browns until new, 35-year-old owner Art Modell fired him in 1962. Coach Brown went to the playoffs in eight of his first nine seasons as Browns head coach but that wasn't good enough to protect his job. Brown went to cross-state rival Cincinnati and led them to the playoffs three different seasons and is in the Hall of Fame.

4. George Allen, Washington Redskins: Allen was a great innovator, who revolutionized special teams among other things. In his seven seasons with the Redskins he never had a losing season and compiled a 67-30-1 record, including an NFC title in 1972. The story goes that he rejected a four-year, $1 million contract offer and was fired.

5. Tom Landry, Dallas Cowboys: Landry finished with a 250-162-6 record as Cowboys coach and was 20-16 in the postseason but was forced out after the 1988 season by new owner Jerry Jones. Landry was inducted into the Hall of Fame two years later.

6. Jimmy Johnson, Dallas Cowboys: Not to be outdone by the Landry firing, Jones parted ways with his replacement five seasons later when Johnson left in what was called a "mutual split." There's no way a coach with back-to-back Super Bowl titles (1992-93) should have left Dallas.

7. Tom Coughlin, Jacksonville Jaguars: The franchise's first coach stayed with the expansion team from 1995-2002 before being fired. He took his team to the playoffs four times and finished with a 68-60 record in Jacksonville. After a year off he took over the New York Giants and has won two Super Bowl titles while compiling an overall record of 91-64.

8. Bill Belichick, Cleveland Browns: Granted, he was young for a head coach and his 36-44 record wasn't impressive, to say the least -- but the rest is history. Again Modell fired his coach and Belichick has gone on to five Super Bowl appearances, winning three times. The Browns are on their seventh head coach in the 18 years since Belichick was fired, though if Belichick had stayed he would have become the first coach of the Ravens.

9. Tony Dungy/Jon Gruden, Tampa Bay Buccaneers/Oakland Raiders: This is a combo selection. The Bucs fired Dungy, who went on to win a Super Bowl with the Colts. The Raiders traded away Gruden, who turned around and beat Oakland in the Super Bowl.

10. Mike Shanahan, Denver Broncos: The Broncos let go a coach with a 146-91 record and two Super Bowl titles. Last year, in his third season with the Redskins, he won the NFC East with a rookie quarterback.

Honorable mention: Sam Wyche, Cincinnati Bengals; Chuck Knox, Seattle Seahawks; Dan Reeves, Atlanta Falcons; Lovie Smith, Chicago Bears; Pete Carroll, New York Jets; Jeff Fisher, Tennessee Titans; Andy Reid, Philadelphia Eagles.

The most unique story belongs to Marty Schottenheimer. He was fired by the Browns with a 46-31 record and three division titles in five years. Then he "resigned" from the Chiefs with a 101-58-1 record and three more division titles. He surfaced two years later with the Redskins and was fired after one season and an 8-8 record. The final stop was San Diego for five seasons and not only did he go 14-2 in his last season, he went 35-13 in his final three seasons. Shottenheimer had two losing seasons in his 21 years as an NFL head coach.
 

Mackeyser

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  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
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I know Mike Singletary didn't have GM powers, but Trent Baalke got players that worked for what Singletary was trying to accomplish. They certainly were trying to work together. And the results of that was a core that with Harbaugh as coach went to 3 straight NFC Championship games.

I think that the parallel is there. I'm not saying that they're identical. Singletary was so hyperintense that only a few players got him and the rest were either intimidated by him or put off by him. I'm not sure he ever used the word "fun" and "football" in the same sentence.

My point was that he, like Singletary, seems to have resurrected a struggling franchise and built a potentially dominant core.

However, no matter HOW one looks at it, NEITHER of them looked to be able to be that coach that would lead the team to be the dominant team they were capable of being.

The 49ers lucked into Harbaugh. The very next season... NFC Championship game. Boom.

Now, for some, the jury's still out on Fisher. Can he be both the Singletary AND the Harbaugh?

I dunno. This team loses focus and discipline FAR too much to be a winner. Coaches Carroll, Harbaugh and Arians coach DETAILS in a way that Fisher just doesn't seem to.

Now, I've not been in ANY of the camps or meeting rooms, so I dunno the difference between how Pete Carroll coaches versus how Bruce Arians coaches versus how Jim Harbaugh coaches versus Jeff Fisher coaches.

I dunno. But... only ONE team has been so inconsistent and so inconsistent at developing players and that's our Rams.

I've been a Fisher supporter for a long time, but I guess the support for Wells contrary to any logical evidence has me questioning everything about Fisher as a coach.

Frankly, I'd be VERY interested in what this team would accomplish with Adam Gase as our HC. He's clearly capable of working with top notch QBs and innovating using both big receivers AND quick receivers and knows how to develop a running game.
 

Memphis Ram

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I still think that Singletary is a pretty good coach. Harbaugh is too.

That said, Harbaugh joined the team at the right time. Singletary's rookies Mike Iupati, Anthony Davis, Alex Boone (Current Starting OLinemen) had gotten past their rookie seasons as well as a soon to be All-Pro LB Navarro Bowman. And in 2011 rookie Aldon Smith (14.5 sacks), Bruce Miller, Colin Kaepernick joined the team via the 49ers 1st draft class with Harbaugh. And Frank Gore didn't miss as many games as he had the prior season.
 

ram007

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Singletary is an old school football player that is not a good HC. He didn't relate to his players well and it was clear that the game had past him by.

Fisher is a very good HC, that has the respect of the entire league as a leader.

Show me a winning season with Rams. I will respect Fisher more than I do now.
 

Boffo97

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I won't come up with a record for getting a contract extension or for getting fired but I will say it's about the team moving forward in the years he's been here. There is also the factor of extenuating circumstances such as key players getting injured that would hopefully come into play by those making a decision.

Marty Schottenheimer was fired after a 14-2 season. Although that's an oddity in the NFL, anything can happen when the HC either doesn't play nice with others(see Mike Martz and Jim Harbaugh) or doesn't meet the expectations of ownership. Here's an article about 10 worst HC firings. Jeff Fisher is mentioned near the bottom of the article.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer...nfl-head-coach-firings-are-worst-of-the-worst

These 10 NFL head coach firings are worst of the worst
June 2, 2013

img22343033.jpg

Marv Levy went to four straight Super Bowls with the Bills, losing twice to Jimmy Johnson's Cowboys. (USATSI)

NFL owners fire an awful lot of head coaches in hopes of changing the fortunes of their clubs. Head coaches average about three seasons to establish themselves or they are gone.

More franchises should follow the Pittsburgh Steelers when it comes to a philosophy about head coaches. The Rooney family has had only had three head coaches in 44 years. All three have won Super Bowls and the Steelers have been to the playoffs in 26 of those 44 seasons. The Steelers organization doesn't make knee-jerk decisions when it comes to the head coach. Chuck Noll went 12-30 in his first three years and went on to be a Hall of Fame coach. No talk of firing him after a rough start. In 1998-99, Bill Cowher went 13-19 and he got a contract extension. Mike Tomlin went 8-8 last season, and there's not even a whisper of an issue.

I decided to go back and look at all the head coaches who were fired and come up with my all-time 10 worst firings -- teams and owners that lived to regret the decision to let a coach go. Six of them took another team to a Super Bowl win and five of them are in the HOF. I wonder what would have happened if the owners thought like the Rooneys?

1. Marv Levy, Kansas City Chiefs: Levy was the head coach of the Kansas City Chiefs from 1978-82. He got fired at the end of a strike-shortened season. In his first four years, before the strike, the Chiefs improved every year -- four wins to seven, eight and nine. Levy went on to have a 112-70 record with the Bills with four straight Super Bowl appearances and is in the Hall of Fame.

2. Weeb Ewbank, Baltimore Colts: Ewbank is best known for leading the New York Jets to the 1969 Super Bowl win over the Baltimore Colts. He was the head coach of the Colts from 1954-62. In that time period he won two NFL championships (1958 and '59) and was head coach in what is considered the greatest NFL game ever played when his Colts beat the Giants in overtime.

3. Paul Brown, Cleveland Browns: Brown was coach of the Cleveland Browns until new, 35-year-old owner Art Modell fired him in 1962. Coach Brown went to the playoffs in eight of his first nine seasons as Browns head coach but that wasn't good enough to protect his job. Brown went to cross-state rival Cincinnati and led them to the playoffs three different seasons and is in the Hall of Fame.

4. George Allen, Washington Redskins: Allen was a great innovator, who revolutionized special teams among other things. In his seven seasons with the Redskins he never had a losing season and compiled a 67-30-1 record, including an NFC title in 1972. The story goes that he rejected a four-year, $1 million contract offer and was fired.

5. Tom Landry, Dallas Cowboys: Landry finished with a 250-162-6 record as Cowboys coach and was 20-16 in the postseason but was forced out after the 1988 season by new owner Jerry Jones. Landry was inducted into the Hall of Fame two years later.

6. Jimmy Johnson, Dallas Cowboys: Not to be outdone by the Landry firing, Jones parted ways with his replacement five seasons later when Johnson left in what was called a "mutual split." There's no way a coach with back-to-back Super Bowl titles (1992-93) should have left Dallas.

7. Tom Coughlin, Jacksonville Jaguars: The franchise's first coach stayed with the expansion team from 1995-2002 before being fired. He took his team to the playoffs four times and finished with a 68-60 record in Jacksonville. After a year off he took over the New York Giants and has won two Super Bowl titles while compiling an overall record of 91-64.

8. Bill Belichick, Cleveland Browns: Granted, he was young for a head coach and his 36-44 record wasn't impressive, to say the least -- but the rest is history. Again Modell fired his coach and Belichick has gone on to five Super Bowl appearances, winning three times. The Browns are on their seventh head coach in the 18 years since Belichick was fired, though if Belichick had stayed he would have become the first coach of the Ravens.

9. Tony Dungy/Jon Gruden, Tampa Bay Buccaneers/Oakland Raiders: This is a combo selection. The Bucs fired Dungy, who went on to win a Super Bowl with the Colts. The Raiders traded away Gruden, who turned around and beat Oakland in the Super Bowl.

10. Mike Shanahan, Denver Broncos: The Broncos let go a coach with a 146-91 record and two Super Bowl titles. Last year, in his third season with the Redskins, he won the NFC East with a rookie quarterback.

Honorable mention: Sam Wyche, Cincinnati Bengals; Chuck Knox, Seattle Seahawks; Dan Reeves, Atlanta Falcons; Lovie Smith, Chicago Bears; Pete Carroll, New York Jets; Jeff Fisher, Tennessee Titans; Andy Reid, Philadelphia Eagles.

The most unique story belongs to Marty Schottenheimer. He was fired by the Browns with a 46-31 record and three division titles in five years. Then he "resigned" from the Chiefs with a 101-58-1 record and three more division titles. He surfaced two years later with the Redskins and was fired after one season and an 8-8 record. The final stop was San Diego for five seasons and not only did he go 14-2 in his last season, he went 35-13 in his final three seasons. Shottenheimer had two losing seasons in his 21 years as an NFL head coach.
Lack of Mike Martz hurts that list's credibility. Still wish we got rid of Zygmunt then.
 

-X-

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Lack of Mike Martz hurts that list's credibility. Still wish we got rid of Zygmunt then.
I don't think getting rid of Martz hurt us much. He didn't go on to do anything, and we didn't get much worse. The collapse was already in motion.
 

Boffo97

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I don't think getting rid of Martz hurt us much. He didn't go on to do anything, and we didn't get much worse. The collapse was already in motion.
There's some point to that. Ideally, once I get my time machine, I'm not only keeping Martz but having him work with a good GM, and have that GM have an in-house scouting department from day one. Then I think we would have seen a difference.
 

-X-

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There's some point to that. Ideally, once I get my time machine, I'm not only keeping Martz but having him work with a good GM, and have that GM have an in-house scouting department from day one. Then I think we would have seen a difference.
If you ever get that going, go back to right before the Super Bowl in 99 and tell Vermeil not to make any hasty decisions.
 

bluecoconuts

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3 NFC Championship games and 1 SB game later and they have the exact same amount of rings as they did before. Fuck the 49ers.
 

Dodgersrf

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Fisher is the best thing we have going. I fully expect Snead to keep him around as long as he can. I don't want to be a team without a clue. Like the Raiders. Changing coaches annually. I want stability. More tike the Steelers. Where the coaches are there their entire career.
If the Raiders are smart, they'll keep Sparano. The team started playing well when he took over.
But they're not smart. They're the Raiders and the
Show me a winning season with Rams. I will respect Fisher more than I do now.
Show me any coach that could take this team to the playoffs, with Davis/Hill at qb playing behind a horrid oline. I highly doubt any coach could have done that.
The criticism has become redundant.
 

Lesson

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If you ever get that going, go back to right before the Super Bowl in 99 and tell Vermeil not to make any hasty decisions.

What about telling him to bring Lovie in sooner rather than later?
 

-X-

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What about telling him to bring Lovie in sooner rather than later?
Why stop there? Get him in the war room during the 1996 draft.

"Lawrence Phillips?"
"No. Just no. In fact, GOD NO. Take Eddie George instead."

"Eddie Kennison?"
"Again. No. Just take Marvin Harrison. You won't regret it."
 

Lesson

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Why stop there? Get him in the war room during the 1996 draft.

"Lawrence Phillips?"
"No. Just no. In fact, GOD NO. Take Eddie George instead."

"Eddie Kennison?"
"Again. No. Just take Marvin Harrison. You won't regret it."

Kennison turned out to be a good WR. Just not in St. Louis

Furthermore:

"Jay Zygmunt?"
"Tell Georgia it's you or him."

"Joey Porter?"
"Draft him."
 

Pancake

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If you ever get that going, go back to right before the Super Bowl in 99 and tell Vermeil not to make any hasty decisions.

Then after that set the dial for February 2, 2002 and point that Walsh fucker out to Martz when he shows up with his camera.
 

Boffo97

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Then after that set the dial for February 2, 2002 and point that Walsh freaker out to Martz when he shows up with his camera.
If that happened. I have my doubt's about Walsh's veracity.

Not that I put that kind of cheating past the Patriots. But if I were them (and had no morals, but that goes without saying) and we just got busted for taping defensive signals from day one of Belichick's tenure and wanted it to go away, it'd be hard to think of a better way to handle it than what happened:

Have a "former" employee start dropping rumors that something even worse than the signal taping happened, have him drag it out for as long as possible, then turn out to have no new information. Then the news is so old that hardly anyone wants to talk about the signal taping anymore, and the guy goes away quietly.
 

Elmgrovegnome

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I am not all in on Gase. I am not all in on any OC that is successful with Peyton Manning because I don't know who is more responsible for the success. Has Gase done his thing with a lesser QB or with lesser weapons? Just asking.

BTW I think Fisher is much better than Singletary. I keep saying that as abysmal as this team was Fisher should get the full 5 years to do the job. Besides I want stability with the Rams, similar to the franchises that Kroenke wants to pattern the Rams after. Coaching carousels are worse then allowing a good/not great coach to assemble his team according to his specs. After the 5 years are up then I will decide if it's over, unless of course there is a complete collapse that signifies that he lost the team.