Deep Thoughts From Mike Martz

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Zaphod

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I would kill to have about a half hour to talk about the QBs in this draft with Mad Mike. I've said it more than once... Few guys know the QB position like he does. I remember him talking QBs before the draft that had Big Ben and being impressed with his evaluation of him and his take proved out.

If I'm Snead, I hire him as a consultant, at a minimum, as previous suggested. Use him for the following, IMO, and give him a title that allows him to make the overall organization better:

1. Assist in the scouting/acquisition of the Rams' next franchise QB, considering all possibilities from draft to trade.
2. Be made available to and have access to Fish and his staff for interactions from the QB acquisition angle to mentoring Schotty, Cignetti, the team's offensive quality control team, etc.
3. Assist Fish in finding the next hot offensive coordinator in the event Schotty is fired, leaves for another job, etc.

Mad Mike's a great football mind, I think there's a lot of value in adding him to the team given the Rams' need to move forward offensively from QB to maybe even OC. And even if Schotty is kept around he'd be a smart addition to make this franchise more savvy on that side of the ball.
That just made me think. I wonder if there is some kind of legal issue that prevents him from working with another team in that capacity. I'm sure he's happy working as an analyst.
 

MrMotes

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I agree with that 100%, the passing game we see today has his finger prints on it.

3 wide sets are the base set for most teams these days where it used to be something you only saw a handful of times a game. Martz did that all day.

Remember when empty backfield sets were radical? Now we see them all the time.
But other than Warner each of them really blossomed under another HC.

And IMO Warner is just an outlier like no other we've seen at QB. Lighting in a bottle.

That's absurd, look at Bulger's passer rating by year. Trent Green emerged in Washington when Martz was his QB coach. Vermeil took Green and Saunders to KC to run Martz's offense. Martz's fingerprints are all over all 3 of their careers.

Or look at Isaac Bruce. Martz was his WR coach Bruce's first 2 years. Then Martz went to DC and Bruce went in the toilet only to re-emerge when Martz returned in '99...
 

Zaphod

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Remember when empty backfield sets were radical? Now we see them all the time.


That's absurd, look at Bulger's passer rating by year. Trent Green emerged in Washington when Martz was his QB coach. Vermeil took Green and Saunders to KC to run Martz's offense. Martz's fingerprints are all over all 3 of their careers.

Or look at Isaac Bruce. Martz was his WR coach Bruce's first 2 years. Then Martz went to DC and Bruce went in the toilet only to re-emerge when Martz returned in '99...
Wow, now I'm really wondering. I guess I never realized how many empty backfield sets we ran as I didn't pay much attention to those details back then.

I always thought that Faulk was such a wicked triple threat to run, block and catch that you really never wanted him off the field. That dude just made plays.
 

LesBaker

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Remember when empty backfield sets were radical? Now we see them all the time.


That's absurd, look at Bulger's passer rating by year. Trent Green emerged in Washington when Martz was his QB coach. Vermeil took Green and Saunders to KC to run Martz's offense. Martz's fingerprints are all over all 3 of their careers.

Or look at Isaac Bruce. Martz was his WR coach Bruce's first 2 years. Then Martz went to DC and Bruce went in the toilet only to re-emerge when Martz returned in '99...

Ball don't lie.

Trent Green http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/G/GreeTr00.htm

Bulger had his best ever year under Linehan.

Bruce missed games and played hurt during the two years Martz was gone. Hamstrings.
 

LesBaker

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Wow, now I'm really wondering. I guess I never realized how many empty backfield sets we ran as I didn't pay much attention to those details back then.

I always thought that Faulk was such a wicked triple threat to run, block and catch that you really never wanted him off the field. That dude just made plays.

In the now famous Giants game I think Martz called 35 or so 4-5 wide sets.
 

moklerman

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Purely speculation to say that. I'm pretty sure he was often less than satisfied with the blocking schemes tho.
Speculation based on the events that led to him starting. He was a 6th round, "never gonna be" for the Saints and a practice squad guy the Martz made a project out of. No one was going to be knocking on his door and he wasn't going to get an opportunity and is very lucky to have gotten the chance that he did with the GSOT. Anywhere else and he probably never starts a game.
 

iced

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I would love have to Martz back on the staff in some kind Offensive Assistant role but not the OC - think he would help teach schotty how to utilize the pass game better (he's decent with the run game)
 

moklerman

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But other than Warner each of them really blossomed under another HC.

And IMO Warner is just an outlier like no other we've seen at QB. Lighting in a bottle.
Bulger played his best ball when the success of the offense wasn't on his shoulders. His 5 game winning streak in 2002 and then his efficient 2006 under Linehan were both predicated on Marshall Faulk and Steven Jackson running the ball. But Bulger's completion %, YPA, TD% and rating were much higher under Martz than Linehan.

Green played his best as a QB for Martz too. His playing time in 2000 was abbreviated but his numbers were far and away better that year than any time in Washington, KC or with the Rams 2.0.
 

iced

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Bulger played his best ball when the success of the offense wasn't on his shoulders. His 5 game winning streak in 2002 and then his efficient 2006 under Linehan were both predicated on Marshall Faulk and Steven Jackson running the ball. But Bulger's completion %, YPA, TD% and rating were much higher under Martz than Linehan.

Green played his best as a QB for Martz too. His playing time in 2000 was abbreviated but his numbers were far and away better that year than any time in Washington, KC or with the Rams 2.0.

Actually Linehan was absolutely dreadful in '06 - it wasn't until he handed playcalling duties down to Greg Olson when the offense flourished
 

MrMotes

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Ball don't lie.

Trent Green http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/G/GreeTr00.htm

Bulger had his best ever year under Linehan.

Bruce missed games and played hurt during the two years Martz was gone. Hamstrings.

Vermeil didn't know how to handle Bruce, didn't let him follow his own workout/warm up routine the way Martz did. I strongly doubt Bruce's two off years were merely coincidence.

Rams offense was dreadful from the end of the Robinson era until Martz took it over in '99. Linehan's first year was the last good year for the Rams offense when he was using Martz's players and a lot of Martz's playbook. The offense has been dreadful ever since, including under Linehan.
 

MrMotes

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Actually Linehan was absolutely dreadful in '06 - it wasn't until he handed playcalling duties down to Greg Olson when the offense flourished

Including going back to plays that had been working under Martz, you know like those dig routes that Bulger could throw in his sleep...
 

LesBaker

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Bulger played his best ball when the success of the offense wasn't on his shoulders. His 5 game winning streak in 2002 and then his efficient 2006 under Linehan were both predicated on Marshall Faulk and Steven Jackson running the ball. But Bulger's completion %, YPA, TD% and rating were much higher under Martz than Linehan.

Green played his best as a QB for Martz too. His playing time in 2000 was abbreviated but his numbers were far and away better that year than any time in Washington, KC or with the Rams 2.0.

His play in 2000 wasn't as good IMO. Some slightly higher averages/ratings but his passing wasn't as crisp and precise. And he became more accurate in KC.

I don't off the top of my head recall the QB coach at the time, he went to KC and Green had mentioned him on a couple of occasions. He played better football there than he did in STL, that cannot be denied.

As far as KC using Martz's system that isn't really true either but I'm not going to go over well worn turf.

Your point about running helping a lot is true, also early in his career Bulger couldn't throw a sceen pass for shit but he got it down because Linehan drilled them on that screen in practice a lot. It worked on every defense they used it on, left side or right side.
 

Selassie I

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moklerman

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He played better football there than he did in STL, that cannot be denied.
I think the numbers deny it and IMO, he was playing better than Warner in 2000 which is saying something. As good as he played at times for KC, 2000 for the Rams was the only time in his career that he posted a passer rating above 100. Plus, KC was much more dependent on the running game. Green could pass the ball but passing was secondary for them.
 

LesBaker

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I think the numbers deny it and IMO, he was playing better than Warner in 2000 which is saying something. As good as he played at times for KC, 2000 for the Rams was the only time in his career that he posted a passer rating above 100. Plus, KC was much more dependent on the running game. Green could pass the ball but passing was secondary for them.

Lulz at he was playing better than Warner in 2000.

Warner was not only leading the league in 2000 he was exceeding the YPA record that had stood for decades and was set by Otto Graham. He was vaporizing defenses.

Your recollection of history is faulty. Very faulty.

Anyway, lets drop this. I'm tired of rehashing 99-01 and everything about it.
 

Merlin

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This is a great article....THIS is the kind of work NFL Network should be doing....instead we get TD dance rankings and holiday recipes....terrible.
Anyway, I love Martz. "Outstanding!!". That is the highest Martz compliment. At 63 he may be more willing to work as an OC vs. the overall work/stress load of being a HC. It does make one wonder what Martz would do with Tavon Austin and Cook.
What he said about understanding how to exploit the defenses "rules" is very revealing. The interesting part is Martz was very much a ground and pound coach in college. I think he understands well that the rules and designed now to favor a big play passing offense.

Couldn't agree more Fearsome. I love to read and watch real analysis, and that was great and backed up what I've been thinking about McCoy. I've been grudgingly impressed by him and the Chargers, their offensive spark and overall team resilience was noted by myself and that article really opened my eyes a bit.

I'll say this about Mad Mike... Bring him in as OC with Tavon Austin, Studman Bailey, Brian Quick, Tre Mason, Jared Cook alone as weapons, that is not even considering bringing back Britt or drafting another weapon... This offense would explode. In a good, amazing, almost 1999 way.

He'd also ensure the Rams make good QB decisions.

It's a ridiculous longshot, I know. A virtual impossibility that Fish would hire him. Yet I harbor a small hope nevertheless, because of the perfect nature of it. I'll say it right now... If somehow it were to happen the Rams would win it all next year. Period, IMO!
 

reggae

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Speculation based on the events that led to him starting. He was a 6th round, "never gonna be" for the Saints and a practice squad guy the Martz made a project out of. No one was going to be knocking on his door and he wasn't going to get an opportunity and is very lucky to have gotten the chance that he did with the GSOT. Anywhere else and he probably never starts a game.
Interesting. Kurt Warner was an duff whom Martz wanted to cut. Brady was a 6th round pick. You're speculating in past tense. Outside of that Rams team Martz is not well thought of! To even ponder anything else is living a lie!
 

reggae

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As mok said it was Linny he rolled his eyes behind his back and IMO it was probably while thinking "dude you ain't Mike Martz"

I agree though that like the other coaches who hired Martz in spite of their diametrically opposed philosophies , Fisher would only hire Martz if he was desperate and wanting him to save his job ,without near the talent on those teams at his disposal , that said this team LOOKS LIKE a team drafted for Martz ,I don't think we are as talented as that team but we are close.
Martz made QB's by MAKING the recs. precise and not letting up until they were ,virtually all his recs. tell of how much Martz did to make them be precise and how much they learned from the man.
What a joke. Martz built his reputation on incredible talent. No team will ever put together a roster like that again ever! As head coach he couldn't even parlay it into 1 Super Bowl win. Martz is a fallacy. There is no Martz!
 

Thordaddy

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What a joke. Martz built his reputation on incredible talent. No team will ever put together a roster like that again ever! As head coach he couldn't even parlay it into 1 Super Bowl win. Martz is a fallacy. There is no Martz!

You are dead to me :LOL:

So BTW since you blame Martz for losing that SB you must then believe the cheating by Belicek was irrelevant and disagree with the HC you can not say didn't have a SB win Dick Vermeil who said " No Mike Martz , no Super Bowl" direct quote there. Then again you might ask some of that "incredible talent" what they think of Martz's abilities.

Heres' a sample fer ya

When did you know season would be special?

[+] Enlarge
Peter Newcomb/AFP/Getty ImagesTorry Holt on his time with the Rams: "I feel strongly that we were a springboard to a lot of teams now and how coordinators now run the offense."
Holt: When I came in for, I think it was like a minicamp or something, I knew the talent was there, I just couldn’t believe the year before that they were 3-13 or 4-12 or whatever it was the year before. I was dumbfounded. The reason was because of the talent we had there on the roster. It goes to show you it’s not only about talent. It’s about other things we were able to put together that year we won it all. At those minicamps and those OTAs, being around the facility, seeing how guys were working, seeing what coach [Mike] Martz wanted to do with the team offensively,

http://www.ramsondemand.com/threads/deep-thoughts-from-mike-martz.32971/page-4
 
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