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View: https://twitter.com/mikegarafolo/status/877981901553680384
Wow big news out of KC today. I imagine he will be highly coveted by many teams.
Chiefs part ways with GM John Dorsey
- Thread starter Stl2La
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View: https://twitter.com/mikegarafolo/status/877981901553680384
Wow big news out of KC today. I imagine he will be highly coveted by many teams.
SteezyEndo
The Immaculate Exception
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Can we do a GM trade Snead for this guy?
HE WITH HORNS
Hall of Fame
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This^ in a nutshell, Reid had power in Philadelphia and it's obvious he wanted more power in Kansas City. IMO, I think highly of Dorsey and was on my radar for the Rams and moving forward will still be.
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http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2017/06/29/kansas-city-chiefs-john-dorsey-fired-nfl-notebook
The John Dorsey Dismissal: Where It Went Wrong in K.C.
It took the league—and some on the team—by surprise, but there were signs the end was near. Here are three flash points that played a part in the Chiefs changes
By Albert Breer
Photo: Scott Winters/Icon Sportswire via Getty Images
The dismissal of Chiefs general manager John Dorsey was met, almost universally, with shock. Scouts and coaches who knew him in other NFL cities were actively trying to figure out what happened. Some with jobs in Kansas City were scrambling to put the pieces together.
It wasn’t just the bizarre timing, either. This sort of thing normally doesn’t happen to a respected, well-liked football man like Dorsey. And it’s a credit to the Chiefs and Dorsey that no one saw it coming, like everyone did in similarly ill-timed plug-pullings in Washington and Buffalo earlier this year.
A text that came across from a rival scouting director said it best: “What’s the real story?”
Though most people in that organization seem to maintain genuine affection for Dorsey, issues simmered there for almost two years. They began to boil over following the departure of director of football operations Chris Ballard in January, and came to a head at a most unusual juncture in the NFL calendar—the deadest time of the football year.
Back in February, with the five-year deals of Dorsey and coach Andy Reid set to expire after the 2017 season, Chiefs chairman Clark Hunt told the Kansas City Star: “I would expect to sit down with them over the course of the next year and talk about an extension.” The Reid talks happened, and a deal was struck to keep him in Kansas City through the 2021 season. The Dorsey talks didn’t.
So there are two questions to answer: 1) What changed? 2) How did Hunt see what few on the outside could, and what few on the inside thought would never reach the ownership level?
The truth is, some of this traces back to a shift in the organizational model in 2013. Scott Pioli was the only person on the football side reporting to Hunt from 2009-12, and Hunt changed that, in part, because he wanted more oversight. So Reid, Dorsey and president Mark Donovan would all report to Hunt, as Hunt was determined not to let problems fester as they had with Pioli and ex-coach Todd Haley.
In practice, that meant Hunt had a better view of the internal issues than many realized, particularly since Reid and Dorsey set up their football operation in the old Eagle model, with coaching and scouting somewhat sovereign to one another.
John Dorsey
Photo: Joe Robbins/Getty Images
Given the power each then wielded, the stock criticism of Dorsey—that while he’s incredibly respected as an evaluator, he’s more scout than manager—was validated with a level of disorganization that was noticeable before the hyper-organized Ballard departed, and obvious after he left for Indy.
As one source explained it, “It wasn’t dysfunction so much as it was decisions were being made that seemed to come out of nowhere. So that existed, but the people here weren’t aware that ownership was aware of it. … You look back now, how it worked out, and ownership was more aware that it didn’t need to be run that way.”
There were also a few flash points to prove it out over the past 18 months:
• The selection of Stanford quarterback Kevin Hogan in the fifth round of the 2016 draft. That move stunned scouts and coaches, based on the evaluation and meetings leading up to the draft. Hogan didn’t wind up making the team four months later, and started last season on the Browns’ practice squad.
• The four-year, $48 million extension with left tackle Eric Fisher in August 2016. At the time of signing, Fisher had failed to entrench himself at the left tackle spot he was drafted to play. In fact, Fisher lost the job to Donald Stephenson during the 2015 season, and Fisher was flipped to the right side. The Chiefs still did the big contract, despite having a year left on Fisher’s rookie deal, and an option year after that.
• The five-year, $41.25 million deal for guard Laurent Duvernay-Tardif in February. This deal came, like Fisher’s, in Duvernay-Tardif’s first offseason eligible for a second contract. Meanwhile, the Justin Houston and Eric Berry contract talks simmered—cap guru Trip MacCracken was let go last month—and the team has spent the past couple years perilously close to the salary cap.
Others in the building saw signs of decisions becoming less collaborative, and more centered on Dorsey’s instincts. It also didn’t go unnoticed that Dorsey’s draft picks, like Fisher and Duvernay-Tardif, were the ones getting paid early. And the way the Jeremy Maclin release was handled—key members of the staff didn’t know until after it became public—didn’t help squash the internal whispering.
This isn’t to say there weren’t decisions that were made with a roaring consensus from the team’s football operation. One such call was the one to pursue Texas Tech quarterback Patrick Mahomes in the draft. The Chiefs moved aggressively to make it happen.
But too often, there were big moves made where scouts and coaches were left scratching their heads. It still bothers some close to Dorsey that Hunt caught wind of it, because there certainly weren’t many signs externally that the ax was about to drop. Some still maintain that it was right to keep these issues in-house, since they may have been fixable.
The trouble with that, of course, was the Chiefs were going to have to sign up for another half-decade with Dorsey. And in the end, that’s something that Hunt wasn’t going to do.
The John Dorsey Dismissal: Where It Went Wrong in K.C.
It took the league—and some on the team—by surprise, but there were signs the end was near. Here are three flash points that played a part in the Chiefs changes
By Albert Breer
Photo: Scott Winters/Icon Sportswire via Getty Images
The dismissal of Chiefs general manager John Dorsey was met, almost universally, with shock. Scouts and coaches who knew him in other NFL cities were actively trying to figure out what happened. Some with jobs in Kansas City were scrambling to put the pieces together.
It wasn’t just the bizarre timing, either. This sort of thing normally doesn’t happen to a respected, well-liked football man like Dorsey. And it’s a credit to the Chiefs and Dorsey that no one saw it coming, like everyone did in similarly ill-timed plug-pullings in Washington and Buffalo earlier this year.
A text that came across from a rival scouting director said it best: “What’s the real story?”
Though most people in that organization seem to maintain genuine affection for Dorsey, issues simmered there for almost two years. They began to boil over following the departure of director of football operations Chris Ballard in January, and came to a head at a most unusual juncture in the NFL calendar—the deadest time of the football year.
Back in February, with the five-year deals of Dorsey and coach Andy Reid set to expire after the 2017 season, Chiefs chairman Clark Hunt told the Kansas City Star: “I would expect to sit down with them over the course of the next year and talk about an extension.” The Reid talks happened, and a deal was struck to keep him in Kansas City through the 2021 season. The Dorsey talks didn’t.
So there are two questions to answer: 1) What changed? 2) How did Hunt see what few on the outside could, and what few on the inside thought would never reach the ownership level?
The truth is, some of this traces back to a shift in the organizational model in 2013. Scott Pioli was the only person on the football side reporting to Hunt from 2009-12, and Hunt changed that, in part, because he wanted more oversight. So Reid, Dorsey and president Mark Donovan would all report to Hunt, as Hunt was determined not to let problems fester as they had with Pioli and ex-coach Todd Haley.
In practice, that meant Hunt had a better view of the internal issues than many realized, particularly since Reid and Dorsey set up their football operation in the old Eagle model, with coaching and scouting somewhat sovereign to one another.
John Dorsey
Photo: Joe Robbins/Getty Images
Given the power each then wielded, the stock criticism of Dorsey—that while he’s incredibly respected as an evaluator, he’s more scout than manager—was validated with a level of disorganization that was noticeable before the hyper-organized Ballard departed, and obvious after he left for Indy.
As one source explained it, “It wasn’t dysfunction so much as it was decisions were being made that seemed to come out of nowhere. So that existed, but the people here weren’t aware that ownership was aware of it. … You look back now, how it worked out, and ownership was more aware that it didn’t need to be run that way.”
There were also a few flash points to prove it out over the past 18 months:
• The selection of Stanford quarterback Kevin Hogan in the fifth round of the 2016 draft. That move stunned scouts and coaches, based on the evaluation and meetings leading up to the draft. Hogan didn’t wind up making the team four months later, and started last season on the Browns’ practice squad.
• The four-year, $48 million extension with left tackle Eric Fisher in August 2016. At the time of signing, Fisher had failed to entrench himself at the left tackle spot he was drafted to play. In fact, Fisher lost the job to Donald Stephenson during the 2015 season, and Fisher was flipped to the right side. The Chiefs still did the big contract, despite having a year left on Fisher’s rookie deal, and an option year after that.
• The five-year, $41.25 million deal for guard Laurent Duvernay-Tardif in February. This deal came, like Fisher’s, in Duvernay-Tardif’s first offseason eligible for a second contract. Meanwhile, the Justin Houston and Eric Berry contract talks simmered—cap guru Trip MacCracken was let go last month—and the team has spent the past couple years perilously close to the salary cap.
Others in the building saw signs of decisions becoming less collaborative, and more centered on Dorsey’s instincts. It also didn’t go unnoticed that Dorsey’s draft picks, like Fisher and Duvernay-Tardif, were the ones getting paid early. And the way the Jeremy Maclin release was handled—key members of the staff didn’t know until after it became public—didn’t help squash the internal whispering.
This isn’t to say there weren’t decisions that were made with a roaring consensus from the team’s football operation. One such call was the one to pursue Texas Tech quarterback Patrick Mahomes in the draft. The Chiefs moved aggressively to make it happen.
But too often, there were big moves made where scouts and coaches were left scratching their heads. It still bothers some close to Dorsey that Hunt caught wind of it, because there certainly weren’t many signs externally that the ax was about to drop. Some still maintain that it was right to keep these issues in-house, since they may have been fixable.
The trouble with that, of course, was the Chiefs were going to have to sign up for another half-decade with Dorsey. And in the end, that’s something that Hunt wasn’t going to do.
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- Tom
How about bring him in above Sneed as the VP of Football Operations and let a FOOTBALL man run the FOOTBALL side of things for once.
SteezyEndo
The Immaculate Exception
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How about bring him in above Sneed as the VP of Football Operations and let a FOOTBALL man run the FOOTBALL side of things for once.
Word....
Ram65
Legend
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How about bring him in above Sneed as the VP of Football Operations and let a FOOTBALL man run the FOOTBALL side of things for once.
No way. This guy not organized and as it says is more of a scout. Snead has things running smoothly.
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Rams still need a Director of Pro Player Personnel Dorsey would be great in that role.
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It's more apparent than ever evaluating O linemen is getting harder and the Rams aren't the only team striking out on to OL draft picks.
tomas
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Dorsey has been an abject failure.The four-year, $48 million extension with left tackle Eric Fisher in August 2016 - Dorsey still did the big contract, despite having a year left on Fisher’s rookie deal, and an option year after that.
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Dorsey has been an abject failure.The four-year, $48 million extension with left tackle Eric Fisher in August 2016 - Dorsey still did the big contract, despite having a year left on Fisher’s rookie deal, and an option year after that.
In GM role yes, but was very successful from 2000-2011 as director of college scouting for the Green Bay Packers...Rams still looking for somebody to run that side of things.
LesBaker
Mr. Savant
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They must be doing something right they have two guys who are first team all pro catching passes. And they went out and got Macklin when he was coming off a pro bowl year. He just got hurt a lot.
100% this I think.
And QB's too, and a lot has been written about it because of the style of play in college and the use of the spread formations.
Ram65
Legend
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If he would take the demotion. Looks like Hags have an inside track.
https://arrowheadaddict.com/2017/06/30/chiefs-rumors-john-dorsey-join-seahawks-front-office/
Chiefs rumors: John Dorsey could join Seahawks front office
by Matt Conner1 hour agoFollow @MattConnerAA
John Dorsey is himself a free agent these days, and the market for the former Kansas City Chiefs General Manager is an uncertain one. Depending on the stories being told (and believed) in NFL circles, Dorsey might soon find a spot within an existing group or wait until January to run a new front office of his own. John Clayton, NFL analyst, thinks it will be the former.
Clayton recently wrote that his best guess for a new home is the Seattle Seahawks, which would bring Dorsey back together with his old pal John Schneider, who is now the Seahawks GM. The pair share a long history in Green Bay.
The feeling around the NFL is the Chiefs might hire from within the organization to replace Dorsey. Don’t be surprised if he lands with the Seahawks in some capacity. He’s good friends with Schneider along with Oakland Raiders GM Reggie McKenzie. With the Chiefs paying him for the 2017 season, Dorsey would be a bargain to any team wanting to add him.
Perhaps Dorsey will use the money to take a paid vacation with his family, to get away from the game he knows so well to enjoy some rest and relaxation that’s a rarity in the life of an NFL executive. However, it’s also possible that a team will enjoy a fresh perspective on the books of another team. Dorsey could be an incredible asset for nearly any NFL team and the Seahawks would certainly do well to bring him in for the short or long term.
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- Dennis
He was one of the guys I thought would do well in an executive role, however, did not go so well in Kansas City. Oh well, the Chiefs are always an enigma.