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Casserly: "I rate Watkins ahead of Julio Jones"

Discussion in 'RAMS - NFL TALK' started by RFIP, Apr 11, 2014.

  1. Alan Well-Known Member

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    Good thinking 14!
     
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  2. RamFan503 Grill and Brew Master

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    The only problem I would see with going by college stats would be that you would then put several receivers ahead of Watkins in this draft, which clearly is not the case and if you compared him to say Stedman Baily from last year, you would come away thinking Watkins couldn't hold his jock - also something that would appear clearly untrue.
     
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  3. RamsFan14 Well-Known Member

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    I didn't say anything about stats, I'm talking about talking about prospects as a whole. Production, what they are good at, what they are weak at, intangibles, surrounding team, ext.
     
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  4. RFIP Well-Known Member

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    Which was the point from the get-go...at least until the thread was hi jacked.
     
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  5. RamsFan14 Well-Known Member

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    No need to get antsy man, I think people would listen to you a bit more if you played it a bit more cool. Personally I like a lot of your info and what you have to say, but you can't lose your cool, that's where you'll start losing people.
     
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  6. -X- I'm the dude, man.

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    I *was* talking about them as college prospects. Julio was always the more physical and taller receiver. Of course you can never project how they'll perform as professional athletes, but based on what they brought to the table in terms of tangibles, I'd still take Jones over Watkins if they were both coming out right now.
     
    #166
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  7. RamFan503 Grill and Brew Master

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    OK - That makes sense. It also makes sense being that Julio played in a very run heavy offense.

    Here's some of what they were saying about Julio Jones in college.

    Freshman -
    Sophomore -
    Junior -
    NFL.com's pre draft take -
    Easier to find Watkins pre-draft info so compare at will. Seems interesting that Watkins is compared to a mix of Torrey Smith and Percy Harvin while Jones was being compared to Michael Irvin and Larry Fitzgerald. Personally, I don't think Julio has reached anywhere near those comparisons as a pro yet but that's what they were saying about him back then.

    Not sure this really gets us anywhere - eh?

    I'd be cool with the Rams taking Watkins even though I have other preferences. I don't agree that he has the size and physicality that some others are seeing and therefore, I don't see him as a top 5 type WR. But I'm just a fan so there you go.
     
    #167
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  8. Zaphod Well-Known Member

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    I'm thinking teams would simply run up the middle. More likely that Long would play tackle I think.
     
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  9. jrry32 Well-Known Member

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    Well, no, not really. Unless RFIP legitimately believes there are no other WRs in this class that can play outside effectively and produce decently from day one.
     
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  10. jrry32 Well-Known Member

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    You keep reiterating this demand...have at it, my friend. Nobody is stopping you. ;)
     
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    Last edited: Apr 14, 2014
  11. jrry32 Well-Known Member

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    But, RF14, if you'd like a quick comparison of how I rated them as prospects, it would be (all numbers are out of 10):
    Height
    Julio - 8
    Watkins - 6

    Build
    Julio - 9
    Watkins - 8

    Speed
    Julio - 9
    Watkins - 9

    Hands
    Julio - 7.5
    Watkins - 8

    Route Running
    Julio - 6
    Watkins - 6

    YAC Ability
    Julio - 9
    Watkins - 8.5

    But this is a pretty simplistic comparison. As you can see, Julio comes out ahead in the overall ratings with 48.5 points to Watkins's 45.5
     
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  12. Memphis Ram Well-Known Member

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    Anything is possible, but there seem to be quite a few long time posters/draftniks (from other boards) here, including myself, who were extremely high on Julio Jones before he set foot in the NFL. In fact, outside of showing his physical skills via easily obtainable NFL footage (which I doubt were gained in the NFL), has anyone really compared Pre-Draft Watkins to NFL Jones? If the have, I've missed it, thus this seems like a bit of a strawman.
     
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  13. Memphis Ram Well-Known Member

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    Quite frankly, I truly believe most, if not all, were talking about them as college prospects.:confused:
     
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  14. Alan Well-Known Member

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    I'm not commenting about anyone's post but I have some knowledge about human nature and I doubt seriously that what Julio has done in the pros hasn't colored everyone else's opinion in this debate (except for your Memphis). It's just human nature IMO. It's like telling a jury to forget something that was said in the trial. Most people can't do it even if they tried. That's why lawyers sneek that stuff in even though they know the judge will tell the jury to ignore it. Appeals (or the judge declares a mistrial) by the defense have been won because upper courts have acknowledged this to be true.
     
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  15. ausmurp Well-Known Member

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    Wrong. Jones had question marks because he didn't put up great numbers in college, and he had some big drop issues, remember? He silenced the critics at the combine for the most part. Watkins has the numbers AND the combine to back him up. Remember Jones only eclipsed 1000 yds receiving in 2010 - he had 1133 yds and only 7 tds.

    As a prospect, before any NFL experience etc etc, Watkins is the better prospect. Go back and look if you don't beleive me.
     
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  16. RamFan503 Grill and Brew Master

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    This is what I was referring to and RamFan14 answered as well. You can't just look at stats. Otherwise you would have to have the opinion that Sted was far and away a better prospect coming out than Watkins. Something I think we can all agree he was not.

    I remember the hands issue being talked about with Jones but he also held the Alabama record in a couple receiving categories. That's a program with some big time history. So comparing stats from a receiver in a pass happy offense to those of a receiver from a run heavy offense, doesn't tell you much.

    Yes Jones had some question marks regarding his hands, but so does Watkins though to a slightly lesser degree. Jones clearly had the size/speed edge between the two and played against tougher competition. Jones also was graded out by NFL.com (for what it's worth) at a 8.48 while Sammy grades out at a 7.0. Jones had a better 40 time, bench, vertical, broad jump, shuttle, 3 cone, has longer arms, slightly bigger hands, has a taller/bigger body, etc... In fact, I can't find a tangible that Watkins tops Jones in besides college stats. And we've already discussed the problems with going by stats.

    Many assume Watkins will be all that based on stats and "intangibles". I watch the tape and see a very good receiver but not a top 5 of the draft receiver - especially when we have spent so much draft capital on the position of late.
     
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  17. Memphis Ram Well-Known Member

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    Makes sense. But, it would make more if the same opinions on Jones potential upside weren't expressed even before he was drafted.
     
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  18. Alan Well-Known Member

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    Thanks.

    No it wouldn't. All that does is strengthen the argument of those who hold that position. That's why I said I wasn't commenting about anyone's post. :)
     
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  19. RFIP Well-Known Member

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    So you're "watching the tape" with an eye on who we already drafted? And that is an unbiased evaluation?

    I, like most, watch his tape and see a super star. And I could give a rats ass less who we drafted in years past.
     
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  20. jrry32 Well-Known Member

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    Posted January 28, 2011 (before Julio was drafted...much less in the NFL)

    My opinion, while far from infallible, hasn't changed much at all on Julio since his final year in college. I loved the guy as a prospect. And I've loved what I've seen in the NFL. I'm not one to revise history when it comes to my opinions in hindsight.(unless I make a honest error)
     
    #180