Can we cut Barron while he's recovering from shoulder surgery?

[WestCoastRam]

Anyone with knowledge of the rules help? He had surgery, I suspect no team will be willing to trade for him at his contract with a shoulder recovering and not possibly able to pass a physical. Can we cut him though? I think we can but we have to pay him an injury settlement, yes? Does the surgery preclude us from moving on from him?

 

[Jacobarch]

I'm confused why some are so hell-bent on cutting a guy who was rated a top 5 ILB in the middle of the season before he got hurt . I think he was rated #2 against the pass and #5 against the run . There was one point when he was leading the team in tackles ahead of Ogletree.
I know he's a little undersized but our run problems weren't just on our LBs they were on our non existent NT as well .

 

[OldSchool]

I'm confused why some are so hell-bent on cutting a guy who was rated a top 5 ILB in the middle of the season before he got hurt . I think he was rated #2 against the pass and #5 against the run . There was one point when he was leading the team in tackles ahead of Ogletree.
I know he's a little undersized but our run problems weren't just on our LBs they were on our non existent NT as well .

When you give up 4.7 yards per carry and a bunch of 40+ yard runs you need to make changes to ILB and NT. Barron was not as good as PFF rates him vs the run. Couple that with this regime extended Tree last year when Fisher and Williams extended Barron it makes too much sense that Barron is gone. We’ll move Tree to the spot Barron played this year and put a run stopper next to him.

 

[WestCoastRam]

Count me in the column of not necessarily cutting Barron without a strong answer in his place. But I am curious if his injury and recovery prevents us from really moving on if we so desire.

I will say this about Barron, if his cap number was lower, I think we'd certainly be having a different conversation than what we've had these last few weeks. That has to be taken into account with the quibbles about his prowess.

 

[FrantikRam]

I wanted to keep him over Ogletree, but that ship sailed when we re-signed Tree in the middle of this year.

I am open to moving Tree outside. He was an effective blitzer and would be a nice complement to Quinn on the other side.

 

[shovelpass]

I am open to moving Tree outside. He was an effective blitzer and would be a nice complement to Quinn on the other side.

Tree isn't a 3-4 OLB. He was effective up the middle, where a rusher is not as expected, he sometimes went untouched or had an HB blocking him. He'd be going up against Tackles who are expecting him to blitz almost every down. Shedding blocks has been a known weakness for Tree.

 

[Jacobarch]

I don't think we cut Barron at this point . You guys act like we can just replace him with someone better no problem. It's not that easy. I'm thinking we keep him where he's at and draft and sign a true NT. He wasn't rated so high for nothing.

 

[1maGoh]

I wanted to keep him over Ogletree, but that ship sailed when we re-signed Tree in the middle of this year.

I am open to moving Tree outside. He was an effective blitzer and would be a nice complement to Quinn on the other side.

This mostly. I'm not sure about moving him outside. I'd definitely prefer Barron to Ogletree, but that's not an option now.

I think the drop off from Barron to Tree in Barron's role last year wouldn't be too bad, but we'd save money cutting Barron and getting a run oriented linebacker to come in.

 

[WestCoastRam]

Just out of curiosity, I think this may have been asked before, but is there anything precluding us from cutting him due to his shoulder surgery? Do we have to pay out an injury settlement? Is that problematic? Asking for OP.

 

[dieterbrock]

Just out of curiosity, I think this may have been asked before, but is there anything precluding us from cutting him due to his shoulder surgery? Do we have to pay out an injury settlement? Is that problematic? Asking for OP.

Following....
Its a good question

 

[FrantikRam]

Tree isn't a 3-4 OLB. He was effective up the middle, where a rusher is not as expected, he sometimes went untouched or had an HB blocking him. He'd be going up against Tackles who are expecting him to blitz almost every down. Shedding blocks has been a known weakness for Tree.

In a 3-4 the OLBs don't rush on every play. There were a lot of people saying that Quinn wasn't a 3-4 OLB before the year started - you play to the strengths of your best players, which Wade excels at. Quinn should not be in coverage, so he was rarely used that way. Tree should not rush straight into a tackle, so he would rarely be used that way.

 

[WestCoastRam]

In a 3-4 the OLBs don't rush on every play. There were a lot of people saying that Quinn wasn't a 3-4 OLB before the year started - you play to the strengths of your best players, which Wade excels at. Quinn should not be in coverage, so he was rarely used that way. Tree should not rush straight into a tackle, so he would rarely be used that way.

I think a really huge issue with a 3-4 OLB, and which - Tree could not handle - is the ability to set the edge as a run defender. Tree is simply not strong enough to set the edge and any runs to the outside on his side would be crazy huge gainers. It would be like playing a CB at ILB. It's a totally different skill-set than what he's capable of.

In regards to rushing the passer, Tree would have to show the ability to "turn the corner" and have the flexibility to "bend" around it. He has not shown the ability to do that nor do I think he's capable of it. Rushing from inside or outside the box - off the line of scrimmage - is a completely different skill set than rushing from the edge. OLBs more often than not take a traditional DE stance in the nickel and dime. Tree can not and could not do that.

 

[OldSchool]

I don't see anything in his contract containing an injury clause though sites like spotrac.com and overthecap.com rarely list stuff like that. That said I've seen several articles discussing his surgery and in them they talk about what the Rams could get from cutting Barron and in none of them do they mention consequences for doing so.

 

[JRobinson]

I don't think we cut Barron at this point . You guys act like we can just replace him with someone better no problem. It's not that easy. I'm thinking we keep him where he's at and draft and sign a true NT. He wasn't rated so high for nothing.

I don't know if we cut him or not. What I do know is this: He has a sizable cap hit this season. I don't get the sense that others on the board are acting like we can "just replace him with someone better; no problem". What I am reading is that others are open to letting him go and finding a replacement; period.

The reason Barron is rated so high is because he's a good tackler, and can play coverage really well. He is not a thumper in the middle that is going to overtake a guard and make a TFL. No, Barron wasn't the only reason why we sucked against the run overall last season either, but he was apart of it due to the fact the he could never get off blocks... like ever. Tree has the same issue, can't get off blocks in a 1v1 situation. So it would make sense that with Barron's cap hit, lack of ability to make TFLs, injuries piling up, and not being a force in the run game, that the Rams let him hit the market. Why not? You could always attempt to bring him back anyways. Don't get it twisted either, most on this forum like Barron a ton, like me. But too many things make sense to explore other options than to assume he's gonna remain a Ram.

 

[Adi]

I agree with keeping barron, I think adding a run stuffer in the middle would solve alot of our problems.

A big body that can eat up blocks would free up barron and tree and allow them to do what they do best . No one can cover tight ends and the middle of the field like these guys .

If barron goes , we better have a good replacement in mind . Tree is staying for a long time and I can't see why anyone would want to release Tree . He has been a great leader since he was drafted

 

[DaveFan'51]

In a 3-4 the OLBs don't rush on every play. There were a lot of people saying that Quinn wasn't a 3-4 OLB before the year started - you play to the strengths of your best players, which Wade excels at. Quinn should not be in coverage, so he was rarely used that way. Tree should not rush straight into a tackle, so he would rarely be used that way.

Considering the fact that " The New Defensive Way" these days is to use a Deep Defensive rotation this works perfectly! Keep Quinn and Barron for what they do Best! JMHO!

 

[bubbaramfan]

I'd like to hear some names for Barron's replacement. Just who is out there in FA that can do Barron's job better?

It still remains to be seen if Barron shoulder and knee are going to be fully healed by TC.

Littleton can't come close to covering like Barron can. Hager is no up grade either.

 

[OldSchool]

I'd like to hear some names for Barron's replacement. Just who is out there in FA that can do Barron's job better?

It still remains to be seen if Barron shoulder and knee are going to be fully healed by TC.

Littleton can't come close to covering like Barron can. Hager is no up grade either.

Alec Ogletree take Barrons spot and we can sign one of many free agents or draft somebody. Free agents that have been listed before are Todd Davis, Avery Williamson, Ramik Wilson (who started for KC when Derrick Johnson was injured) and Demario Davis. Not all exactly sexy house hold or all pro names but all good run defenders that we need.

Lots of draft picks led by Rashaan Evans, Mike McCray, Micah Kiser and Leighton Vander Esch. There are others including Jrry's guy Griffin as well.

We need a run defender at ILB, having 2 guys that are under sized is a huge part of the reason we gave up 4.7 YPC and so many huge runs. Nobody dislikes Barron. But if we don't fix our run defense adding a stud at CB like Peters with resigning Joyner and extending Donald won't make a difference with teams running up the gut on us at will.

 

[shovelpass]

In a 3-4 the OLBs don't rush on every play. There were a lot of people saying that Quinn wasn't a 3-4 OLB before the year started - you play to the strengths of your best players, which Wade excels at. Quinn should not be in coverage, so he was rarely used that way. Tree should not rush straight into a tackle, so he would rarely be used that way.

Quinn's transition to a 3-4 OLB is easier because in Wade's 34 scheme the OLB shares the same responsibilities as a 4-3 DE, only difference is that they seldom drop into coverage. Even changing the 34 scheme would still put Tree's weaknesses on display. He can't set the edge, and he can't shed blockers. He might not be used that way, but that's not going to stop the offense from running at his side . IMO, the best position for Tree is Barron's.