Bench Ray ray and Chance

[-X-]

Yes this thread had an inertia of name calling that was becoming a feeding frenzy,I agree as a whole this site isn't the place for that, but it's hard for me to think that some of the luminaries you mention might not have had some similar thoughts about the propensity for at least one of these guys to turn advantage into disadvantage at the worst possible moment and the lack of awareness /selfishness it requires to do that.

It's not that I care what our player-members and COO think about the incident (which wasn't advantageous since the PR made it to the 40 anyway). It's more about what they'd think of the members here who turn rabid over a simple mistake. I watched it again, and all Armstrong did was give Brad Smith a little shove because he came up barking in his ear like a douche. Because Smith decided to flop like a soccer player, all the refs saw it. Pushing and shoving after a play happens all the time, but players don't always flop like that. So while it was an ill-advised action on Armstrong's part, it wasn't even close to being egregious.

 

[Thordaddy]

It's not that I care what our player-members and COO think about the incident (which wasn't advantageous since the PR made it to the 40 anyway). It's more about what they'd think of the members here who turn rabid over a simple mistake. I watched it again, and all Armstrong did was give Brad Smith a little shove because he came up barking in his ear like a douche. Because Smith decided to flop like a soccer player, all the refs saw it. Pushing and shoving after a play happens all the time, but players don't always flop like that. So while it was an ill-advised action on Armstrong's part, it wasn't even close to being egregious.

I don't agree ,Smith may have flopped I haven't watched it again and probably won't till tonight, for me it's impossible to isolate that ,this is the first time I've said anything about Ray's immaturity, but it's been a pattern and it's costing yards for a team that can't afford it.
And FWIW Fish sorta affirms it so there is that, we are averaging 9 penalties a game w/o declines and yesterday was above that average so we're not getting better ,something has to be done

 

[DaveFan'51]

Where are all the posters who kept talking about how Armstrong was this star in waiting? I have been saying since training camp LAST YEAR, that he has all the athleticism in the world, but has the "look at me" mentality, and it continues to kill this team IF they cut him tomorrow, it wouldn't be soon enough for me.

Chase Reynolds, on the other hand, is a model of consistency, and this might be the first "bad" penalty since he has been here. He is the least of this teams issues.

I, for one, totally agree with both your points!!

 

[-X-]

I don't agree ,Smith may have flopped I haven't watched it again and probably won't till tonight, for me it's impossible to isolate that ,this is the first time I've said anything about Ray's immaturity, but it's been a pattern and it's costing yards for a team that can't afford it.
And FWIW Fish sorta affirms it so there is that, we are averaging 9 penalties a game w/o declines and yesterday was above that average so we're not getting better ,something has to be done

What is it you don't agree with? That he flopped? Or that it wasn't egregious?

 

[blue4]

It's not that I care what our player-members and COO think about the incident (which wasn't advantageous since the PR made it to the 40 anyway). It's more about what they'd think of the members here who turn rabid over a simple mistake. I watched it again, and all Armstrong did was give Brad Smith a little shove because he came up barking in his ear like a douche. Because Smith decided to flop like a soccer player, all the refs saw it. Pushing and shoving after a play happens all the time, but players don't always flop like that. So while it was an ill-advised action on Armstrong's part, it wasn't even close to being egregious.

I could care less about the egregious, it's the ill-advised that's the problem. So Smith talked some smack. Lord knows we don't do that. Point is, it was a stupid move when we absolutely didn't need it right in front of a ref. Anything else is just an excuse, especially in the case of a repeat offender. That's not bashing to me, that's reality. Quite honestly IMO its these type bone head plays that's the difference between 1-3 and 3-1.

 

[-X-]

I could care less about the egregious, it's the ill-advised that's the problem. So Smith talked some smack. Lord knows we don't do that. Point is, it was a stupid move when we absolutely didn't need it right in front of a ref. Anything else is just an excuse, especially in the case of a repeat offender. That's not bashing to me, that's reality. Quite honestly IMO its these type bone head plays that's the difference between 1-3 and 3-1.

And lots of players react to smack talk. Ours does it and he's an idiot, a moron, and needs to be cut. When Finnegan goaded Josh Morgan into a personal foul, Finnegan was a genius. Brad Smith goads Armstrong into pushing him, then flops like Shaq, and Armstrong's a moron. Call it an excuse if you want. That's the norm when someone decides to take the time to explain what happens. It's been done to me a thousand times.

What you didn't see me say was that it was acceptable.

 

[blue4]

And lots of players react to smack talk. Ours does it and he's an idiot, a moron, and needs to be cut. When Finnegan goaded Josh Morgan into a personal foul, Finnegan was a genius. Brad Smith goads Armstrong into pushing him, then flops like Shaq, and Armstrong's a moron. Call it an excuse if you want. That's the norm when someone decides to take the time to explain what happens. It's been done to me a thousand times.

What you didn't see me say was that it was acceptable.

I watched the play same as you. No need to "explain" anything, I think its an excuse. Morgan wasn't real smart biting on Finnegan, and RR wasn't smart biting on Smith. Plain and simple.

 

[-X-]

I watched the play same as you. No need to "explain" anything, I think its an excuse. Morgan wasn't real smart biting on Finnegan, and RR wasn't smart biting on Smith. Plain and simple.

I don't disagree with that. Though, I would like to know what the excuse is that you're referring to. I didn't offer one. Only an explanation.

 

[dhaab]

Did you hear me say that, or did you just say that for me?

I'm saying the thread, and all the comments I highlighted, are garbage.

Period.

Well, God forbid anyone actually criticize anyone on this 1-4 football team that is playing far below any expectations.

 

[BigRamFan]

Well, God forbid anyone actually criticize anyone on this 1-4 football team that is playing far below any expectations.

We're 1 - 3.

 

[dhaab]

We're 1 - 3.

Ha! Sorry, the losing is starting to screw up my memory.

 

[-X-]

Well, God forbid anyone actually criticize anyone on this 1-4 football team that is playing far below any expectations.

They're 1-3.

And I don't care if you criticize players. If you want it to be the norm on this board to toss out words like "idiot", "moron", and have posters call each other out, then we should just change the name to RamStalk ON DEMAND.

 

[blue4]

I don't disagree with that. Though, I would like to know what the excuse is that you're referring to. I didn't offer one. Only an explanation.

It's an excuse to try to downplay it or offer a rationale. I think penalty wise at this point you have to take that mentality. That's what I mean by excuse.

 

[DaveFan'51]

Well, God forbid anyone actually criticize anyone on this 1-4 football team that is playing far below any expectations.

1-3!

 

[-X-]

It's an excuse to try to downplay it or offer a rationale. I think penalty wise at this point you have to take that mentality. That's what I mean by excuse.

That's a bizarre point of view. So if Davis doesn't complete a pass for a potential TD, am I relegated to saying Davis sucks? Or can I expound on it and say it was because a defender took an inside swim move and got up in his face during the throw, because Wells (for example) didn't get proper positioning? And do I have to stop there, or can I say it was because the defense ran a stunt and caught him flat-footed because the play was designed for him to take the DT and not the DE?

If you don't like me saying Smith flopped (which he did), and think I'm excusing Armstrong for shoving him, then you're just wrong. All I said was that it wasn't egregious and not atypical of any player in this league. And I'm sorry if it offends your senses, but I'm going to continue to point things like that out. At no point did I say it was a valid reason for doing what he did. Nor did I once say that I excuse him for shoving Smith because he was being jawed. I only explained why the penalty happened. I mean, jeez. We saw the Panthers goad the whole Rams team into penalties last year, so it's not anything out of the ordinary. He got caught, and he should have just walked away anyway. I agree with that. What I don't agree with (as per my original objection to this thread) is that it's okay to call him a moron, or an idiot, or call out other posters for supporting the guy.

 

[cracengl]

They're 1-3.

And I don't care if you criticize players. If you want it to be the norm on this board to toss out words like "idiot", "moron", and have posters call each other out, then we should just change the name to RamStalk ON DEMAND.

Personally, I think the whole thing is a bit of an overreaction--3 pages now of disagreements. If I mess up, just point it out and I'll clean it up. To suggest my intent was to somehow make this place into a cesspool of personal insults is simply not true. I think my prior comments / contributions prove that I'm not a run of the mill RamStalk troll. I originally wrote what I wrote to describe how I felt about the play I saw--but if it was viewed poorly, then I'll make sure not to say things of a similar nature to offend anyone else. Simple. Easy. Done. That's the last thing I'm going to say about it.

 

[PowayRamFan]

Dammit, good points here on all sides, sucks for everyone in here to be as pissed as we are. If we turn the corner next week and beat the niners it will make things look a whole lot different...

 

[-X-]

To suggest my intent was to somehow make this place into a cesspool of personal insults is simply not true. I think my prior comments / contributions prove that I'm not a run of the mill RamStalk troll.

I don't think I was making that suggestion, and I apologize if it came off that way. Basically I just don't want this place to "look" like that place. I understand how infuriating some of those plays can be, and I (as just a regular poster) can certainly relate. But as someone who built this place to be 180 degrees different, I can get a little defensive of the vibe when it gets ugly. Again, my apologies if you think I was singling you out as a primary culprit. It's not you. It's me (man, if I had a nickel for every time I uttered that one... lol).

 

[cracengl]

But as someone who built this place to be 180 degrees different, I can get a little defensive of the vibe when it gets ugly.

I get it man. No big deal. I'd rather have someone around putting out potential fires than have the opposite. I mainly just wanted to make sure my initial intentions for my first post were clarified.

 

[blackbart]

Whether Smith flopped or not Armstrong has got to learn at some point that he is costing the team and it cannot be tolerated. Play hard errors because you are trying hard I'm ok with. Play to the whistle then take your butt off the field, don't talk don't listen don't do anything stupid. Let your play do the talking, if he has not learned this simple lesson in his first 2 years he is not going to.

 

[rams56]

Dammit, good points here on all sides, sucks for everyone in here to be as pissed as we are. If we turn the corner next week and beat the niners it will make things look a whole lot different...

Yes it will..I agree... ...we do need to turn that corner soon... with this team it is entirely possible that we finish in the playoffs.....or we finish 6 &10 if we don't turn that corner. ...all the mistakes that we made yesterday and yet we still had a chance to win at the end.....but we need to put our opponents out early. ...and keep them there..... I believe that the 40whiners...are just as physical on defense but much less talented. ...we can definitely do it.....go Rams.....

 

[blue4]

Whether Smith flopped or not Armstrong has got to learn at some point that he is costing the team and it cannot be tolerated. Play hard errors because you are trying hard I'm ok with. Play to the whistle then take your butt off the field, don't talk don't listen don't do anything stupid. Let your play do the talking, if he has not learned this simple lesson in his first 2 years he is not going to.

This is exactly what I was trying to say earlier.